Should Pakistan go with ICBMs after NATO strike

[PakShah]

Pakistan should obviously test an ICBM to ensure that no country invades Pakistan.

 

[anonymus]

U know if the ICBM is intercepted on the Atlantic ocean then the Tsunami will overrun the whole NY state, Washington DC, Masacussets , Virginia state . I mean the states touching the Atlantic ocean will be completely under water...If U are in NY then U will be under water and can't use ure internet, sorry for that..... Plues we will make sure that the speed of our ICBM will supercede the speed of the mid coarse interceptors so that they be litterally unstoppabe by any defence shield......Insha-Allah.....
Russia already made it , "their Missile Iskander" and we working on it.... We will test it when we will require it to show the world....Insha-Allah.......

This is zenith of stupidity.You think of nukes as an specter of Hades which destroys whatever it touches.You seriously underestimate power of natural forces.A cyclone has power of 10000 nuclear bombs.The tsunami which hit Indonesia had power of 23000 nuclear bombs and was able to cause massive devastation only in Indonesia which was 43 Km from epicenter of earthquake.You expect that a puny nuke falling in Atlantic would Submerge half of American Coastal states.It woud not even cause a ripple in Atlantic.

 

[Mytime]

The other nations, which use to develop the nuclear weapons, only have the purpose to defend themselves from the US aggression.

Pakistan developing an ICBM will indirectly benefit its arch nemesis India ...

It will antagonize US,Europe,Russia,Aus,Japan and rest of the world and leave it to further mercy and total dependency on China ,Though China has been great friend for Pakistan , total dependency on a single country while alienating from rest of the world just for an ICBM is a bad move

 

[anonymus]

Well, China is no superpower for sure, but China has nothing to lose if Pakistan has ICBM, but US is a different matter.

Well Chinatiger1986,If you Arm Pakistan with ICBMs,you are directly endangering the security of USA while violating MTCR.What if USA decide to pay back with same coin and it violates NPT and provides Nukes to Vietnam,Taiwan and other countries hostile to china,reognises tibet as independent country,provides missile and nuke tech to India and probably forms a Nato like organisation in south asia.

You have a lot to lose if you provide ICBM to any country.Your is a classical middle kingdom syndrome resulting from unresolved Inferiority complex(refer to a good psychology book on Alderian Psychology to undestand what inferiority complex means.most school boys here does not understand it's meaning and rant on basis of their preconceived notions).You think of US as a punching bag which cannot retaliate.

 

[anonymus]

I am sure someone with engineering background can comprehend what i am going to say. Pakistan has aleady produced 2 stage MRBM. Therefore, they have worked on separation of first stage from second stage, so second stage rocket can take the missile to intended destination with iits ordinance. Now having said, most of the ICBMs are three stage rockets. I am sure Pakistan can achieve that in short period of time. Pakistan developed 2 stage rockets in 10 years, and getting to ICBMs wont be a difficult task. Also, if you look at the timeline, Pakistan first came out of two stage MRBM in 1998, based on what i see, and understand, i am sure they must have worked on a prototype in lasts 13 years.

Anyone agrees or disagrees with this general timeline?

Transforming an IRBM into an ICBM is TECHNOLOGICALLY IMPOSSIBLE.The differention between IRBM and ICBM is not only that of Range but also of maximum altitude and speed attained.A parallel with rocket tech would help.

India has a space program which is dependent on PSLV and GSLV as launch Vehical.PSLV is a proven workhorse that is used to launch Sun synchronus satellites but it is incapable of placing a satellite in Geostationary orbit(with strap on motor it can and then also only satellites with low weight) because of low low thrust/weight ratio and impulse it provides.This problem is solved by using cryogenic engines which provides maximum Impulse.

Similarly to convert an IRBM into ICBM you could take one of the two paths.

1.Strap on a cryogenic engine on an IRBM.

This step is a technological impossibility for pakistan given the fact that pakistan has not even developed a basic rocket an Cryogenic tech is very complicated.Making Nukes is a walk in park compared to it.also you need to change initial stages also to accomodate it.Add to this the fact that cryogenic engine has to be primed in real time an under controlled conditions,any ICBM site with ICBM's would become a turkey shoot for it's enemies.

2.Change the propellants used in IRBM to increase it's specific Impulse .Well that is definition of a whole new missile system.

So by incorporating more stages and strap ons you could convert a 4500Km range missile into 5500Km range one but if you want to make a true ICBM with excess of 8000Km range you have to start from scratch.

Pakistan coming out with a true ICBM even in a decade is pure Fanboi fantasy as if such a covert program was there pakistan would have been testing the constituents of ICBM and the whole of the world would have known.such a program is not possible to hide.You have to test millions of parts with each single bolt having a specific tolerance limit which is true for any new technology ,the tell tale sign of many of which could not be hidden.Only way to at lest have a semblance of secrecy is to test portions of ICBM in Rocket launches which pakistan does not have.

 

[anonymus]

what if after this China provides nukes to cuba,bolivia,venezula,iran,syria and hamas???

The contention of my point was that Once China provides ICBM's to any Pakistan it has already caused a breach in American national security.The would certainly reply in a proportionate manner.If china further aggravates the situation there may be outright war.You logic is like saying that if a street goon beats a policeman he should not do anything as the street goon could beat him again.I dont think think that it would happen.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Well Chinatiger1986,If you Arm Pakistan with ICBMs,you are directly endangering the security of USA while violating MTCR.What if USA decide to pay back with same coin and it violates NPT and provides Nukes to Vietnam,Taiwan and other countries hostile to china,reognises tibet as independent country,provides missile and nuke tech to India and probably forms a Nato like organisation in south asia.

You have a lot to lose if you provide ICBM to any country.Your is a classical middle kingdom syndrome resulting from unresolved Inferiority complex(refer to a good psychology book on Alderian Psychology to undestand what inferiority complex means.most school boys here does not understand it's meaning and rant on basisi of their preconceived notions).You think of US as a punching bag which cannot retaliate.

Don't worry for us, DF-31A will come out with a different name in Pakistan.

We did help Pakistan in its early atomic bomb test, and what did the US ever retaliate for this act?

 

[anonymus]

breach?


we all know who sold nukes to israel.....grow up son and stop buttering americans.

america has aggravated everything so far on this globe.....why dosent harame obama and NATO take action against illegal israeli settlements?why not no fly zone over occupied kashmir but libya??

Sold Nukes to Israel.I would seriously contest that assertion on following grounds
1.Israel is not a technologically backward country and could easily manage to get nukes on its own so could japan,taiwan,germany,sweden and numerous other countries.The question is that of will and not technical competence.You could manufacture a nucler bomb in you home if you somehow manage to get your hands on 80Kg of HEU.This is the precise reason that America is going ballastic over Iran enriching Uranium as once it has Enriched Uranium it could assemble a primitive nuclear bomb in few days thoug it cant be mounted on a missile an thus practically unusable. US does not need to provide assistance to Israel.The only help it provided was to turn a blind eye towards their effort like they did in case of British and French.And for your Info Israel got plutonium for it's nukes from a French Reactor(Dimona).

2.No sensible country provides strategic weapon knowledge even to it's closest allies.Today's allies could turn into tommorow's enemies.Probably this would help
Jonathan Pollard - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
This is the same reason why US is not providing F-22 to Japan.You should have understood it but wait you are a false flagger as the slur you used in your post is a south asian one.You should be careful while doing false flag operation as these mistake blow of your cover

 

[fast and furious]

son i am a Pakistani but living in japan.........apply your mind somewhere else....you indians are only good in buttering and stealing Pakistani history.

obama is a harame and i repeat it ...cause he dosent has any morals....he should enforce a no fly zone over occupied kashmir just like libya if he is an honest man.

Cant fight your own battles.eh .
Comparing Libya and India.
Go figure.

 

[Najam Khan]

Why would Pakistan create more fronts for itself when its plate is already full? A Pakistani ICBM will give very wrong signals to some significant countries in Europe and Middle East and it can be potentially counter productive.

So, in my opinion their is no point of Pakistan jumping in this race...India will test Agni-5 ICBM in Feb 2012, their objective is to counter China...Pakistan's deterrence posture is India specific...investing more resources in enhancing available platforms will be a good idea rather than distributing funds, time and energy on an entirely new project.

 

[Jango]

You don't need ICBM's to strike India, every other, and realistically, we have no other adversary in the world. So , in short, no.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

You don't need ICBM's to strike India, every other, and realistically, we have no other adversary in the world. So , in short, no.

Some Indian posters here always speak on the behalf of US.

 

[DARKY]

Well, the US has ICBM's, Russia/England/China etc all have ICBM's.....similarly we can have ICBM's but not to threaten our friends, only to threaten our enemies and the US is a close ally

If US is a close ally which enemy of yours is from some other continent ??

 

[Last Hope]

We should stretch out muscles by testing ICBM Tipu/Taimur.

The insiders say Ghauri III is ready and kept in arsenal but due to international pressures, it's not being tested. That can be an option too.

 

[Mytime]

Transforming an IRBM into an ICBM is TECHNOLOGICALLY IMPOSSIBLE.The differention between IRBM and ICBM is not only that of Range but also of maximum altitude and speed attained.A parallel with rocket tech would help.

India has a space program which is dependent on PSLV and GSLV as launch Vehical.PSLV is a proven workhorse that is used to launch Sun synchronus satellites but it is incapable of placing a satellite in Geostationary orbit(with strap on motor it can and then also only satellites with low weight) because of low low thrust/weight ratio and impulse it provides.This problem is solved by using cryogenic engines which provides maximum Impulse.

Similarly to convert an IRBM into ICBM you could take one of the two paths.

1.Strap on a cryogenic engine on an IRBM.

This step is a technological impossibility for pakistan given the fact that pakistan has not even developed a basic rocket an Cryogenic tech is very complicated.Making Nukes is a walk in park compared to it.also you need to change initial stages also to accomodate it.Add to this the fact that cryogenic engine has to be primed in real time an under controlled conditions,any ICBM site with ICBM's would become a turkey shoot for it's enemies.

2.Change the propellants used in IRBM to increase it's specific Impulse .Well that is definition of a whole new missile system.

So by incorporating more stages and strap ons you could convert a 4500Km range missile into 5500Km range one but if you want to make a true ICBM with excess of 8000Km range you have to start from scratch.

Pakistan coming out with a true ICBM even in a decade is pure Fanboi fantasy as if such a covert program was there pakistan would have been testing the constituents of ICBM and the whole of the world would have known.such a program is not possible to hide.You have to test millions of parts with each single bolt having a specific tolerance limit which is true for any new technology ,the tell tale sign of many of which could not be hidden.Only way to at lest have a semblance of secrecy is to test portions of ICBM in Rocket launches which pakistan does not have.

But says who that Pak has to do everything on their own or from the scratch.. they can get help as they have got in the past , if you know what i mean