Shenyang J-15 aircraft carrier-based aircraft

[TEXAS BATTLESTAR]

Something has to already be there to reverse engineer it also...so not buying it.

(PS where in Texas are you?)

Never the less it still takes pretty good talent and skills to replicate something with little or nothing to guide with. I live in the Houston area.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Do you guys know when Russia gonna broadcast a live footage of the test trial of Bulava?

 

[rcrmj]

This work requires tremendous mental and physical costs. This is the Russian way.
The Chinese way is (no matter how much they themselves are not comforted by beautiful terms) a solid backup and attempt to improve. Moreover, attempts to reduce only the improvements to the capabilities of its industrial base.
Conclusion. Russia will always be ahead in scientific research. China will be able to create only that it will others..

first of all, its hard to understand what you wrote, but english is not our first language so it takes courage to making posts in english.

secondly your vague assertion of how Russia is ahead of China in science and technology is goundless but full of past Soviet propaganda.

The Internationl Patent Cooperation Treaty Office (PCT) stated in terms of patent grands for innovation, China recieved over 12,000 grands from PCT in 2010, whereas Russia just recieved merely over 800 of them. And PCT is the only internationally recognized body to judge any new technologies and science theories are categorized as innovative.

So I strongly reckon you to dig some real figures before coming out your assertion`!

 

[HROBOS]

Bulava you say. You mean that POS that has failed half of its test firings while recently 6 JL 2s were launched successfully in a single test. Yes impressive indeed.

The missile has been specifically designed for Russia's new Borey class nuclear submarines.
Yury Solomonov, the designer of the troubled Bulava ballistic missile, said that the poor state of the Russian defense industry was the main cause of the weapon's failed test launches.

Solomonov resigned from his post as general director of the Moscow Institute of Thermal Technology (MITT) in July 2009 after a series of unsuccessful Bulava tests, but retained his post as general designer of the missile.

"I can say in earnest that none of the design solutions have been changed as a result of the tests. The problems occur in the links of the design-technology-production chain," Solomonov said in an interview with the Izvestia newspaper published on Tuesday.

"Sometimes [the problem] is poor-quality materials, sometimes it is the lack of necessary equipment to exclude the 'human' factor in production, sometimes it is inefficient quality control," he said.

The designer complained that the Russian industry is unable to provide Bulava manufacturers with at least 50 of the necessary components for production of the weapon. This forces designers to search for alternative solutions, seriously complicating the testing process.

The Bulava (SS-NX-30) is a three-stage liquid and solid propellant submarine-launched ballistic missile (SLBM). It carries up to ten MIRV warheads and has a range of over 8,000 kilometers (5,000 miles).

The missile has been specifically designed for Russia's new Borey class nuclear submarines.

Only five of 12 Bulava test launches from the Dmitry Donskoy sub have been officially reported as successful. The future development of Bulava has been questioned by some lawmakers and defense industry officials who suggest that the Russian Navy should keep using the more reliable Sineva SLBM.

The RSM-54 Sineva (SS-N-23 Skiff) is a liquid-propellant SLBM designed for Delta IV class submarines that can carry up to 16 missiles each.

Solomonov questioned the viability of these statements saying the two missiles were incomparable both in terms of technology and performance characteristics.

A special investigation commission is expected to announce on May 30 the official results of a probe into the Bulava failures.

The Russian military has insisted that there is no alternative to the Bulava and pledged to continue testing the missile until it is ready to be deployed with the Navy. At least four new test launches of the missile have been planned for the end of June.

Solomonov vowed in the interview to continue work on the Bulava until it shows stable performance and is ready to join Russia's nuclear triad.

News.Az - Bulava missile designer blames industry for test failures

Can't even manufacture all the parts of a ballistic missile anymore. Absolutely pathetic.

As for Russia always being ahead. You're behind in everything besides a few niche military fields.



If you can't write coherent English then don't bother coming to a English forum. Its just freaking embarrassing. All I can say is that Russians still think its the Soviet days when people still gave a crap on whatever notions you had.

Now find the information on the design and operation of the first serial Su24.
Then use the brain, and understand why I have set, and Su24 Bullavu together.
All the evidence shows you just what I said earlier. Difficult to design a much easier to copy.
On account of errors in the text. I have said before that to learn another foreign language. I use translators errors are possible. Please accept my apologies. Thank you for reminding me. The Chinese are known polyglots. Trading on Moscow markets ignorance of the Russian language does not bother them particularly.
Clarified where living or working in the moment. In a happy China or abroad. Even in Stalin's attitude towards people in the USSR was better than now in China.
Before I provide documents on the Stalin era. Take the trouble to analyze his material with the amendment to the civil war, inter-party struggle. You can also look for specific regions.
If now Russian forced to live like the Chinese. Would not pass and three months as we have changed the government. If the Russian think that live is bad. It does not follow that (satisfied with their life) Chinese are in the best economic conditions. As I said earlier. The main difference in the social sphere. Different queries.
Of Chinese nationalism. You have answered this question. Complete lack of self-criticism + total disregard for other people's opinions. What reaction are you waiting for behaving this way?

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Now find the information on the design and operation of the first serial Su24.
Then use the brain, and understand why I have set, and Su24 Bullavu together.
All the evidence shows you just what I said earlier. Difficult to design a much easier to copy.
On account of errors in the text. I have said before that to learn another foreign language. I use translators errors are possible. Please accept my apologies. Thank you for reminding me. The Chinese are known polyglots. Trading on Moscow markets ignorance of the Russian language does not bother them particularly.
Clarified where living or working in the moment. In a happy China or abroad. Even in Stalin's attitude towards people in the USSR was better than now in China.
Before I provide documents on the Stalin era. Take the trouble to analyze his material with the amendment to the civil war, inter-party struggle. You can also look for specific regions.
If now Russian forced to live like the Chinese. Would not pass and three months as we have changed the government. If the Russian think that live is bad. It does not follow that (satisfied with their life) Chinese are in the best economic conditions. As I said earlier. The main difference in the social sphere. Different queries.
Of Chinese nationalism. You have answered this question. Complete lack of self-criticism + total disregard for other people's opinions. What reaction are you waiting for behaving this way?

Look pal. You are being ridiculous.

Copy what? The JL 2 is a successful 2 stage SLBM that has a 4,000 Km range advantage in its latest mod over the Bulava. And guess what we don't need foreign components for it like you do. It also doesn't have the same problems the Bulava keeps on having.

You have got to be kidding me. Fine keep living in happy fantasy land where Stalin era Russia is in a better situation in China today. Who am I to judge.

Of Soviet Mindset Russians: Get with the F**king times.

 

[ChineseTiger1986]

Look pal. You are being ridiculous.

Copy what? The JL 2 is a successful 2 stage SLBM that has a 4,000 Km range advantage in its latest mod over the Bulava. And guess what we don't need foreign components for it like you do. It also doesn't have the same problems the Bulava keeps on having.

You have got to be kidding me. Fine keep living in happy fantasy land where Stalin era Russia is in a better situation in China today. Who am I to judge.

Of Soviet Mindset Russians: Get with the F**king times.

It seems that losing Ukraine and Kazakhstan is a major loss for Russia.

Russia needs to quickly reunify with these two nations in order to recreate the glory of the Soviet era.

 

[ptldM3]

Unofficial troll of these boards: ptldM3

Right, and how many times have I been banned and suspended? Zero, I can't say the same for many Chinese members in this threads, it's very embarrassing considering it's a Pakistani forum. I also do not think I would have as many thanks as I have for being a troll.

And please do go back and read the entire thread, as usual it was Chinese members that started it. Guys like below_freezing and company go into every thread and start taking cheap shots at Russia, yet I’m the troll.

When you are dead poor or quasi bankrupt for more than ten years, everything in your overall ability to research and produce will suffer greatly in every single field, civilian or military. If that's too hard to understand, then you shouldn't be surprised at the current state you are in.

Why doesn't F-22 resemble to the F-15 or F-16 physically? Lockheed's annualR&D budget probably exceeds the entire Russian aviation industry's for the past years. Look at that most recent Su-27 "clone" that you are so proud of.

The F-22, F-15 and F-16 are built by three different companies you fool only recently has there been mergers. It's also funny that you think that the SU-27 and pak-fa are a 'clone' the two aircraft share a radically different design and geometry, the only similarities the two aircraft share is the widely spaced engines, but in that cases than the F-22 is a copy of the F-15 because both aircraft have similarly situated engines. The only other similarity, very naive people see between the pak-fa and SU-27 is the intakes, and even than they are radically different. The SU-27's intakes were situated below the fuselage while the pak-fa's intakes are a hybrid mix, of a side a lower fuselage configuration; and the intakes geometry is completely different.

You realize we are talking about Intercontinental SLBM launches right? It has too exit the atmosphere and travel close to 10,000 kilometers. If there was any failures US, and especially Russians would have monitored the entire thing and gloated all over it. So please spare me the typical BS excuses. Ironically you say that everything Russia does is on its own, and does not take shortcuts.

From the chief designer of the Baluva who subsequently quit.

The designer complained that the Russian industry is unable to provide Bulava manufacturers with at least 50 of the necessary components for production of the weapon.

So I wonder where those 50 necessary components came from. Out of your wet dreams?

Sometimes [the problem] is poor-quality materials, sometimes it is the lack of necessary equipment to exclude the 'human' factor in production, sometimes it is inefficient quality control," he said.

Yeah no short cuts at all.

There is nothing that radical in the Baluva that would force this many failures and is the primary fault of shortcuts, and poor quality control.

Russia does everything on its own and buys nothing? What is the Mistral class then? A yacht.

Who said that a failed launch would ever reach 10,000 km? And are you sure that the US or Russian would gloat over a failed launch? In the real world things aren’t done that way, if and when Russia or the US monitor China or visa versa neither will be foolish enough to divulge information about a failed test. Most failures are known because they are either acknowledged by military officials or civilians with cameras, other times they are declassified. When submarines, reconnaissance aircraft, satellite, or informants obtain information about a failure or any information, for that matter they keep quiet so that they can keep obtaining valuable information. The last thing you want to do is let the other side know you are watching them. If this happens you jeopardize your submarines positions, informants and so on. Further, the longer you observe enemy ICBM's, submarines or whatever, the more likely you will gather valuable information on frequencies, unique eckos and so fourth.

Do you know who John Anthony Walker is? He was a US Naval communications expert that spied for the Soviet Union, I know the man that was one of the main investigative agent in that case. I know a thing or two about what I’m talking, so it is you that needs to stop the BS.

As for the Mistral, it's an over glorified cargo ship meant for quick troop and personnel movement, building something similar is not a problem, the problem is the years that it takes to design, set up logistics, ports, construct and commission such a vessel. And purchasing the mistral is certainly not the same as purchasing components for countless projects or asking for design assistance.

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Who said that a failed launch would ever reach 10,000 km? And are you sure that the US or Russian would gloat over a failed launch? In the real world things aren’t done that way, if and when Russia or the US monitor China or visa versa neither will be foolish enough to divulge information about a failed test. Most failures are known because they are either acknowledged by military officials or civilians with cameras, other times they are declassified. When submarines, reconnaissance aircraft, satellite, or informants obtain information about a failure or any information, for that matter they keep quiet so that they can keep obtaining valuable information. The last thing you want to do is let the other side know you are watching them. If this happens you jeopardize your submarines positions, informants and so on. Further, the longer you observe enemy ICBM's, submarines or whatever, the more likely you will gather valuable information on frequencies, unique eckos and so fourth.

The US can track the entire journey of an ballistic missile launch. I don't know if thats the same case for Russia. There is no hiding it, and their is no point in doing so. Only strategic analysis matters and if they know you have failures there is no point in saying it was a success. Have you any response to the quotes by the chief designer of the Bulava?

Do you know who John Anthony Walker is? He was a US Naval communications expert that spied for the Soviet Union, I know the man that was one of the main investigative agent in that case. I know a thing or two about what I’m talking, so it is you that needs to stop the BS.

What do spies have to do with something completely capable of being tracked from satellites?

As for the Mistral, it's an over glorified cargo ship meant for quick troop and personnel movement, building something similar is not a problem, the problem is the years that it takes to design, set up logistics, ports, construct and commission such a vessel. And purchasing the mistral is certainly not the same as purchasing components for countless projects or asking for design assistance.

LOL at the not so creative excuses. When we do it we are inferior and are decades behind, but when you do it its because you didn't feel like it.

 

[Obambam]

I did not want to seem rude.
However, it is necessary.
It seems on the success of the Chinese economy have some problems with the external perception.
Cheap labor? Itself is not a shame? Or work for peanuts outside the Chinese Dream?
Tell us how valuable is better achieved an economic miracle? Share the successes of universal health insurance or compulsory pensions. All the economic achievements are due to the social obligations. The whole economy is like a pyramid. Beating the head of propaganda and attractive figures of the second economy in the world to the Chinese authorities can only delay the inevitable. As soon as the Chinese people want to eat well, dress, have a Social Security or have a decent salary pyramid collapses.

The difference between us is not in the mind or the physical size of the brain. The difference in the social environment.

At the expense of copies. A typical example is Bulava or Su 24. People sit and develop a new system. A whole new inherent risks and possible tragedies and setbacks. This work requires tremendous mental and physical costs. This is the Russian way.
The Chinese way is (no matter how much they themselves are not comforted by beautiful terms) a solid backup and attempt to improve. Moreover, attempts to reduce only the improvements to the capabilities of its industrial base.
Conclusion. Russia will always be ahead in scientific research. China will be able to create only that it will others.

On account of the statements about nationalism. I have the notion of Chinese nationalism and an inferiority complex. I eat a lot, what to say but so far I'm holding back. For a particularly zealous. All possible accusations and insults addressed to me for me indifferent. However, they may well show your intelligence. So you can not particularly shy. I'm curious.

I respect and love the technologies our Russian brothers have, but the sad fact is - Nothing in the world is certain. Take for example the Germans. They were ahead of everyone during WWII, but they are no longer the leader anymore. It is all about R&D and exposure to newly found materials and technologies. The fact of the matter is, money plays the most important role and China has plenty of that right now.

p.s. People shouldn't take trolls too seriously.

 

[HROBOS]

Everyone talks about Bulavu. Bulava and Su24 are present together is not just. Who will answer the question why? Lead out of context quotes and numbers are not difficult. More difficult to force yourself to think.

 

[teddy]

Somebody took a photo that a steam catapult is being installed on varyag. May be it is specially use for launching AWECS!

 

[tanlixiang28776]

Everyone talks about Bulavu. Bulava and Su24 are present together is not just. Who will answer the question why? Lead out of context quotes and numbers are not difficult. More difficult to force yourself to think.

Talking about Bulava because you brought it up as a innovation of Russia, and that China needs to catch up. Unfortunately for you the reality is the other way around.

 

[HROBOS]

Talking about Bulava because you brought it up as a innovation of Russia, and that China needs to catch up. Unfortunately for you the reality is the other way around.

You guessed wrong. Different sense of comparison. The answer is simple.

 

[localoca]

Right,.

is this troll still insisting the Pakfa T-50 its a 5th gen?

you don´t have to be so dumb to understand the T-50 its inferior to the J-20

just let me say this to ptldM3: If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, we have at least to consider the possibility that we have a small aquatic bird of the family anatidae on our hands

you can swap duck for 4th gen fighter when talking about T-50, or 5th gen when talking about the J-20

 

[RayBan]

is this troll still insisting the Pakfa T-50 its a 5th gen?

you don´t have to be so dumb to understand the T-50 its inferior to the J-20

just let me say this to ptldM3: If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, we have at least to consider the possibility that we have a small aquatic bird of the family anatidae on our hands

you can swap duck for 4th gen fighter when talking about T-50, or 5th gen when talking about the J-20

hmmm does your jxx20, or whatever that means, fly on battery power or you have to wind the key? and importantly will it wash my clothes? you know Chinese are good at cheap electronic stuff..
.
.
he he enough of jokes, on topic for the above person, how can you compare and rate two prototypes which are just at the initial stage? do you have any RCS comparison data of both the planes ? don't lose your feet on the ground while sweeping the skies