Sensitive Data of Indian Navy’s Scorpene Class Submarines Leaked

[PARIKRAMA]

http://pib.nic.in/newsite/PrintRelease.aspx?relid=149220

 

[Indrajit]

Assuming the Worst is Ak Anthony territory - and we ended up with the Infamous Agustawestland so called Scam. - Its been 4 year ? anything? just alot of finger pointing and blaming game and an air chief marshal name being dragged through the dirt + 3 frames with Advance systems collecting enough dirt to make a burial!.

The Augusta Westland deal was soaked in corruption & even the Italians agreed on that, odd to see you use that. Nothing so-called about that scam.

No one here is just dismissing this lighty NOR are we hair pulling for the sake of it. People also fail to forget that the subsystems of any sub can be modified anytime. Only One hull is complete and in sea trials and based on those very trials, what snags and defects or positives (sorry lost of thought) can be incorporated, in the rest of it.

The leak is still a serious matter, I was merely pointing out that what is publicly known of the leak is not necessarily the full extent of the damage. This is not about what can be done to mitigate the known/unknown damage, it is with reference that we now have a serious issue at hand with plenty for DCNS to answer and MoD has a major issue with what to do with this.

 

[thesolar65]

As a civilian all these sounds like sanskrit to me. If I were Chinese and Pakistani and with these 22000 pages with me, my blood pressure would have risen to higher level. What now? what am I going to do with these? What if the adversary does not have any of these specification? My entire effort will be down the drain. Just like India, India's adversaries who have got those papers must be feeling the tension also.

The best way to test it : Make a trip to SCS without any announcement to a Vietnam port, take pictures and come back and make a trip to Karachi harbour also!!

 

[GuardianRED]

The Augusta Westland deal was soaked in corruption & even the Italians agreed on that, odd to see you use that. Nothing so-called about that scam.

Like i said - so called scam with no one attested or charged with plenty of finger pointing and mud faced. For 4 years and counting! (Bet it will be 5 years soon - who is in?)

The Italians arrested those people on corruption and money embezzlement on a no. of projects (NOT just the Indian Deal). They themselves haven't proved ANY concrete money Links to any INDIAN! lets along any politician! or don't u think they will splash this all over the news and somebody would be arrested no?

But hey , we all have faith in our Indian Agencies!

 

[Ankit Kumar 002]

As a civilian all these sounds like sanskrit to me. If I were Chinese and Pakistani and with these 22000 pages with me, my blood pressure would have risen to higher level. What now? what am I going to do with these? What if the adversary does not have any of these specification? My entire effort will be down the drain. Just like India, India's adversaries who have got those papers must be feeling the tension also.

The best way to test it : Make a trip to SCS without any announcement to a Vietnam port, take pictures and come back and make a trip to Karachi harbour also!!

If only that was possible , the present Anthony part 2 means our ships are without Helicopters, our half of already depleted submarine fleet is under repairs , and rest are extensively being used for more important duties.

 

[Indrajit]

Like i said - so called scam with no one attested or charged with plenty of finger pointing and mud faced. For 4 years and counting! (Bet it will be 5 years soon - who is in?)

The Italians arrested those people on corruption and money embezzlement on a no. of projects (NOT just the Indian Deal). They themselves haven't proved ANY concrete money Links to any INDIAN! lets along any politician! or don't u think they will splash this all over the news and somebody would be arrested no?

But hey , we all have faith in our Indian Agencies!

Actually the Italians not only arrested but sentenced the top officials of Finmeccanica to jail precisely because of the Indian contract.

Finmeccanica’s ex-boss jailed for graft in Indian chopper deal

• PTI, Milan/New Delhi
  |
• Updated: Apr 09, 2016 00:41 IST

Italian defence and aerospace major Finmeccanica’s former chief Giuseppe Orsi has been sentenced by the Milan appeals court to 4.5 years in jail for false accounting and corruption over the sale of 12 VVIP choppers to India for Rs 3,600 crore.

In the ruling, which overtured a previous court order of 2014, Bruno Spagnolini, the former CEO of Finmeccanica’s helicopter subsidiary AgustaWestland, was also handed a four-year prison term by the court yesterday.

The court found both guilty of corruption in relation to the sale of 12 helicopters to the Indian government and sentenced Orsi to a jail term of four and a half years, Italian news agency ANSA reported.

There was no way for this deal to stand. If the government had not scrapped it, the CAG would have roasted the government over hot coals. The Italian court convicted them for paying money on the Indian contract, whether you are able to prove who exactly got it here or not doesn't change the issue, they would not have paid the Chinese for the Indian contract.

 

[Ankit Kumar 002]

https://twitter.com/x/status/768728157356691456

 

[egodoc222]

NO.
If a possible opponent knows how discreet your subs are, it will be less adventurous.


how deep is your reflection .....
it is sad.

What's sad is blatant negligence and security failure of dcns!!

 

[GuardianRED]

Actually the Italians not only arrested but sentenced the top officials of Finmeccanica to jail precisely because of the Indian contract.



There was no way for this deal to stand. If the government had not scrapped it, the CAG would have roasted the government over hot coals. The Italian court convicted them for paying money on the Indian contract, whether you are able to prove who exactly got it here or not doesn't change the issue, they would not have paid the Chinese for the Indian contract.

Paying the Indian Contact? which they themselves haven't proved yet! 4 yrs running!

+ we have seen the cancelling the contract has both us excellent rewards of re-tendering and cancelling any deal with any Italian company indefinitely ( Case and point the Black shark torpedo fiasco , though solved is still a long delay)

let end it here - getting out of topic!

 

[egodoc222]

You wish.


How exactly? Other than, "becasue France"?


Indians and their dramatic tendancies....


@PARIKRAMA thanks for the detailed updates bro, you are a real asset. I wish you could become India's single source for defence related news, the hacks that try to pass for "defence journalists" in India are not just dissapointingly bad but downright dangerous in these kind of situations where one needs to be very technically minded and able to understand a nuanced picture.

@Vergennes @Taygibay @Picdelamirand-oil @BON PLAN eagerly awaiting the French Govt/DCNS response to this (beyond mere words). This IS economic warfare and we all know the French aren't ones to take such provocation lightly. There needs to be heads rolling...

Why the generalisation?
In this case being dramatic is justified!!
Leak of sensitive documents is no small issue...
We don't know what other files got leaked?
What if they contain performance parameters or even worse what if they contain acoustic signatures of the sub?

 

[PARIKRAMA]

Mismatch between leaked Scorpene info and specification model, say government sources

Top government sources say there is a mismatch between the papers available in public domain and the specification manual on which the boats are being made.
New Delhi, August 25, 2016 | UPDATED 14:32 IST

Primary analysis of the Navy on the Scorpene submarine information leak indicates that there is a mismatch between the papers available in public domain and the specification manual on which the boats are being made, top government sources said.

The primary analysis report has been shared with Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar. Claims have been made that 22,400 papers were leaked but actually only few papers are available in the open domain.

Though sources confirm that the leaked papers have similarity to one of the submarine versions discussed with the French naval contractor DCNS, many specifications were changed in the final version.

However, to avoid any chance, the Ministry of Defence has asked Navy to seek a detailed report on the leaked papers from DCNS. The matter will be taken up with DCNS through Ministry of External Affairs, the sources said.

Meanwhile, the Mazagon Dock Limited (MDL), where the Scorpene submarines are being built, today said the data leak did not take place from its end and that it was assisting the Navy in the probe.

A day after the data leak on the capabilities of six highly advanced submarines being built for the Indian Navy in Mumbai in collaboration with a French company came to light, an MDL official said there were stringent norms at MDL on data security.

"We are helping Navy in the probe. We are certain the data leak was not from our side," an MDL official said.

Reacting to reports of the massive data leak, he added, "It needs to be verified if the leaked documents are authentic."

There are stringent norms at MDL on data security, the official said. MDL head Rear Admiral Rahul Shrawat was not available for comments.

French shipbuilder DCNS has provided technology for the Rs 23,562-crore project.

MDL is scheduled to deliver the first of the six submarines to the Indian Navy early next year and the remaining are likely to be delivered by 2020.

According to media reports, the documents running into 22,400 pages detail the combat capabilities of French-designed Scorpene-class submarines.

The combat capability of the scorpene submarines being built at Mazagon dock at a cost of USD 3.5 billion by French shipbuilder DCNS, went public when an Australian newspaper, "The Australian", put the details on the website.

Parrikar had yesterday ordered the Navy Chief to go into the "entire issue". A report is also being sought from DCNS.

"What I understand is there is a hacking. So we will find out all this," Parrikar had said.

(With inputs from PTI)

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/story/...arrikar-government-sources-navy/1/748502.html

@Abingdonboy @Nilgiri @anant_s @Vergennes @Ankit Kumar 002
Good we have involved local MIC to make subsystems in Scorpene and thus its a far more customised edition than plain vanilla one..

Its inline with whatever i have posted before.. Thats why whatever we build in India it should be custom edition with technology transfer and localisation.

Any plain vanilla product can be compromised but with TOT and local MIC to customize the product as a whole, we can bring small, significant and incremental changes which makes it a whole new system and enables us to have some extra safety cushion against cyber and economical espionage.

 

[GuardianRED]

Why the generalisation?
In this case being dramatic is justified!!
Leak of sensitive documents is no small issue...
We don't know what other files got leaked?
What if they contain performance parameters or even worse what if they contain acoustic signatures of the sub?

"acoustic signatures" - example of us indians Being Dramatic!

How can acoustic signatures of sub be leaked EVEN before the sub is finished being built or haven't had sea trails

 

[Nilgiri]

Why the generalisation?
In this case being dramatic is justified!!
Leak of sensitive documents is no small issue...
We don't know what other files got leaked?
What if they contain performance parameters or even worse what if they contain acoustic signatures of the sub?

Son, do you work in defence industry?

 

[PARIKRAMA]

http://www.livefistdefence.com/2016/08/3-reasons-why-scorpeneleak-is-a-big-worry.html

Can someone explain to me.. one line and its significance.. The red one..

Look i really wish to understand that a crew deployed in kilo class boat , stated currently deployed, will they surface in the middle of the sea to check with their android cellphone and check for a internet connectivity and browse to see the news and also receive our Shiv Aroor's (livefist) call and give this statement? or say use a laptop and a dongle to check all this?


@Abingdonboy @anant_s @Nilgiri @anant_s @hellfire @MilSpec @Ankit Kumar 002 @zebra7 @Vergennes ..

I may be wrong so pls correct me bcz i for someone dont think during Kilo operational deployment you get such luxuries.. Wont such a call or communication give out the critical location of the sub in the first place?

This one is epic i guess from every Defence reporting standard

 

[Indrajit]

Mismatch between leaked Scorpene info and specification model, say government sources

Top government sources say there is a mismatch between the papers available in public domain and the specification manual on which the boats are being made.
New Delhi, August 25, 2016 | UPDATED 14:32 IST

Primary analysis of the Navy on the Scorpene submarine information leak indicates that there is a mismatch between the papers available in public domain and the specification manual on which the boats are being made, top government sources said.

The primary analysis report has been shared with Defence Minister Manohar Parrikar. Claims have been made that 22,400 papers were leaked but actually only few papers are available in the open domain.

Though sources confirm that the leaked papers have similarity to one of the submarine versions discussed with the French naval contractor DCNS, many specifications were changed in the final version.

However, to avoid any chance, the Ministry of Defence has asked Navy to seek a detailed report on the leaked papers from DCNS. The matter will be taken up with DCNS through Ministry of External Affairs, the sources said....................................

Unfortunately, this will have to be taken with a truckload of salt. What does anyone expect the MoD to say....? It might be true or it might not be but any & all statements coming out now, especially when "top governmental sources" say something will carry with it, a credibility question. The article itself says that very few of the 22,400 pages are available at this time with the MoD and who knows, even that 22,400 number might just be the tip of the iceberg.

The same point I was making earlier. We have to assume the worst.