Secularists should 'mend ways or leave country', says PTI lawmaker

[Zibago]

Both IK and Chudo Butt wished Hindus holi i.e a pagan custom and establoshed a co-education university so he should first kick out his leader
A senior member of his party Andleeb Abbas was a vocal critic of the hijab 5 number fiasco will he kick her out?
Why is he supporting a media system where there is intermingling of Na mehrams?

 

[Musafir117]

Both IK and Chudo Butt wished Hindus holi i.e a pagan custom and establoshed a co-education university so he should first kick out his leader
A senior member of his party Andleeb Abbas was a vocal critic of the hijab 5 number fiasco will he kick her out?
Why is he supporting a media system where there is intermingling of Na mehrams?

You will be in list " Ex PTI members " soon
I told you dozen time PTI is a cart where horses not in front but all of its sides and everyone dragging the cart where he want and cart not moving no where

 

[Zibago]

You will be in list " Ex PTI members " soon
I told you dozen time PTI is a cart where horses not in front but all of its sides and everyone dragging the cart where he want and cart not moving no where

Nope i dont think so
They are only option against baboonS i look at my leader,s and my mna,s (Asad Umar)views both speak by their actions on what they want he is trying to tap into the right wing vote bank the zarvan types his wording is a bit
There are differences between pti supporters we dont get paid to post shit justifying wrong statements and policies

 

[Hell hound]

You will be in list " Ex PTI members " soon
I told you dozen time PTI is a cart where horses not in front but all of its sides and everyone dragging the cart where he want and cart not moving no where

Ex PTI member now political atheist here. the political dynamics in our country has tendency to do it

 

[Finer]

First you should offer an explanation of what you mean by secular, liberal and conservative. Remember secular does not necessarily mean liberal or democratic. Socialism does not necessarily mean secular. Matter of fact there are more examples of secular regimes which are totally undemocratic and tyrannical. Now tell me what is so liberal about those secular states where people are banned from wearing hijab? Yes, I agree that Islam does not allow a system where rights of people be it the rights of Muslims or non-Muslims are violated but what we've been observing is an attempt by the west to vilify anything Islamic in the name of secularism. That is unacceptable! Do you see how persecuted Rohynga Muslims in Burma are being portrayed as Islamic terrorists? This is the trend we're fighting all around the globe. Now what kind of secularism or liberal way of life is that?

I think you are mixing the lifestyle and political ideology together. If you look at the history, conservative mindset has always been threat to the progressive society because of its closed minded. The very same mindset that was crushed by Islam appeared to be too liberal for them meaning pro-equality, pro-women, pro-knowledge are considered too liberal for conservative.

Judging by your post, just because certain nations claim to practice doesn't mean it is secular or any type that is responsible behind the reasons; rather it is people that governs the lands. What is happening in Myanamar has nothing to do with secularism, rather it has to do with people using political ideology by fueling in the name of religion.

For the same reason Modi came to the power through his reputation of historical genocide incident against Muslims while his communal party still continues to wreak havoc against Muslims using beef policy motivated by communal mindset. So did Donald Trump who came to the power through the votes by majority conservative dominated people that happen to be anti-multiculturalism and anti-equality.

Likewise, terrorist-outfit aka TTP and ISIS uses its political ideology fueling in the name of Islam even though their actions and their political ideology contradicts Islam big time. Don't mix them both.

All the religions including Islam are pro-peace, pro-equality and pro-women which is also definition of secular as well. Liberal means progress whether in life, humanity, and knowledge. Does that sound like evil to you? Nobody is defining secularism because secularism already stands for pro-life regardless of background.

Mynamar, India, ISIS/TTP, Donald Trump have abandoned secularism and now adopted political ideology fueling in the name of religion or race even though all the religions promote life, peace, equality, multiculturalism.

 

[SoulSpokesman]

Fallen King,

All the religions including Islam are pro-peace, pro-equality and pro-women

How are religions pro-women? Islam allows men to have four wives, it doesnt allow women to have four husbands. Hinduism requires widows to commit sati, it doesnt require widowers to become sata. I dont see any equality. I may be missing something, tho'

Regards

 

[Kabira]

Secularism is cool. Pakistan should adopt it for this factor alone. See example of so called secular India where cow is safer then muslim. But its known as secular country throughout the world. Where muslim can become PM and control India.... which will never happen. See my point?

If Pakistan can make few changes like coas, PM can be non-muslim then whats the problem? It will continue to be socially backward like India but at the same time secular. It already give non-muslims equal rights as any other and unlike India it doesn't force them to not drink alcohol or eat pork.

 

[Finer]

Fallen King,

Islamic country based on Islam is akin to the secular.

That is a very beautiful point you make. That a truly Islamic country is secular. That is why IMHO, Pakistani liberals should take a different route altogether. Rather than demand a secular state which raises the hackles of the junta, they should agitate for an Islamic system based on Islam. This will satisfy aam junta and maulvis and liberals too as a truly Islamic system is secular, liberal and progressive anyway.

Regards

Next time quote me or MENTION me, that way i get alert which makes it easier to reply you sooner than possible.

Back to the topic;

I doubt it. It has never been about the title to begin with. Those people who are opposing liberal/secular also opposed Jinnah (R.A) and his visions, and targeted him personally due to his secular outlook.

And now those people stands on the thread threatening to undermine the truly vision of Allama Iqbal (R.A) executed by Jinnah (R.A). If they have no respect for their visions, i doubt they will care.

It is not about what Pakistan is made for. Rather it is about those conservative group people deliberately want the nation to be stuck under conservative political ideology in the name of Islam even though Islam is anti-conservative mindset.

In reality, they just want the whole nation should be locked at home with doors closed. And secular/liberal scares them. All the progress, knowledge, equality, pro-women are too much for them to handle. They want the nation that should be subservient to their ideology where they can rule comfortably in the society. It is hard to explain, but it is much like caste in India where they don't want change on the status quo meaning they want dalit deliberatly stuck on the darkness with no access to life nor aspiration for the better life.

Similarity, the society that thrives on intolerance and mistreatment using the name of religion won't like it when their status quo are threatened. Unfortunately, people are confused of conservative politically and culturally ideology with Islam and now see Islam as such even though Islam is pro-equality of any kind.

When Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) came, he was threat to the status quo, but thankfully, Islam crushed the conservative mindset and changed the game in favor of the oppressed community.

 

[Arsalan]

@Hell hound what do you really think being a secular or liberal IS?
Frankly, though being "in-fashion" a vast majority of our secular are more extreme in there views that the extremists!! Only as bad as the worst kind of so-called Mullahs out there!! And not just OURS,, i have seen liberals and secular from different parts of the world being worst than the the group we have conveniently labeled "extremists"!!

@The Sandman @django @Zibago what do YOU people have to say about this?

@WAJsal @Moonlight @The Eagle ???

 

[I.R.A]

@Hell hound what do you really think being a secular or liberal IS?
Frankly, though being "in-fashion" a vast majority of our secular are more extreme in there views that the extremists!! Only as bad as the worst kind of so-called Mullahs out there!! And not just OURS,, i have seen liberals and secular from different parts of the world being worst than the the group we have conveniently labeled "extremists"!!

@The Sandman @django @Zibago what do YOU people have to say about this?

@WAJsal @Moonlight @The Eagle ???

If they have heroes and representatives like Asma Jahangir and any other Sandh, Bhensa, Kutta .......... well then they need all the best of luck to promote their ideology.

Fallen King and Waleed have valid points. A society based on laws derived from Quran would be Islamic as well as liberal in its conduct. What is missing in case of both orthodox and so called liberal ............. proper understanding and focus of Quran.

 

[The Sandman]

@Hell hound what do you really think being a secular or liberal IS?
Frankly, though being "in-fashion" a vast majority of our secular are more extreme in there views that the extremists!! Only as bad as the worst kind of so-called Mullahs out there!! And not just OURS,, i have seen liberals and secular from different parts of the world being worst than the the group we have conveniently labeled "extremists"!!

@The Sandman @django @Zibago what do YOU people have to say about this?

Bhai i am not an extremist i don't support any extremists like (bhensa or asma jahangir types) nor do i want to forcefully impose my views on others (like mullahs and their supporters) all i am saying is that European countries are successful, progressive and tolerant today because of these 2 things religion is one's personal thing it should stay like that and that's what Mr Jinnah said too look what zia did to our country we still haven't recovered from that extremism has penetrated deep into every institution of our country i am not against any religion or Pakistan i am a Pakistani and a Muslim too i care for my country and i want best for it and if we can achieve it through secularism (that's Jinnah wanted too) than what's the harm in it?

 

[Zibago]

@Hell hound what do you really think being a secular or liberal IS?
Frankly, though being "in-fashion" a vast majority of our secular are more extreme in there views that the extremists!! Only as bad as the worst kind of so-called Mullahs out there!! And not just OURS,, i have seen liberals and secular from different parts of the world being worst than the the group we have conveniently labeled "extremists"!!

@The Sandman @django @Zibago what do YOU people have to say about this?

@WAJsal @Moonlight @The Eagle ???

In Pakistan anti nationals are labelled as liberals while blood thirsty Mullahsaurases are labelled as conservatives we are not a nation of moderates but extremes

 

[SoulSpokesman]

Zibago sb,

In Pakistan anti nationals are labelled as liberals

In India too.

Regards

 

[Finer]

If they have heroes and representatives like Asma Jahangir and any other Sandh, Bhensa, Kutta .......... well then they need all the best of luck to promote their ideology.

Fallen King and Waleed have valid points. A society based on laws derived from Quran would be Islamic as well as liberal in its conduct. What is missing in case of both orthodox and so called liberal ............. proper understanding and focus of Quran.

Orthodox and liberal in the same line? Impossible. One stands for culture that must remain the same while practice within the degree of the culture and one that stands for culture that arises above the culture and look beyond [life].

Although, Prophet Muhammad (PBUH) gave simple solution for Muslims and the whole mankind for a time like this. Just meet in the middle which is moderating. Just moderate the stances. Not too extremist nor too liberal meaning don't take it too far while respect one to another nor should impose their views upon one to another aggressively against their wills.

Just find the middle to balance the both party. A example of Jinnah (R.A) lifestyle would be prime example. He was Muslim who prayed, fasted, believed in Islam and did the right thing; and on the other hand, had secular life, did education, respected people/women and believed in equality. Just my favorite kind and just the way he envisioned for Pakistan.

 

[The Eagle]

@Hell hound what do you really think being a secular or liberal IS?
Frankly, though being "in-fashion" a vast majority of our secular are more extreme in there views that the extremists!! Only as bad as the worst kind of so-called Mullahs out there!! And not just OURS,, i have seen liberals and secular from different parts of the world being worst than the the group we have conveniently labeled "extremists"!!

@The Sandman @django @Zibago what do YOU people have to say about this?

@WAJsal @Moonlight @The Eagle ???

Indeed, both extremist elements are risk to the country as well as to the humanity. The Irony is, so-called liberals got many ways to vocal their evil through different means and mostly are supported by specific worldly powers as well in the name of so-called freedom of speech hence, easily walks away with it yet on other hand, religious extremists are easy to be recognized and unveil them. IMO, both are damaging us badly either the extremist under umbrella of Freedom or Speech or fake scholar that uses religion to mislead people.

People who gets chance to speak about openly, are mostly so-called liberals and extremist of liberalism that prefers media warfare and other means like candle mafia etc to vent frustration and damage the peace yet by provoking religious extremists that causes more unrest in society. However, religious extremists/fake scholars mostly uses loud speakers and sometimes newspapers to avenge the mocking so all in all, the cleansing needs to start from end and as so-called liberals claims themselves the educated lot, should be taught first to behave and on the same time we can deal with fake scholars too that fool us Muslims in the name of Islam. You will note that there are very credible Islamic Scholars that does not get into this illiterate scuffle of society and mostly mind own business so people must understand that how to counter these aunties and fake scholars. TBH, the so-called liberals actually damaged the society since the day they got their freedom of speech which was a deliberate infection being injected based upon well designed program. Just look at NGOs, the candle Mafia and all of them.