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Scientists develop new halal meat test

most bdians are second type..right?

Most Pakistani and Indian Muslims are Hanafi followers.

I think its halal but because a Horse is a useful animal no one usually eats them especially from a historical point of view the habit of eating horses never really set in ! :unsure:

Horse is a delicacy in Central Asia many Uzbeks eat horse as well as Kazakhs and Turkmen. Google central Asia horse foods.
 
I think its halal but because a Horse is a useful animal no one usually eats them especially from a historical point of view the habit of eating horses never really set in ! :unsure:
Horse had always been the Mongol's most favorite delicacy.Especially the pure white ones (Kublai Khan's favorite).
 
Horse had always been the Mongol's most favorite delicacy.Especially the pure white ones (Kublai Khan's favorite).

That maybe so but Horse is a domesticated animal useful in the daily chores of older days so by & large its not on the menu for most Civilizations; the Mongols Society revolved around Horses & a Tough Life so maybe something developed there that didn't elsewhere !

most bdians are second type..right?

Hanbali & Shafi are predominantly North African & Arab Schools of Jurisprudence; South Asians are predominantly Hanafi !

Such is what Wiki paints it out to be I dunno how accurate the source is but I do believe that South Asians are indeed predominantly Hanafi : Hanafi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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That maybe so but Horse is a domesticated animal useful in the daily chores of older days so by & large its not on the menu for most Civilizations; the Mongols Society revolved around Horses & a Tough Life so maybe something developed there that didn't elsewhere !



Hanbali & Shafi are predominantly North African & Arab Schools of Jurisprudence; South Asians are predominantly Hanafi !

Such is what Wiki paints it out to be I dunno how accurate the source is but I do believe that South Asians are indeed predominantly Hanafi : Hanafi - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
ah okey..
I always felt I am a bit bdian @BDforever ... you are right. :sick:
 
I heard some fish are not halal too(and some are).. is that true?

It is correct, certain fish are halaal, others are not.

controversial topic

In Hanafi madthab, it is haram to eat shellfish (lobster, crab, shrimp, oyster, etc.)

In Shafi'i and Hanbali, everything from the sea is halal.

In Maliki, everything but the eel is halal.

I don't think it is haraam in any school of thought to eat shrimps etc., it's makrooh. There's a difference.
 
Animals feel the pain of religious slaughter - science-in-society - 13 October 2009 - New Scientist

There are also independent studies in Poland(which led to a complete ban of Halal meat in Poland), E.U(Complete ban being contemplated), Australia(pre-stunning the animal is the law. Muslims have made their peace with it) etc. Feel free to look it up as I am not going to spoon-feed you. You are not a first grader anymore, right? :enjoy:



Your opinion wasn't solicited in the first place. You replied to me, remember? To try and act like a badass afterwards makes you look like a complete retard. :lol:



All non-Muslims would want slaughter to be carried out in the most humane way possible. This is the consensus across the board as Halal doesn't apply to us. Stunning has been proven as the most humane method out there and it will be implemented as a global norm sooner or later


You're asking the same questions again and I don't like repeating myself. I replied to the query of a poster that specifically stated "what the issue with the Indian posters was". Do you see the word "India" or "Indians" now?

There are debates both for and against the Islamic way of sacrificing the animal. However, neither can prove, with significant justification and undeniable fact, the other to be wrong. To conclude the argument, Muslims believe the sacrificial way to be that prescribed by the creator of the entire universe, other bodies, entities that we do not know of etc. Hence, our way is THE correct way........and then there are things that science, philosophy and critical thinking are still unable to prove, it does not mean that these things do not exist, it just means that our understanding and logic are currently not at that stage of understanding.
 
There are debates both for and against the Islamic way of sacrificing the animal. However, neither can prove, with significant justification and undeniable fact, the other to be wrong. To conclude the argument, Muslims believe the sacrificial way to be that prescribed by the creator of the entire universe, other bodies, entities that we do not know of etc. Hence, our way is THE correct way........and then there are things that science, philosophy and critical thinking are still unable to prove, it does not mean that these things do not exist, it just means that our understanding and logic are currently not at that stage of understanding.

What debates and which community is being referred to here? Citations and links would be appreciated.

If you meant debates amongst Muslim "scholars" and within the Islamic community, I would unfortunately have to disagree as I don't recognize their expertise on the matter of animal welfare(or anything relevant, for that matter).
 
All non-Muslims would want slaughter to be carried out in the most humane way possible. This is the consensus across the board as Halal doesn't apply to us. Stunning has been proven as the most humane method out there and it will be implemented as a global norm sooner or later

First of all, if you see any "non-muslims" other than yourself derailing this thread. Than please do show me.

Lastly, non-Halal procedure would never be implemented. It might be implemented in non-muslim countries but never in Muslim countries. And Halal meat itself is on the rise but you know what's the shocking thing??? The Top 10 countries producing the most halal meat aren't even muslim!!! :rofl:

Need some links??

Global halal meat market volume reaches $300bn

Halal meat market grows

:bounce:


Again, Halal meat, even if impeached by certain countries, will continue to rise since the # of Muslims are rising. :D

@cyphercide @Mav3rick @Talon @Armstrong @KingMamba And Others.

Islamic Halal slaughter has increasingly come under attack from animal rights activists telling tales of barbaric blood-thirsty ritual slaughter. There are two distinct issues: there is the vegetarian agenda which wants to ban all consumption of animal products, and there is the animal rights lobby which argues for a humane method of slaughter.

@cyphercide Which issue are you supporting??? :azn:

Do animals have rights?

The vegetarian argument is that killing animals for the benefit of humans is cruel and an infringement of their rights. They put both on the same level without conceding any superiority to humans over animals. This argument is seriously flawed, because if animals had rights comparable to those of humans, they must also have equivalent duties. In other words, we must be able to blame them and punish them if they violate the rights of others. It is absurd that it should be considered a crime for humans to kill a sheep, but natural for a lion to do so. The problem stems from a misconception of the role of human life within the animal kingdom: a denial of purposeful creation within a clearly defined hierarchy degrades humans to the level of any other creature. Yet even then, the argument is illogical: Why should plants, for example, be denied the same protection from a violation of the sanctity of their life?


Is Islamic slaughter cruel?

The question of how an animal should be slaughtered to avoid cruelty is a different one. It is true that when the blood flows from the throat of an animal it looks violent, but just because meat is now bought neatly and hygienically packaged on supermarket shelves does not mean the animal didn’t have to die? Non-Islamic slaughter methods dictate that the animal should be rendered unconscious before slaughter. This is usually achieved by stunning or electrocution. Is it less painful to shoot a bolt into a sheep’s brain or to ring a chicken’s neck than to slit its throat? To watch the procedure does not objectively tell us what the animal feels.


The scientific facts

A team at the university of Hannover in Germany examined these claims through the use of EEG and ECG records during slaughter. Several electrodes were surgically implanted at various points of the skull of all the animals used in the experiment and they were then allowed to recover for several weeks. Some of the animals were subsequently slaughtered the halal way by making a swift, deep incision with a sharp knife on the neck, cutting the jugular veins and carotid arteries of both sides together with the trachea and esophagus but leaving the spinal cord intact. The remainder were stunned before slaughter using a captive bolt pistol method as is customary in Western slaughterhouses. The EEG and ECG recordings allowed to monitor the condition of the brain and heart throughout.


The Halal method

With the halal method of slaughter, there was not change in the EEG graph for the first three seconds after the incision was made, indicating that the animal did not feel any pain from the cut itself. This is not surprising. Often, if we cut ourselves with a sharp implement, we do not notice until some time later. The following three seconds were characterised by a condition of deep sleep-like unconciousness brought about by the draining of large quantities of blood from the body. Thereafter the EEG recorded a zero reading, indicating no pain at all, yet at that time the heart was still beating and the body convulsing vigorously as a reflex reaction of the spinal cord. It is this phase which is most unpleasant to onlookers who are falsely convinced that the animal suffers whilst its brain does actually no longer record any sensual messages.


The Western method

Using the Western method, the animals were apparently unconscious after stunning, and this method of dispatch would appear to be much more peaceful for the onlooker. However, the EEG readings indicated severe pain immediately after stunning. Whereas in the first example, the animal ceases to feel pain due to the brain starvation of blood and oxygen – a brain death, to put it in laymen’s terms – the second example first causes a stoppage of the heart whilst the animal still feels pain. However, there are no unsightly convulsions, which not only means that there is more blood retention in the meat, but also that this method lends itself much more conveniently to the efficiency demands of modern mass slaughter procedures. It is so much easier to dispatch an animal on the conveyor belt, if it does not move.


Appearances can deceive

Not all is what it seems, then. Those who want to outlaw Islamic slaughter, arguing for a humane method of killing animals for food, are actually more concerned about the feelings of people than those of the animals on whose behalf they appear to speak. The stunning method makes mass butchery easier and looks more palatable for the consumer who can deceive himself that the animal did not feel any pain when he goes to buy his cleanly wrapped parcel of meat from the supermarket. Islamic slaughter, on the other hand, does not try to deny that meat consumption means that animals have to die, but is designed to ensure that their loss of life is achieved with a minimum amount of pain.


The holistic view

Islam is a balanced way of life. For Muslims, the privilege of supplementing their diet with animal protein implies a duty to animal welfare, both during the rearing of the animal and during the slaughter. Modern Western farming and slaughter, on the other hand, aims at the mass consumer market and treats the animal as a commodity. Just as battery hens are easier for large-scale egg production, Western slaughter methods are easier for the meat industry, but they do neither the animal nor the end consumer any favours. The Islamic way guarantees a healthier life for the animal and a healthier meat for the consumer.


The Halal Slaughter Controvesy

Link of the Germany-based study:- The Halal Study
 
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What debates and which community is being referred to here? Citations and links would be appreciated.

If you meant debates amongst Muslim "scholars" and within the Islamic community, I would unfortunately have to disagree as I don't recognize their expertise on the matter of animal welfare(or anything relevant, for that matter).

I was referring to the debate b/w Muslims and the so called animal rights groups.

And your suggestions that Muslims scholars do not have any expertise on animal welfare is an offending assumption.
 
Well according to the islamic principals the animal throat should be cut in a certain way and if not then that meat too will be considered haram.Is there any way to detect such a meat?

Also any indian member here please answer me "is pork in india widely available in markets"?
 
First of all, if you see any "non-muslims" other than yourself derailing this thread. Than please do show me.

Lastly, non-Halal procedure would never be implemented. It might be implemented in non-muslim countries but never in Muslim countries. And Halal meat itself is on the rise but you know what's the shocking thing??? The Top 10 countries producing the most halal meat aren't even muslim!!! :rofl:

Need some links??

Global halal meat market volume reaches $300bn

Halal meat market grows

I like it how you sidestepped 90% of my response and zoned in on the part where I was expressing my personal opinion.

Smart, but as usual, not smart enough. ;)

Who gives a shit on the business Halal makes or what Muslim countries do in their deserts. Sadly, the forecast isn't looking too bright in non-Muslim countries. Need some links?

The European Commission has put forward plans to ensure that animals facing slaughter are “spared any avoidable pain, distress or suffering”.

Under the proposals all animals facing slaughter would have to be electrically stunned beforehand.

The move could threaten production of both halal and kosher meat, rules for which often forbid pre-stunning.

A scientific study by the Government’s Farm Animal Welfare Council in 2003 found that animals could remain fully conscious for up to two minutes after having their throats cut.

It said all animals should be stunned before slaughter.

EU ban on 'inhumane' halal and kosher meat

In fact, many nations like the U.K and Australia already get majority of their meat from pre-stunned animals. So the Halal meat you consume may not be so Halal after all!!! Poor Lodonistanis might be faring no better than the Polishstanis on the matter!!! ;)
http://www.rspca.org.uk/ImageLocator/LocateAsset?asset=document&assetId=1232719611043&mode=prd

Polish Muslims drop Eid sacrifice amid protests, halal ban - DAWN.COM



Mustaqim Islamic Art and Literature? Nice try, Hadji!!! It's almost as if you want me to mock you!!!:enjoy:

Either way, I will keep it objective.

Why isn't there a link to the actual study? I'll tell you why soon enough.

By W. Schulze, H. Schultze-Petzold, A.S. Hazem, and R. Gross

The same Mr. Schulze who openly admitted in the same report that his study might be in error?

Ghanem cites a 1978 study relying on EEG measurements led by Wilhelm Schulze of the University of Hanover, Germany, apparently concluding that halal slaughter was more humane than slaughter following stunning. But Schulze himself, who died in 2002, warned in his report that the stunning technique may not have functioned properly.

Animals feel the pain of religious slaughter - science-in-society - 13 October 2009 - New Scientist

Yep. It's the same guy. Do you get it now or should I persist?
And your suggestions that Muslims scholars do not have any expertise on animal welfare is an offending assumption.

They simply don't. I apologize if that position offends you but it is what it is.
 
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Well according to the islamic principals the animal throat should be cut in a certain way and if not then that meat too will be considered haram.Is there any way to detect such a meat?

Also any indian member here please answer me "is pork in india widely available in markets"?
pork is not widely available in India...
 
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