Russia's UAC may deliver fighter jets to Bangladesh

[Nilgiri]

true... but i wonder how the deal will come to be... .will their be options to add the same models in future sqd... as our requirement calls for?

Well like I said, lets sit back and see. No idea what exact customisation BD will take past the general guesses (of definitely no israeli stuff, probably no indian stuff etc).

You will probably go full russian cookie cutter model if I had to guess (what irkutsk factory provides in basic airframe and what russian industry can provide regarding radars, avionics, weapons package etc). Its overall cheapest integration that way and you have only one country to deal with if you want future airframes down the road.

Or you can basically take MKM as the model and ask Russia to integrate according to that, it has been done on many MK variants now (heritage has been established)....but you will need to approach the French OEM suppliers each time you want more aircraft, and the russians will charge you on top for integrating foreign components. How much extra performance those add compared to the price (compared to going full Russian on everything), thats for BD to take a judgement call on. Any fundamentally new OEM component source past the French will add even more time and expense for clearances, testing, adaptation and final integration and flightworthiness certificate to be issued by the Russians. This was the reason MKI took a while in the beginning and there was a Su-30 K stop gap acquisition.

 

[Michael Corleone]

Well like I said, lets sit back and see. No idea what exact customisation BD will take past the general guesses (of definitely no israeli stuff, probably no indian stuff etc).

You will probably go full russian cookie cutter model if I had to guess (what irkutsk factory provides in basic airframe and what russian industry can provide regarding radars, avionics, weapons package etc). Its overall cheapest integration that way and you have only one country to deal with if you want future airframes down the road.

Or you can basically take MKM as the model and ask Russia to integrate according to that, it has been done on many MK variants now (heritage has been established)....but you will need to approach the French OEM suppliers each time you want more aircraft, and the russians will charge you on top for integrating foreign components. How much extra performance those add compared to the price (compared to going full Russian on everything), thats for BD to take a judgement call on. Any fundamentally new OEM component source past the French will add even more time and expense for clearances, testing, adaptation and final integration and flightworthiness certificate to be issued by the Russians. This was the reason MKI took a while in the beginning and there was a Su-30 K stop gap acquisition.

sm models come with better avionics doesnt it? i mean french radars? oh there is also a partnership with irkut regarding manufacturing of avionics in bd.... maybe that had something to do with this who knows/

anyways.... haven't the russian avionics and electronics come on par with western system nowadays... there was praise articles on su-35 and pak fa and russian electronics disabling a US warship some years back.... can you put in some details if you know?

 

[Nilgiri]

sm models come with better avionics doesnt it? i mean french radars? oh there is also a partnership with irkut regarding manufacturing of avionics in bd.... maybe that had something to do with this who knows/

anyways.... haven't the russian avionics and electronics come on par with western system nowadays... there was praise articles on su-35 and pak fa and russian electronics disabling a US warship some years back.... can you put in some details if you know?

Yah you could go for SM, get off the shelf from what they are making for Russian Airforce....just make sure everything labelled in English/Bengali

Thats not a bad idea at all, probably might be what happen. It would be easy for BD to overhaul them in Russia too when needed given Russia would already be doing the same for their own....and nothing would really have to be changed.

Russian avionics and electronics are not really "at par" overall. Some areas they are very close...others still some way behind (esp in terms of efficiency). When efficiency doesn't really matter (and you have a massive Fencer or something who's only purpose is to broadband jam), you can make some pretty potent jamming/EW platforms since you just scale up the size with the tech you have while ensuring the bird stays flyable basically. The reports of one jamming a US aegis destroyer I find hard to believe given how the aegis system works (not to mention in a real conflict good luck getting that close)...so it may have been some propaganda there. But the system is nonetheless potent on paper....just like the AK-47 does its job good though its not recent recent "modern".

But its not really indicative of the quality of russian electronics in that field (or other fields which can be unrelated to radars/EW). In basic avionics and also standard radars, you aren't really getting the absolute top of the line that you will find in the west (which accelerated their RnD during the 90s when Russia was reeling from the soviet breakup and financial problems and thus maintain an appreciable advantage especially per weight/volume which is crucial in aerospace), but they are generally very decent from Russia given they have their own heritage in these design fields.

There are even a few advantages they have over others from time to time given the various quirks they have in their design philosophy (which is only natural, enough scientists and engineers with the same objectives and inputs will come to the same design 95% of the time....but the 5% difference can have some randomized spread in good and bad that makes things interesting). But you essentially need to be in the game long enough for this variation/branching to occur (otherwise you are generally busy catching up with the 95% stuff).

Same applies to stand-alone, user ready, military aircraft engines. 2nd place doesnt sound so good as 1st....but there really are very few that have qualified in the multi-discipline competition to begin with....so competing and placing in the medals is no easy feat.

 

[ghazi768]

first off wasnt talking about mig 19.... so read carefully/....
second without getting into arguments and fanboying... my question to you is... what was mig 29 designed to go up against back in the soviet days?

That was a typo, I thought you had the brains to see that..

To throw the best $hit you have against the competition does not make that $hit a 'competitor'.

 

[BRITISH]

we should sell jf 17 to BAF and make BAf strong then they can hold india

 

[Chhatrapati]

But, the way Bangladeshi members talk in this forum, it seems they consider you people more of a threat than the Myanmar.

PDForum has a wide range of people. Some are fake Bangladeshi, fake Indians, Fake Paks, fake Chinese and so on. Some even have anti-Indian views. Which we don't mind at all.
So, instead of believing what forum members say, look into reality.

 

[Nabil365]

we should sell jf 17 to BAF and make BAf strong then they can hold india

How about free?

 

[Michael Corleone]

That was a typo, I thought you had the brains to see that..

To throw the best $hit you have against the competition does not make that $hit a 'competitor'.

Dude... f-16 is more like a cheaper support to f-15... mig 29 is air superiority fighter. It has higher rate of clImb, turn etc etc! In medium range combat. When two basic versions are compared without taking into account later mig 29 improvements... f-16 has the edge. Wvr mig 29 has the edge...

Now talking some more sense into you... helmet mounted missile lock... BVR etc, we have those in our version of the jet! So the advantage f-16 has over mig 29 in medium range is nullified! It's foolish to compare two different class of fighters! There's no comparison.

 

[ghazi768]

Dude... f-16 is more like a cheaper support to f-15... mig 29 is air superiority fighter. It has higher rate of clImb, turn etc etc! In medium range combat. When two basic versions are compared without taking into account later mig 29 improvements... f-16 has the edge. Wvr mig 29 has the edge...

Now talking some more sense into you... helmet mounted missile lock... BVR etc, we have those in our version of the jet! So the advantage f-16 has over mig 29 in medium range is nullified! It's foolish to compare two different class of fighters! There's no comparison.

come on! now do not be an idiot.. Mig 29, an air superiority fighter and comparable to F-15.. you keep ticking up this fighter in each post. What will you make it competitor to in your next post.. F-22 because Mig-29 is still the short range interceptors for Russian airforce and the one to end up facing it because Su-27/30 can be many things but not a scramble-able interceptor. (by the way not in their internal airforce which gets their best fighters, it has Mig-31s as long range interceptors and Su-s of different varieties for backup)

You mentioned a typo in my one of my previous post which made me remember things, I'll mention it but I do not think that guys like you who had not set a foot in a cockpit but keep vomiting pearls of wisdom here will understand it. Now guys like you may think that having two D$$$ ahem engines will be better than one in a vwr fighter. I remembered an irony, Mig-19( we had F-6/J-6 its clones) and 29 not only share just the last number, it also had two engines. And it was as lousy at speeding up, few who had experienced it could forget the agony of seeing their opponent just running straight away. As a VWR fighter the best option you had was to always try to sneak upon a bogie. At higher alpha it shuddered and gyrated like hell but still was very manoeuvrable and quite reliable once you learn its habits, its stick was still responsive to a degree in such scenario. When Soviets decided to upgrade from famed and successful Mig-21 to 29 their short-range interceptor force, interestingly their designers again chose a twin engined, larger, bulkier design. But the idiots other than a voice alert also implemented a stick jerking mechanism at higher AOA. From the horse's mouth.. bloody last throes before end in a mastur....

HOBS is a nice to have option which is becoming must now that every other fighter is fielding it. And you can keep salivating about HOBS and a circled up wire as a sight to be game changer in a dogfight but the fact is that it takes much more to be a better vwr fighter than this. If Mi-29 was such a great interceptor and dog fighter (and in your imaginations also an air-supirioty fighter competing F-15) than why did IAF kept sticking to its Mig-21s even to this day. If they had asked, Russians would have been more than happy to manufacture hundreds of this $hit for them.

 

[Michael Corleone]

Yah you could go for SM, get off the shelf from what they are making for Russian Airforce....just make sure everything labelled in English/Bengali

Thats not a bad idea at all, probably might be what happen. It would be easy for BD to overhaul them in Russia too when needed given Russia would already be doing the same for their own....and nothing would really have to be changed.

Russian avionics and electronics are not really "at par" overall. Some areas they are very close...others still some way behind (esp in terms of efficiency). When efficiency doesn't really matter (and you have a massive Fencer or something who's only purpose is to broadband jam), you can make some pretty potent jamming/EW platforms since you just scale up the size with the

come on! now do not be an idiot.. Mig 29, an air superiority fighter and comparable to F-15.. you keep ticking up this fighter in each post. What will you make it competitor to in your next post.. F-22 because Mig-29 is still the short range interceptors for Russian airforce and the one to end up facing it because Su-27/30 can be many things but not a scramble-able interceptor. (by the way not in their internal airforce which gets their best fighters, it has Mig-31s as long range interceptors and Su-s of different varieties for backup)

You mentioned a typo in my one of my previous post which made me remember things, I'll mention it but I do not think that guys like you who had not set a foot in a cockpit but keep vomiting pearls of wisdom here will understand it. Now guys like you may think that having two D$$$ ahem engines will be better than one in a vwr fighter. I remembered an irony, Mig-19( we had F-6/J-6 its clones) and 29 not only share just the last number, it also had two engines. And it was as lousy at speeding up, few who had experienced it could forget the agony of seeing their opponent just running straight away. As a VWR fighter the best option you had was to always try to sneak upon a bogie. At higher alpha it shuddered and gyrated like hell but still was very manoeuvrable and quite reliable once you learn its habits, its stick was still responsive to a degree in such scenario. When Soviets decided to upgrade from famed and successful Mig-21 to 29 their short-range interceptor force, interestingly their designers again chose a twin engined, larger, bulkier design. But the idiots other than a voice alert also implemented a stick jerking mechanism at higher AOA. From the horse's mouth.. bloody last throes before end in a mastur....

HOBS is a nice to have option which is becoming must now that every other fighter is fielding it. And you can keep salivating about HOBS and a circled up wire as a sight to be game changer in a dogfight but the fact is that it takes much more to be a better vwr fighter than this. If Mi-29 was such a great interceptor and dog fighter (and in your imaginations also an air-supirioty fighter competing F-15) than why did IAF kept sticking to its Mig-21s even to this day. If they had asked, Russians would have been more than happy to manufacture hundreds of this $hit for them.

i didnt tick it up to be as equal to as f-15 and it's unsurprising people go by assumptions but no i have been in cockpits of many planes in my life.... have even flow two.... //// i am not even going to read the rest of your post....
@Nilgiri i am sure you know a thing or two about aviation... why dont you say what you think

 

[asad71]

This is good a summation of the potential Russian sale. Unfortunately the report is in Bangla and speaks of diarrhea the report has caused in the neighborhood.

 

[Homo Sapiens]

This is good a summation of the potential Russian sale. Unfortunately the report is in Bangla and speaks of diarrhea the report has caused in the neighborhood.

8 plane is nothing,we need at least 4 squadron of these type of plane plus S-400 missile.Place one battalion of S-400 in Dhaka and keep 10 squadron of fighter plane including 4 squadron of these type.Then we will be able to resist the enemy effectively.

 

[Tehari_Haleem]

we should sell jf 17 to BAF and make BAf strong then they can hold india

 

[randomradio]

Call it MKB....and you would probably ask for 0 Israeli avionics and systems

mki is for india... why would bangladesh buy something tailor made for them... lol

There are two versions available without Israeli equipment. Algeria's MKA and Malaysia's MKM.

Plus, all of the Israeli equipment, even French if necessary, can now be replaced with Indian. BD can choose Russian equipment as well, like the SM.

That's what I said, we can go for variants 'other than' the MKI. And MKIs are only manufactured in India so there is a quality issue as well.

The quality of Indian made MKI is better. But it's not a problem, Bangladesh will get theirs from Russia anyway. India doesn't produce MKI for export. But in the future, BD can buy FGFAs to replace their Su-30s, made in Indian lines.

 

[BRITISH]

not bad idea gift them