Real Taliban are not terrorists.

[Beskar]

Responding to the original post, I'll agree that the word 'Taliban' is thrown around a lot these days. Labelling everyone from FATA a 'taliban' hasn't helped either. The effects of this constant labelling of everyone from FATA as taliban has made the common man confused about their identity.

I remember talking to a person from Bajaur last year and he was upset at the fact that our Government was constantly labelling their people as either Taliban, or Taliban supporters. And I understand his concern because are we too blind to see those hundreds and thousands of refugee's who've left their EVERYTHING behind so that the army can take care of these TTP miscreants? Frankly, Instead of showing the living conditions of those refugee's, we'd rather see this chameleon of a media showing people being whipped in SWAT.

The common man from FATA is NOT a Taliban or their supporter for that matter. They've shown their allegiance with the State of Pakistan when they decided to leave their houses, lands, and personal belongings behind, wherever the Army was operating. Geo LOVES thanking the 'CHIEF JUSTICE' every now and then for his supposed 'Struggle' to restore judiciary, but I've yet to see them thank those thousands of refugee's from FATA who've sacrificed their everything for the state of 'Pakistan'.

 

[muse]

Darkstar


What's up ?

Speaking out of both sides of one's mouth is both bad maners and is reflective of a character deficiency - and if the shoe fits...

Do you speak outof both sides of your mouth? Why not?

You guys are so scared that your talib monopoly is at risk - it's not just on this forum, but all over Pakistan people are not buying what yoiu guys are selling - please don't take out your frustration on me.

 

[muse]

Dark star

You need to get your head straight -- just because you had a diffciult time on TT does not mean you get to take out your frustration on forum members - I realize you are not giving out kafir advice - but do try and control yourself - a mod is supposed to represent the company line, not his personal frustration


Now as a Mod you will force us to buy into their talib views, if someone disagrees, Darksatr will delete their post -- And ofcourse this from a bunch of guys who will nto do the same to talib supporters, just supporters of Pakistan - and on a Pakistani defence forum.

Get real, please

 

[Beskar]

^ To muse's post.

I'm going to go get some popcorn. This'll get interesting I bet.

 

[DarkStar]

Darkstar


What's up ?

Speaking out of both sides of one's mouth is both bad maners and is reflective of a character deficiency - and if the shoe fits...

Do you speak outof both sides of your mouth? Why not?

You guys are so scared that your talib monopoly is at risk - it's not just on this forum, but all over Pakistan people are not buying what yoiu guys are selling - please don't take out your frustration on me.

Just because I told you to keep your discussion with Omar civil (whom i've also censured, on occasion), you then jump to accusing me of being part of a Talib monopoly?

I do not see the correlation here. Please point out what in my post struck you of being 'Talib'?

I am not selling anything, and as for frustration, just one look at your post, and it is evident who is the frustrated one.

 

[muse]

I won't make that interesting.

 

[Neo]

Muse, you're out of line here. You haven't been yourself lately and I've seen way too many personal attacks at several respected members including some mods in last couple of days.
This has to stop here!

 

[DarkStar]

Now as a Mod you will force us to buy into their talib views, if someone disagrees, Darksatr will delete their post -- And ofcourse this from a bunch of guys who will nto do the same to talib supporters, just supporters of Pakistan - and on a Pakistani defence forum.

Get real, please

I have never propogated any 'Talib' views, and your aspersions on this I regard as an affront and a slander on my name. Please show me the instance where I or any other mod for that matter, supported any 'Talib' ideology.

Your paranoia seems to be boundless, and as for deleting posts that are disagreeable, I have never engaged in this.

In fact, the first time I have ever deleted a post of yours was today, when a thread about the USA had been flooded with off topic posts about Baluchistan, all of which I dleted, and they happened to include yours.

Making a judgement on one day's incident, is rash and illogical. Would have expected a more thoughful, and logical critique from you.

It is apparent, that after being unsuccessful in your attempt to steer the administration of the board towards becoming a gestappo-ised institution, and wanting us mods to become a 'thought police', you have resorted to bringing your rebutted views to the open in order to create friction and controversy, where this is none.

 

[muse]

Neo

just because some one calls it a personal attack does not make it one - I think these guys are frustrated that their proislamuist agenda is being confronted and with as much enthusiam as they project their ISLAMIST POINT OF VIEW.

Now your mods have deliberately started drama because they their point of view is being confronted. The onloy people your mods seem to on the side of are islamist supporters, whereas we apakistanis get short shrift - don't you think that initself suggests a problem?

 

[muse]

Making a judgement on one day's incident, is rash and illogical. Would have expected a more thoughful, and locial critique from you

It a judgment madse over weeks, like I said to you earleir, I look to you where criteria for who is and is not a kafir is concerned and while you have used the excuse of deleting an rabbit and my posts, you did manage to keep posts by islamists that vented their fury presumably that is conducive to conversation -- now forum mebers can't converse with each other on related material with out mods forcing us to listent to islamist drivel.

 

[Neo]

Muse,

First of all I think I do have the ability to mark one's posts as a personal attack regardless how or what others like to call it.
Secondly, the management and the TT team represents all layers of the Pakistani society. If they are the problem so are you from their pov. But thats not what the debate is about, we're here to kill the message only.

You're overpatriotic and there's nothing wrong with it. But calling others Islamist just because they're less secular as you are seems unfair to me.

I'd like to request you to take it further in the TT section, donot throw it in public....its degrading the forum.
Hope you understand.

 

[DarkStar]

It a judgment madse over weeks, like I said to you earleir, I look to you where criteria for who is and is not a kafir is concerned and while you have used the excuse of deleting an rabbit and my posts, you did manage to keep posts by islamists that vented their fury presumably that is conducive to conversation -- now forum mebers can't converse with each other on related material with out mods forcing us to listent to islamist drivel.

I'm sorry, but I am not in the habit of 'compartmentalising' our members in who is an islamist, and who is a secularist. I have mroe pressing issues in my life, than to spend time intriguing about peoples political or religious beliefs. Any post that was about Baluchistan, I deleted. any post about the topic, I kept.

Now you have made a habit of making every thread into a vehicle to expound your views, which is fine, as long as there is some sort of semblence with the topic. Flooding every thread with ideological musings does nothing for better propogating those musings, nor does it help the threads keep their topic.

We have been more lenient with our think tank members, than with anyone else in this regard. But it seems this leniency has begun to be abused.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Muse,

We have interacted on this forum for over a year now I believe, and while your message hasn't changed in essence, your delivery definitely has.

I do not know if this is out of frustration or panic at the situation in Pakistan, but the change is obvious. Where once you could easily and lightly converse with self-admitted Islamists like Zyxius and Marshal Law, and argue your points lucidly and successfully, without trite or snide comments, you resort to the latter almost instantly now.

Please go back and read your posts around the time of our conversations with Zyxius - secularism, loyalty to the Sitara-o-Hilal above all else- that was always your message, but its just become nasty now.

I don't know if you think that is what it'll take to change hearts and minds, but it is abrasive.

 

[muse]

Neo

Ok - the less secular them me can have their moment

I hope you can see that the forum will not have missed that your intercession was required by the "less secular than me" crowd - what does it say about the forum - that civility extends only to the "less secular than me"? Well I am sure there will be a variety of perceptions, one can only hope that other "less secular than me" will not a perception of the forum as a promoter of ideas "less secular" than ones they are persuaded by.


Dark star

Flooding every thread with ideological musings does nothing for better propogating those musings, nor does it help the threads keep their topic.

these "musings" couinter the musings of "less secular than me" crowd and I know and the rest of us know that is what has really gotten to go - musing about who is and is not a kafir, but to counter them is well, trouble?

 

[Neo]

Muse,

I'll reply thru PM since it does not concern anyone else.