Raymond Davis Case: Developing Story

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Gallup poll : 76% of Americans have an unfavorable opinion of Pakistan.

And the Americans complain about 'anti-American sentiment' in Pakistan, when there is an equivalent amount of 'anti-Pakistan sentiment' in their own nation, largely based on the unsubstantiated nonsense and conspiracy theories bashing and vilifying Pakistan and its military/intelligence, spouted by their media and 'analysts'.

Hence I conclude that Pakistan is in a bind - damn if I do, damn if I dont type....

He is an ordinary spy security/intelligence contractor - the US will do nothing more than some short term, limited measures were the GoP to not bend the rules to grant Davis immunity. The reason the US is acting the way it is is precisely because they know the GoP are aid whores and are hoping for the pressure and threats to work.

Pakistan is by no means 'damned' if it refuses to bend the rules for America's sake. As many economic analysts have pointed out, basic reforms in taxation and governance can yield billions of dollars in savings a year for Pakistan, equal to or more than the aid from the US and IFI's. Pakistan can survive, and prosper, without US aid - the ability and willingness of the corrupt scum in the GoP currently of doing that is under a cloud.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Hi,

This board must not be a springboard for members to make terrorist threats to any country---this board is not here for the terrorist agenda---memebers must refrain from using this language and the MODS / ADMINS etc must take charge and delete any threats / blood letting and terrorist activityies against others.

There are over 2000 posts in this thread and I will admit up front that I have not read anywhere close to a majority of them.

Please let us know specifically which post is an issue and we will address it as we see fit.

There is a limit to stupidity---all this bragging my pak colleagues are doing is similiar to the "SPAGHETTI SYNDROME"----which mean----looks so strong when dry---but then pour some water on it an it becomes jello----or put pressure on it and it breaks into pieces.

Arguing for the rule of law and not bowing to threats and blackmail is hardly something to be categorized as 'bragging'.

 

[ashok321]

GoP are aid whores

GOP watch out for AIDS.....Lol

Pakistan is by no means 'damned' if it refuses to bend the rules for America's sake. As many economic analysts have pointed out, basic reforms in taxation and governance can yield billions of dollars in savings a year for Pakistan, equal to or more than the aid from the US and IFI's. Pakistan can survive, and prosper, without US aid - the ability and willingness of the corrupt scum in the GoP currently of doing that is under a cloud.

Pakistan has the lowest tax to GDP collection, and we have been watching the trend since its (Pak) inception, how many years more?
Any time table?
Untill then I will be assuming that yes, fish can ride the Kawasaki bike.....

 

[RescueRanger]

Hi,

I don't think that anyone of you have taken live shots---that is shot at a living thing---if you haven't then you have no clue what happens---how fast the time flies----

Someone as senior as yourself should not be making sweeping statements and assumptions. Having not only killed a fellow human to survive but done it to protect the lives of others in my charge i can tell you that it's a matter of do or die. But that does not mean i shoot the cycle walla passing my principal just because he was reaching into his pocket.

There is a massive difference between responsible discharge of your firearm and spraying and praying, depending on what technique you are taught to deploy Point Shooting, Applegate Shooting method, Double Tap or whatever... There is a difference between shoot to kill and shoot to survive.

Secondly don't be so critical of your PAKISTANI brethren.

 

[VCheng]

I believe, as I have been saying all along, that ALL sides need to calm down their rhetoric, and wait for the process to play out in a rational manner. The stakes are high no doubt, but adding frenzy to the mix will not achieve anything useful for anybody.

 

[r3alist]

the OP should be continually updated with the latest developments, will save time for those of us who cant trawl through 200 pages

 

[Gin ka Pakistan]

Common sense prevailing among most knowers of this case would agree that RD would be let off, just because Quereshi has been compromised, and that means GOP has eliminated a known staunch opponent. If that happened (any time soon), it means GOP has seen the light at the end of tunel - to preserve K-L dollars flow. And not to speak of US citizens ill will towards Pakistan.


Gallup poll : 76% of Americans have an unfavorable opinion of Pakistan.

Hence I conclude that Pakistan is in a bind - damn if I do, damn if I dont type....

and with Indian propaganda about Pakistan soon 100% Americans would have unfavorable opinion of Pakistan , Dam Indians are good in it

 

[53fd]

I must say, this incident has consolidated my contempt for the US government's dirty imperialistic foreign policies. Yet, the government must not be equated with the American people, the latter for the most part being wonderful and warm hearted. We must not equate the actions of the government with the people, and I am sad that this incident is increasing the hatred towards the American people (when it should be solely targeting the actions of the government) in some people. I have heard people threatening the Americans living in Pakistan, and this is sad and disrespectful to the honest (and the absolute majority) Americans living in Pakistan. Not everyone is a Faisal Shahzad or a Raymond Davis, and Pakistanis should learn to control and 'regulate' their anger, and channel it wisely. And the media should not use this incident to increase their TV ratings.

 

[53fd]

Although I must say, I hail the courage of Mehmood Shah Qureshi for standing up for the right thing even though he paid a price for it, after the pressure from vested interests (US government, Zardari, other stooges) on him, and because he was often portrayed in Pakistan of being a spineless stooge himself.

 

[r3alist]

we dont actually know all that much.

i would urge americans and pakistani's to think twice about what they KNOW before they speak, however 200 pages down the line that seems a bit pointless now, lol.

saying the motorcycled men were robbers is not a fact.

and also there is little clarity over the raymond's status, as far as i can tell.


however it is a fact what was recovered from this person looks highly suspicious.

and it also look as if he may have been in contact with terrorists within pakistan.

now americans, tell me, how does that look??


aside from that issue this situation, at least on the surface, is beautifully poised.

americans need their man back it seems, and they are used to getting their way with a pliant govt.

on the other hand elements within pakistan are grinding their heels and resisting.

(BTW, thank you american "allies", nice to know you dont think twice about f'ing us about in order to get your way)


pakistan needs american aid to some extent, also pakistan needs america not to atleast refrain from being hostile

on the same token pakistani awam are incensed, americans needs supply routes and pakistan cannot cave in at this stage...........



whats the next move, whats the middle ground?

 

[ajtr]

Debate: Row over 'killer' diplomat

In a tense stand-off, the US has demanded immediate release of American national Raymond Davis, held for gunning down two men in Lahore, amid reports that it had suspended all high-level dialogue with Pakistan over the issue. The US describes 36-year-old Davis as a diplomat who is a member of "technical and administrative staff" of its embassy in Islamabad, but some Pakistani media reports have suggested that the American might have been a CIA operative who shot down in a Lahore market two Pakistani men, who he said were trying to rob him. A new twist was added to the case when reports in the Pakistani media quoted a Pakistani intelligence official as saying that the two men killed by Davis on January 27 were were not armed robbers but intelligence agents assigned to trail him.TIMES NOW's Editor-in-Chief Arnab Goswami debates the issue with Lisa Curtis, Senior Fellow South Asia, Heritage Foundation; K C Singh, Former MEA Secretary and Tariq azeem, Former information Minister, Pakistan.

[video]http://www.timesnow.tv/videoshow/4364810.cms[/video]

 

[American Eagle]

Being subjected to two armed men trying to hold Mr. Davis up is grounds for self defense. He was as part of his job required to have a gun, and obviously it was used in self defense, which would be the simple reason he had and use it when faced with two armed robbers.

Forgotten in over a week of dialogue here is the fact that Davis had just gotten a large amount of cash from a Lahore bank ATM, which obviously was observed by the robbers who then tailed him and tried to hold him up at gun point.

 

[Hulk]

From what I can see trying to be neutral.
This is what seems to have happened.
Davis shot dead two ISI agents because they got to know something.
He was not a Diplomat.
Zardari and government is working overtime to get him released and even kicked Qurashi out for that matter.
Punjab government is not cooperating with center and hence this issue is getting complicated.

 

[secularbuster]

Being subjected to two armed men trying to hold Mr. Davis up is grounds for self defense. He was as part of his job required to have a gun, and obviously it was used in self defense, which would be the simple reason he had and use it when faced with two armed robbers.

Forgotten in over a week of dialogue here is the fact that Davis had just gotten a large amount of cash from a Lahore bank ATM, which obviously was observed by the robbers who then tailed him and tried to hold him up at gun point.

Thugs proclaim their innocence this way; innocent people depend on the court to proclaim their innocence. It shows that in Muslim states these americans are nothing short of thugs. Their attitude, talks, manners are that of mafia dons. I would like to ask this man how does he know that raymond did not act the way the beasts of Abu Gharib did? What would have happened if a Pakistani citizen acted this way in the US?

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

From what I can see trying to be neutral.
This is what seems to have happened.
Davis shot dead two ISI agents because they got to know something.
He was not a Diplomat.
Zardari and government is working overtime to get him released and even kicked Qurashi out for that matter.
Punjab government is not cooperating with center and hence this issue is getting complicated.

For Gods sakes those guys were not ISI!!!! ISI dnt carry 4 rounds in local made pistols without any protection or Surveillanc equipment.