Raymond Davis Case: Developing Story

[DV RULES]

if this is true, then it will set a bad precedence in intl diplomacy. it's like prisoner exchange by govt for a captured soldier by a terrorist group. sounds very undiplomatic!!

If this happened then it depends on our government she has to sit in the cage or not, as Davis obviously released if in exchange he will face court in US.
Undiplomatic or diplomatic not important, government already made sense to speak and what they need. A prison exchange with prison. So in next time think better while concentrate over diplomatic or undiplomatic. International relations is name of how to bypass rules.

These beautiful laws looks cute in books but not in reality and i think you know about it.

 

[Spring Onion]

JanaJi: This development is interesting, but for different reasons: Psychologically, this is just one more of a series of steps from "We will never let him go" to "We will let the courts decide" to "Well, we may let him go for this, that or the other" to the next few steps.

You are right but i see it would be an acceptable step for majority. besides such an arrangement will be beneficial for both and specially US supported govt in Pakistan for further tasks .

US has recently also threatened to cut off civilian exchange programs including in field of eduction and science which sounds more blackmailing

 

[VCheng]

You are right but i see it would be an acceptable step for majority. besides such an arrangement will be beneficial for both and specially US supported govt in Pakistan for further tasks .

US has recently also threatened to cut off civilian exchange programs including in field of eduction and science which sounds more blackmailing

JanaJi: Thank you for a very level headed post. I respect your point of view immensely.

 

[DV RULES]

Actually, Afia was arrested on the charges of terrorism, ala Masood Azhar, and you've captured an American to free that person, ala the hostages.

So yes, the analogy stays.

Then let me say that Davis case also not different, he shot to men in open crowded area, first act of killing, second act of terrorism (another story why this act is not included in case) third suspect spying.

 

[JanjaWeed]

Your govt already did that in hijacking case.

anyway its just a personal statement of a politician not Pakistani Govt stand.

jana.. c'mon you are better than this!! let's not compare govt of a country to group of terrorist hijackers!!

 

[Spring Onion]

Actually, Afia was arrested on the charges of terrorism, ala Masood Azhar, and you've captured an American to free that person, ala the hostages.

So yes, the analogy stays.

Afia is charged wrongly on charges of pointing gun at US soldiers in Afghanistan its NOT at all a case of terrorism, she did not kill anyone rather she was kept in illegal captivity by Americans at Bagram.

and i would just say bharatis are proving their self more than beasts by claiming if anyone has captured a killers.

 

[twoplustwoisfour]

Afia is charged wrongly on charges of pointing gun at US soldiers in Afghanistan its NOT at all a case of terrorism, she did not kill anyone rather she was kept in illegal captivity by Americans at Bagram.

and i would just say bharatis are proving their self more than beasts by claiming if anyone has captured a killers.

Please don't confuse your personal opinions with facts proven in the court of law.

 

[VCheng]

Afia is charged wrongly on charges of pointing gun at US soldiers in Afghanistan its NOT at all a case of terrorism, she did not kill anyone rather she was kept in illegal captivity by Americans at Bagram.

and i would just say bharatis are proving their self more than beasts by claiming if anyone has captured a killers.

JanaJi: She was arrested/kidnapped on Pakistani soil and then formally handed over to the Americans by Pakistani personnel of a certain agency. If there is any illegality in this process, it lies within Pakistan.

 

[Spring Onion]

jana.. c'mon you are better than this!! let's not compare govt of a country to group of terrorist hijackers!!

Your Indian Govt sat with that group of hijackers and freed them along with paying them bags full of dollars

so no i am not comparing your Indian govt with groups of hijackers because your govt is good at state terrorism than those hijackers

 

[Spring Onion]

JanaJi: She was arrested/kidnapped on Pakistani soil and then formally handed over to the Americans by Pakistani personnel of a certain agency. If there is any illegality in this process, it lies within Pakistan.

very right. And the point still remains the same that she is unlawfully wrongly punished for something she never did.

 

[Spring Onion]

Please don't confuse your personal opinions with facts proven in the court of law.

Please all of you bharatis should also not confused your personal one sided opinion with course of law in Pakistan regarding Davis case.


What was proven in US court the entire world has seen that so dont twist the event for supporting crime by an American

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Fair sir, how can slander against the deceased "woman", not be against the norms of civil discourse?? He is entitled to his opinion but that does not extend to defaming a women torn apart by grief. Even neutrality has certain limits.

The offending post has been deleted.

I request American Eagle and everyone else to avoid such comments in the future and limit yourselves to discussing the topic without disparaging others, especially those not directly involved in the events that resulted in the deaths of three people.

If the Americans want to call the two men 'thieves' and claim Davis has diplomatic immunity, that should be respected since that is the position the US government is taking, though we don't have to agree with it. The same with Pakistanis calling Davis a 'cold blooded murderer or spy. But please limit your comments to the individuals involved in the events.

 

[The HBS Guy]

Afia is charged wrongly on charges of pointing gun at US soldiers in Afghanistan its NOT at all a case of terrorism, she did not kill anyone rather she was kept in illegal captivity by Americans at Bagram.

1. She's not a diplomat neither is there any controversy regarding her diplomatic status.

2. Neither Govt. of Pakistan nor US Administration can be equated to terrorists even by the wildest stretch of imagination.

3. There's doubt regarding Aafia's Pakistani nationality. There's no doubt regarding Davis' nationality.

4. Aafia is accused of terrorism, Davis is not.

5. Aafia has been sentenced for life by a court.

6. There's no international precedent of such swapping in international relations.

7. The US doesn't work that way. They'll send a commando team and get Davis out rather than swapping him for a convicted terrorist.

8. It will set a very bad precedent in international relations. Think about it, tomorrow another country will arrest some country's nationals and ask for similar swapping or other demands to be met. Very bad precedent.

 

[American Eagle]

Statements from the inside Pakistan media regarding Raymond Allen Davis summarized are:

- Davis was faced with two armed robbers who tried to stick him up.

- Immediately prior to the same two robbers had successfully held up two Pakistani gentlemen taking their cell phones (2) and money/cash.

- Two robbers drove up to Davis in his car, which car was stuck in heavy traffic but robbers on motor cycles could move about whereas car was stuck in traffic...the two robbers pointed guns at Davis and attempted to hold him up.

- Davis responded by bringing out his gun, which is and was authorized for him to have as part of his job in diplomatic protection security work for the US Embassy.

- Davis apparently fired from inside his vehicle at the two armed robbers on motor cycles.

- Davis to date is not charged with murder but is being held for further orders from the GOP Foreign Ministry to clarify Davis's diplomatic status. The Pakistani Foreign Ministry has been ordered by the Pakistani court to rule formally and openly on the GOP recognition of diplomatic immunity for Mr. Davis.

- The facts which I believe and am following in the US and rest of the world media is the US Ambassador's statement that Davis is under US Diplomatic immunity, has a proper Paksitani VISA good through June, 2012, and per the US Ambassador and the US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton...Davis is being illegally held in violation of his factual diplomatic immunity.

- Mr. Davis was only involved with the two crooks/robbers who failed in their hold up attempt of him. There is allegedly a second issue not involving Mr. Davis of a pedestrian killed in a motoring accident also in Lahore in same area, same day, the media suggesting that the driver was a Pakistani who may be in the employ of the US Consulate there in Lahore.

- Pakistan police in Lahore have told the media also that the two robbers were involved in several other armed robberies which the police there were already looking into when the two robbers failed in their last hold up attempt. Mr. Davis fired at the two attacking robbers in self defense.

- Those cursing at me, using vile language are not dealing in the core fact...which is that the Pakistani Foreign Office has been told by the court there to rule on Davis diplomatic immunity, as the court cannot proceed with allegations against Davis until the court first knows clearly what the GOP FO opinion is on his, Davis, diplomatic immunity. The need for the FO to formerly rule is the agenda, the item which the court has ordered the GOP FO to rule on as it is the job and duty of the FO in such diplomatic matters to address Davis valid Diplomatic Passport and his valid Pakistan VISA thereon. I think the court has given the Pakistani Foreign Office 15 days within which to rule on Mr. Davis diplomatic immunity. Diplomatic Immunity as claimed by Mr. Davis, the US Ambassador and the US Department of State, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton.

- The sharp reaction by Members of the US Congress who recently visited Pakistan is a serious additional consideration. The entire US Congress is indicating it's displeasure and annoyance that Paksitan to this moment fails to recognize Davis diplomatic immunity.

- Yes, the duly elected US Congress can on it's own intiative start to cause problems for the GOP for their failure to observe international law whereby Davis does have diplomatic immunity.

- BOTTOM LINE: Various postings here "blaming" Davis for in their view being the bad guy simply failed to recognize and admit that the Pakistani media and police in Lahore have admitted the two killed in act of attempted armed robbery are known to them crooks.

- It baffles me and many here in the US that folks cannot understand that an authorized to carry a weapon by the US Embassy there in Pakistan diplomat, Mr. Davis, has yet to be recognized as in fact having full diplomatic immunity. Holding a US Diplomatic Passport with approved expires in June 2012 Pakistan VISA validates Mr. Davis as covered by Diplomatic Immunity. It remains for the Pakistani Foreign Office to obey their own court's Order for them, the Pakistani FO to acknowledge that Mr. Davis does have absolute diplomatic immunity.

- To repeat, Mr. Davis fired on the two robbers in self defense, fearing for his life with guns by them aimed at him.

 

[VCheng]

very right. And the point still remains the same that she is unlawfully wrongly punished for something she never did.

Thank you for conceding that the root of the illegality in her conviction lies within Pakistan. "Iss hamaam mein sab nangay hein."