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RAFALE IN ANGER: 10 Dispatches From A War Cockpit

That makes sense. Thanks a lot. So they split while Dassault is working on the ground figuring out the how to do what to know stuff. Now they entire 36 thing makes way more sense. You answered the puzzle to me.
As Modi said when the 36 off the shelf were agreed upon (in Paris, 2015)- they are for the IAF's immediate requirements.

DRAL is seeing >$1B in investment in the next 18 months alone, some serious infrastructure is being created in Nihan.
 
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The Chinese are playing a stupid game by provoking India under this govt/PM and under these circumstances. There is broad bi-partisan support for giving the Chinese a firm reply and this is one of the few govts/PMs that will actually turn this into a reality.

The Rafale is explicitly to be used against the Chinese, it is almost tailor made for this threat, all the Chinese are doing is making the decsion to order many more Rafales easier.
What's so funny? Pakistan is already making a 5th gen fighter moron, some research would do your thick head some good.
 
What's so funny? Pakistan is already making a 5th gen fighter moron, some research would do your thick head some good.
China may develop a nice looking 5th gen shell (like the J-20/31) for Pakistan and you may label it a "Pakistani/jointly developed 5th gen fighter" but that doesn't make it true.

How can Pakistan, a nation whose GDP is equivilant to Belgium's and R&D base amongst the lowest in the world hope to create a true 5th gen fighter within the next 30 years?

Ever heard of crawl, walk, run? Here Pakistan is attempting to compete in marathons before it has even stood up.
 
China may develop a nice looking 5th gen shell (like the J-20/31) for Pakistan and you may label it a "Pakistani/jointly developed 5th gen fighter" but that doesn't make it true.

How can Pakistan, a nation whose GDP is equivilant to Belgium's and R&D base amongst the lowest in the world hope to create a true 5th gen fighter within the next 30 years?

Ever heard of crawl, walk, run? Here Pakistan is attempting to compete in marathons before it has even stood up.


Like I said, research will show you Pakistan is making a 5th gen fighter.
 
I don't see it getting higher than 72
I guess @Abingdonboy has explained nicely, how numbers will stack in favor of Rafale. It is likely to replace a lot of legacy fighter bomber platforms and rest assured these numbers will buildup in similar manner as did MKI (initially only 30 were purchased in 1996, today order stands at 272 in 20 years).
+ there is a requirement of Indian navy as well (57 currently in RFI sage).
 
I guess @Abingdonboy has explained nicely, how numbers will stack in favor of Rafale. It is likely to replace a lot of legacy fighter bomber platforms and rest assured these numbers will buildup in similar manner as did MKI (initially only 30 were purchased in 1996, today order stands at 272 in 20 years).
+ there is a requirement of Indian navy as well (57 currently in RFI sage).

I'm not so sure of that. Hindustan also needs to develop its Tejas and will likely buy some F-16's as well. Not to mention 5th gen fighters will need to be procured too. So unless Hindustan wants to increase its fleet size, Rafale numbers are likely to remain no more than 126 max, but most likely 72 or around about that number considering how terribly the deal went.

Oh and Su-30MKI number stands at 230 currently.
 
Hindustan also needs to develop its Tejas
What does the Rafale have to do with the LCA? Both are entirely unrelated projects that have no overlap at all. The LCA is replacing the >200 MiG-21s, the Rafale is replacing the MiG-27/23 and Jaguars.


will likely buy some F-16's as well
No, just no.

The IAF has already rejected the most modern F-16 ever created.

Not to mention 5th gen fighters will need to be procured too
That will come but later (post 2025/6), the Rafale is the fighter for now.

So unless Hindustan wants to increase its fleet size
Yes, this is exactly what the IAF has to do. Currently it has around 33-34 fighter SQNs but its sanctioned strength is for 42 SQNs which will likely be increased to 45 by 2022 and 50 by 2027.

Rafale numbers are likely to remain no more than 126 max
Well 126 was the orginal minimum order under MMRCA with an option of 63 additional units (for a total of 189) but the situation is different today, the IAF is more ambitious today and more Jaguar DARIN II are being retired than had orginally been planned.

but most likely 72
Where do you get this figure from?? The bare minimum the IAF will get now is 108 units as it has already begun creating physical infrastructure at airbases to house 6 SQNs of the Rafale (6x18=108).

In the next few years a Rafale production line will be set up in India with a capacity to churn out 18 Rafales/year, this production line will be running for a minimum of 8 years and will cater to the requirements of both the IAF and IN.

Oh and Su-30MKI number stands at 230 currently.
272 are on order, this will be met around 2020-1 but the plant will need to be kept churning for another 5-7 years at least until the FGFA is ready to be produced at the Nasik plant.

Like I said, research will show you Pakistan is making a 5th gen fighter.
Pakistan can claim to be making the Starship Enterprise, that doesn't make it feasible.
 
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PHOTO / Shiv Aroor


When Indian Air Force chief Birender Singh Dhanoa takes off for France today and straps into an Armée de l’Air Rafale later this week, it’ll be shortly after he receives the most detailed operational briefing France has ever given to a foreign military chief. With videos, photographs and operational data, the Indian Air Chief Marshal will be provided the most comprehensive view of the Rafale in anger, chiefly the strike missions it has undertaken since last year over Iraq and Syria against Da’esh/ISIL targets.

India signed on for 36 Rafale fighters (the Indian Rafale detailed here) in September last year, over a year after the start of Opération Chammal, the French military’s participation under U.S.-led Operation Inherent Resolve. Ever since, the military wing at the Indian Embassy in Paris has been provided periodic official updates on the Rafale at war, information seen as imperative to the aircraft’s most important foreign customer. A customer, it must be noted, that chose the Rafale after what is widely regarded as the most grueling field evaluation, but has remained inquisitive about the aircraft in a true combat scenario.

Last month, Livefist had the opportunity to visit the French Navy’s Rafale hub, the Landivisiau air base in north-west France on the Brittany coast. It is here that the navy’s Rafale-Ms are based, maintained and its pilots trained for operations off the Charles De Gaulle aircraft carrier, which, when docked is based just under 1,000 km away at Toulon on France’s south-east Mediterranean coast. At Landivisiau, Livefist met with Rafale pilots from Flotille 11F, one of three Rafale M squadrons, each providing an immersive first-hand view of combat operations over Libya, Iraq and Syria. Among those tales from angry Rafale cockpits at war, we choose ten:

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A Flotille 11F Rafale M that has seen action over Iraq

1. “Before Libya, the Rafale-M was on teenage missions. Libya was our first adult mission,” Landivisiau base Commanding Officer Capt. Pascal Lassan tells Livefist, referring to the eight years (2002-2010) that Rafales were deployed over Afghanistan, their first combat mission. No Rafale pilot disagrees. Cassan, who flew one of the Rafales that entered airspace over Libya in March 2011 designates Opération Harmattan a true ‘gamechanger’ for the aircraft and its pilots. Flying combat air patrol missions against Gaddafi’s desperate fighter jets, Cassan admits the Rafales got their first true trial by fire in Libya, stretching out their new laser pods, Link 16 and rules of engagement that had to be updated literally on the fly. It was over Libya, Cassan says, that the Rafale first got a chance to demonstrate its ‘omnirole’ tagline. ‘Libya would shape everything that the Rafale would do going forward,’ he says.

Your correspondent, incidentally, was on the ground in Libya during a bombing run by Libyan fighters just days before the Rafales arrived on March 19, 2011.

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Originally an F1 standard Rafale, now an F3


2. A Commander-rank Rafale M pilot who has flown missions both during Opération Harmattan in Libya as well as the ongoing Opération Chammal against Da’esh targets in Iraq and Syria, says mission endurance and potency have multiplied manifold since 2011. For instance, while missions over Libya were no more than 2.5 hours, combat sorties over Iraq and Syria currently average 6.5 hours with three mid air tank-ups. Rafales currently have a 600 nautical miles unrefuelled range from the aircraft carrier. Crews maintaining the jets on the carrier told Livefist that the two squadrons at sea enjoy a 97% availability rate (as opposed to 70% rate on shore).

“I was deployed on three six hour missions in two days in September last year, all involving deep fight raids and combat air patrol over Iraq. We can stretch that number. Things have changed completely,” the officer says. “We’re operating with other forces, principally the U.S. Navy and Air Force. Staying in the air longer to provide reconnaissance, targeting or other support is common now from both sides for aircraft that have expended their weapons in strikes.”

Livefist was shown video footage of a coordinated strike earlier this year in Ramadi, Iraq involving a U.S. MQ-9 Reaper that had expended its armament load, but needed to effect a strike because intelligence had pointed to a closing time window on a vehicle-borne improvised explosive device (VBIED). The Rafale pilot who was called in to help explained the loop: the Reaper was cleared to engage the target, but couldn’t because it had finished its Hellfires on the same mission a few hours earlier. The Rafale, flying a close air support mission nearby was summoned to link up with the Reaper and receive its target solution. The course of this target sharing includes France’s own independent vetting of targets under the Chammal chain of command. Once cleared, the video shows the Rafale deploying an AASM Hammer guided bomb to destroy the VBIED.

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Thales AREOS imagery from a Rafale / Source

3. Rafale pilots at Landivisiau cannot stop talking about the AREOS recce pod. One pilot spoke of how the imagery AREOS pods produce during even high speed low altitude runs have upped the premium on Rafale sorties as part of Operation Inherent Resolve. “Rafale pod imagery is almost a currency now in the air over Iraq and Syria. We share those images, and the premium placed on our mission and involvement goes up. Coalition partners love the imagery capability they’re getting to tap into through our missions,” he told Livefist. (The AREOS pod comes with the Indian Rafale.)


4. Capt. Cassan, who says he has flown F/A-18s for three years and deems it a ‘versatile multi-mission jet’, says that when it comes to long range sensors, the Rafale still manages to see ‘much better than what the Americans can see’. He’s referring to the Thales RBE 2 AESA radar on the Rafale. ‘Every pilot that’s now flying over Iraq or Syria will tell you that they’ve got or are getting more than they’ve expected in terms of sensors and tracking systems. The Meteor missile is just going to take all of that together and multiply it manifold. We cannot wait to see it deployed,’ says one of the pilots.


5. ‘We drop more GBU-12s than any other weapon at present,’ confirms the Commander-rank pilot quoted before. Over Mosul, the pilot says, Rafale crews have effectively deployed Sagem AASM Hammer bombs (SBU-54/38/64), which have reportedly proven highly reliable against moving targets. The AASM kitted CBEMS 250 is also expected to see greater usage, the pilots indicated.

“I dropped an SBU-38 recently about 90 feet from a mosque in Mosul. There was clean visual confirmation of a VBIED under preparation. It was a precision attack with no apparent collateral damage,” he says. The BLU-126/B of the US Navy is currently the major low collateral damage bomb in use, with France waiting for its own — trials currently on. Pilots say they’re waiting for GBU-24s to be cleared for Rafale carrier operations.


The SCALP stand-off cruise missile has also seen heightened use under Operation Chammal. A pilot who launched SCALP weapons on two occasions in 2015 in Iraq and Syria says it is, not surprisingly, the most prized weapon currently in the Rafale’s strike arsenal. ‘The opportunity to send out a SCALP always means a mission to destroy a heavy duty target in an environment that could pose an air defence threat. While our young pilots are ever ready to get into dirty airspace to open up with bomb raids, each is waiting for a chance to let a SCALP loose,” he says.

6. “We’ve been tracking the Russians as a matter of routine, including the Kuznetsov battle group and submarines too,” one pilot says. He wouldn’t confirm if the Russian submarines tracked by French Rafale-Atlantique crews include the new generation Russian Krasnodar diesel electric submarine, which deployed Kalibr cruise missiles against Da’esh targets in May this year. “We’ve got to keep a daily tab of what Russian and Syrian aircraft are doing. The E-2Cs from Charles de Gaulle have a full time job, and we’re constantly hooked up,” he says.

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MBDA ASMP-A nuclear cruise missile display at Landivisiau base

7. In 2016, with Russian jets from the Kuznetsov over western Syria, Rafale crews operating in the area were tasked with entering airspace to acquire something they didn’t have: the attack mode of a Russian Su-33 radar. Two Rafales used their SPECTRA integrated electronic warfare systems on a 90 minute mission that finally ended in success. “It was a small but very important mission, and it helped sharpen how we use electronic warfare and signature acquisition in some of the most difficult and crowded airspace in the world,” a pilot who was in one of the Rafales says.

8. Every Rafale pilot who has flown sorties over Iraq or Syria that Livefist spoke to confirmed that Da’esh/ISIS had experienced a major loss in offensive capability, but still maintained potent defences against air strikes. “They’ve suffered a huge loss of territory, including Mosul. But they are still resilient,” one pilot says. “There is a definite SAM threat over Syria and Libya. The Da’esh still employs a variety of tactics to evade Rafale strikes. These include mobility, terrain shaping, obstruction, camouflage and concealment, even enormous smoke clouds like Desert Storm.”

9. Air strikes in Mosul have proven more difficult than any other part of Iraq, Rafale pilots at Landivisiau confirm. One pilot, who flew missions there earlier this year, says the challenge went beyond the fact that strikes needed to be precision attacks in built-up areas. “It was very hard to target in Mosul. We were operating in crowded airspace. It wasn’t clean at all,” he says. Adding to the cluttered airspace were veritable swarms of drones deployed both by Da’esh as well as Iraqi forces — quadcopters sometimes armed with grenades. “The game-changer will be low collateral damage bombs that currently in trials for use in Iraq and Syria. Another mission like Mosul will be difficult without those,” the pilot says.

10. The Angry Rafale-M is rapidly becoming a Rafale after dark, and pilots flying missions off the Charles de Gaulle carrier swear by how much easier they’re finding it to trap by night than in daylight. “It’s almost a pleasure to trap at night. All we’ve got to do is align the vector instead of the mirror. With a wider HUD, landing is no longer the anxiety it used to be,” says Capt. Cassan, the Landivisiau CO. With half of all Rafale M pilots qualified to night trap at sea, half of all current operations have shifted to after dark hours over Iraq and Syria.

https://www.livefistdefence.com/2017/07/rafale-in-anger-10-dispatches-from-a-war-cockpit.html

@Blue Marlin @AUSTERLITZ @Nilgiri @Abingdonboy @anant_s @MilSpec @nair

I hope and pray we eventually get three digit figure of this bird my friend. That's all I gotta say.
 
Hindustan also needs to develop its Tejas and will likely buy some F-16's as well.
True.
It simply isn't possible to have complete fleet consisting of twin engine fighters, it is very costly to operate that way.
LCA and F-16/Grippen will cover that area and for point defence duties, these single engine fighters will perform the duty.
Not to mention 5th gen fighters will need to be procured too.
FGFA and AMCA will comeup in about 15 years from now in FOC, but unless China starts to field a strong fleet of J-20 and J-31, Generation 5 fighters question shouldn't worry India much. the technology is still to mature not to mention the associated weapon systems as well.
Rafale numbers are likely to remain no more than 126 max, but most likely 72 or around about that number considering how terribly the deal went.
A single Rafale replaces several legacy aircrafts (@Vergennes @Taygibay @Abingdonboy gentlemen you can expound more on this)
Therefore every omnirole rafale you get, performs several functions in a single platform for much lower unit mission cost. So even with 126 numbers (~7 squadrons), it is like replacing 10-12 squadrons of legacy fighters like MiG 21/23/27 and even Jaguars.
So its not just a question of making up numbers, but huge qualitative and technical jump, a fighter like Rafale brings in.
Oh and Su-30MKI number stands at 230 currently.
Yes Currently! more are being manufactured.
 
This jet is going to change the dynamics of air warfare in this part of the world.
Well contrary to your belief..paf seems asleep for quite a long time..other than JF-17 there is nothing else in their planning for near future
and plz don't say that Jf-17 can take on rafael
J-31 future is uncertain
and the NG program by air chief is a long term solution which is definitely appreciated but we need something now in 3-4 years..not after 10 years
 

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