PTI threatens to block NATO supply

[batmannow]

what Fatman has pointed and which u have realized is exactly what i dont agree with. it doesnt matter if the US has been true to its word. its how people in pakistan perceive it and rightly so. US does not have any legitimacy to attack targets within our territory irrespective of how truthful they are. and it is this lack of legitimacy which makes them unaccountable to the consequences of their strikes. at the same time, no red flags are raised when our own air force makes targeted strikes as they have every incentive to get it right - this is irrespective of if we agree with the overall strategy or not.
and the whole majority of those who are against drone strikes at the very same time speak against the TTP. that they do not agree with your way of dealing with crisis does not make them supporters of taliban.

Might is right is the golden rule. On which this world of ours is running now?
Its surly not running on the wrong perceptions & with wrong prapoganda by ever black mailing JI of pakistan?
Which is using terrorism of talibans to capture power in pakistan silently?
& US & NATO countries arent ready to see another of mullaa , being in power At islamabad?

So people in FATA are not our people?

They are ours, but the terrorists there arent?

 

[Argus Panoptes]

I'm ever ready for a phada. Back in 2004 I figured Pakistan main koi kaam phada liay beghair nahi hota.

I don't see PTI taking such a huge step right away - or ever - but if they do prove me wrong, I'll support it.

.............

There is no need for a phada, if you are smart.

Declare NATO transport "important". Make a group of two persons walk, yes, WALK in front of every truck just to ensure that the road is clear for the important cargo to pass through safely. Make sure it stops when the walkers need to rest or eat and for namaz. Unload and check the containers at all entry and exit points. Designate a few important roads to be used for NATO transport only. Add a provincial tax levy to pay for damage to roads. Assign "approved' drivers to accompany every truck.

Oh yes, much can be done without a phada.

 

[Argus Panoptes]

Bhai jaan hum log baray baghairat hain (to put it bluntly).

Our nation is nowhere near as cohesive and robust that we will withstand sanctions or the fall out from destroying a drone or messing with the big powers. We would be taking a U turn before you can say 'drone'. Our people would be running to the embassies and will be crying that why we did it.

Point is, instead of destroying a drone or stopping it altogether, make a formal framework for it. There is collaboration done already to some extent, so why not increase that collaboration and take the mantle on yourself. After all the problem with people is of sovereignty, so if we take up the mantle the issue of sovereignty doesn't arise. Get into an agreement with the US, we laze the targets and give the go ahead and US strikes. If the US has some intel, it shares with us and then we give the go ahead and the US strikes.

Go public with this agreement and get your intel spot on to limit civilian casualties.

There is a framework for it already. We have given permission for USA to carry out drone strikes, while we publicly denounce them.

 

[muse]

it doesnt matter if the US has been true to its word. its how people in pakistan perceive it and rightly so. US does not have any legitimacy to attack targets within our territory irrespective of how truthful they are. and it is this lack of legitimacy which makes them unaccountable to the consequences of their strikes. at the same time, no red flags are raised when our own air force makes targeted strikes as they have every incentive to get it right - this is irrespective of if we agree with the overall strategy or not.
and the whole majority of those who are against drone strikes at the very same time speak against the TTP. that they do not agree with your way of dealing with crisis does not make them supporters of taliban.

Legitimacy? Well, as long as you are persuaded that it's a fruitful policy - By the way, at which point , by what criteria, will you decide that perhaps the best way of killing off TTP and associated Islamist is best accomplished by Drones, For instance, if the US agree that it will be the Pakistanis who will take credit for Drone strikes, will that allow you to reconsider?

 

[Awesome]

So people in FATA are not our people?

The PA carries out government sanctioned operations in FATA against anti-Pak elements, by definition those elements are not out people.

Although indiscriminate attacks are what parties like PTI have opposed even in FATA.

In this case, pro-Pak elements will be blocking Nato supply routes. Perhaps even KPK police can be ordered to block such a route. Hence with KPK's elected government backing. You think PA will carry out an order to attack a provincial government?

 

[TruthSeeker]

The PTI are such babies!!! Stop talking! Do it. Blow up the NATO supply trucks and kill the drivers! Why such timidity?????

 

[W.11]

The PA carries out government sanctioned operations in FATA against anti-Pak elements, by definition those elements are not out people.

Although indiscriminate attacks are what parties like PTI have opposed even in FATA.

In this case, pro-Pak elements will be blocking Nato supply routes. Perhaps even KPK police can be ordered to block such a route. Hence with KPK's elected government backing. You think PA will carry out an order to attack a provincial government?

sanctioned by whom, US?

 

[Awesome]

Bhai jaan hum log baray baghairat hain (to put it bluntly).

Our nation is nowhere near as cohesive and robust that we will withstand sanctions or the fall out from destroying a drone or messing with the big powers. We would be taking a U turn before you can say 'drone'. Our people would be running to the embassies and will be crying that why we did it.

Point is, instead of destroying a drone or stopping it altogether, make a formal framework for it. There is collaboration done already to some extent, so why not increase that collaboration and take the mantle on yourself. After all the problem with people is of sovereignty, so if we take up the mantle the issue of sovereignty doesn't arise. Get into an agreement with the US, we laze the targets and give the go ahead and US strikes. If the US has some intel, it shares with us and then we give the go ahead and the US strikes.

Go public with this agreement and get your intel spot on to limit civilian casualties.

To accept that, it would betray a few things we hold dear and are just avoiding talking about it.

1. Foreign forces can operate upon Pakistan whenever they want to. There can be no acceptance of this. Why just US drones, let India carry out its operation in Muridke then too. Afterall opposing India would have grave consequences as well, their military and airforce is much larger than ours.

This argument of grave consequences is akin to saying Pakistan does not have the right to exist freely. Then close down Pakistan, give it to India, they'll probably do a better job because come hell or whatever, Indians will never think in the same way ke America ke agay jhuk jao, there will be grave consequences.

If you agree to this, there's probably nothing you can put your foot down on.

2. As PA is Pakistan's army it is their duty to protect us from foreign attacks. It's not a matter of choice. It's their duty. A foreign force is coming and bombing our soil, and they are doing nothing? Reason being the government hasn't taken the decision, perhaps, but as far as I know defending Pakistan from attacks by foreign a foreign military is the standing order of the Pak Armed forces.

3. How do you justify this to the people of FATA, where these signature strikes (mind you I can say with some surety that most have not been intel based strikes) are slaughtering the civilians. Miranshah is a populated region, just look back at the history of drone strikes and see how many have landed in populated regions. The joke among former Obama aides is that he'd shoot at 3 guys doing jumping jacks as that's a signature of militant training activity!! That's ridiculous! How can you agree to this?

4. Have Drone strikes really worked? You can count its worthwhile kills on your fingertips and the loss of innocent lives? A data that may be so staggeringly high that the white house has specifically ordered American forces to not collect such information. First Drone strike happened in 2004. Who here can honestly say in Pakistan terrorism has decreased since 2004? So basically chankhana hasil horaha hai.

5. The argument that we should allow this as it gets at least one known militant after 3-4 months of bombing is also preposterous. If I told you... Just one of you, sacrifice just any one of your child and I can wave the magic wand that will end terrorism in ALL of Pakistan today... Will you sacrifice just that one child?

Now how do you ask the people of FATA to sacrifice 2000 of theirs...

sanctioned by whom, US?

Despite what you may believe they are still officially signed off by the civilian government.

 

[Awesome]

The PTI are such babies!!! Stop talking! Do it. Blow up the NATO supply trucks and kill the drivers! Why such timidity?????

Why don't you go blow up bombs the next time you have a political disagreement? Civilized people don't do that.

PTI is now in KPK government, it controls KPK police. It should use them.

There is no need for a phada, if you are smart.

Declare NATO transport "important". Make a group of two persons walk, yes, WALK in front of every truck just to ensure that the road is clear for the important cargo to pass through safely. Make sure it stops when the walkers need to rest or eat and for namaz. Unload and check the containers at all entry and exit points. Designate a few important roads to be used for NATO transport only. Add a provincial tax levy to pay for damage to roads. Assign "approved' drivers to accompany every truck.

Oh yes, much can be done without a phada.

That's still a phada, perhaps a smart phada, but a phada nonetheless.

 

[Rank]

Namaz Shareef ka kehna hey meray chutay bhai ke tarhan Imran Khan be Joshi-e-Kitabat may dhamki daygaya... sorry paye jaan muaah love you Ameriiiikaaan

 

[batmannow]

Why don't you go blow up bombs the next time you have a political disagreement? Civilized people don't do that.

PTI is now in KPK government, it controls KPK police. It should use them.



That's still a phada, perhaps a smart phada, but a phada nonetheless.

Using KpK police to stop nato supplies going in to afghanistan from karachi via baluchistan,s chamman boder? Wow?

 

[Peaceful Civilian]

Choti tind and Bari tind should also take step to stop drone strikes. I hope that they will do it

 

[Armstrong]

The PTI are such babies!!! Stop talking! Do it. Blow up the NATO supply trucks and kill the drivers! Why such timidity?????

Oh shut up you naughty boy we're not gonna blow anyone up !

So hows the wife & kids, young man ?

 

[batmannow]

Choti tind and Bari tind should also take step to stop drone strikes. I hope that they will do it

Instead pushing them in the wrong direction. Why dont PTI govt of KPK ask, talibans to surrender themselves so that, there would be no reason left for drones? Logicly?

 

[Peaceful Civilian]

Instead pushing them in the wrong direction. Why dont PTI govt of KPK ask, talibans to surrender themselves so that, there would be no reason left for drones? Logicly?

Dialogue mate, Dialogue is needed!! There are Taliban who believes in dialogue.
Military action is not long term solution. Either you go with full scale war and demolish them in few strikes or other option is dialogue. Half war or limited operation is not long term solution because their relative will not sit back and they will reply back.. When you kill one Taliban, it means you are taking panga will 100 members. They contains tribe and big groups. As i said, go for full scale war or other option is dialogue!!
War may continue for 25 years. We need to stop it .