Private Players in Defence - Why ignored in India - Cause and Solution

[1nd1a]

Friends,

I am starting this thread to understand and share our knowledge on Indian defense companies. Why are they so reluctant in R&D and why GoI/MoD is not supporting them. Why domestic companies are not given equal chances or sharing some work load from DRDO initially.

I am sure there all lot of GURUs here who will be able to contribute to this thread.

Welcome EVERYONE....

 

[1nd1a]

Indian Army Scouts For New 120mm Mortar System

The Indian Army has called for information from prospective bidders for a contract for an unspecified number of new 120-mm long-range mortar systems. The Army has called for information from companies in Israel, Finland, Russia and the US.

LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: Indian Army Scouts For New 120mm Mortar System

This is one such scenario where I don't see any domestic companies name. I am not very informed about the complexities involved in producing mortar. However, personally I believe its much more easier then the projects Indian defense companies are currently undertaken. Then Why not giving first chance to Indian Company? Transfer some knowhow from DRDO to domestic companies and then lets give them some time to work on and some financial benefits.

 

[1nd1a]

Indian Coastguard For Major Firepower Purchases

The Indian Coastguard is in the market for a large number of marine guns, and has invited information from global vendors. Its shopping list includes 100 12.7-mm marine guns, 70 20-mm marine guns, 36 30-mm marine guns and 36 40-mm marine guns, all for integration on existing and future vessels. The ICG has also floated tenders for six new 2,000-ton offshore patrol vessels (OPVs), 14 fast patrol vessels and 20 new interceptor boats.

LiveFist - The Best of Indian Defence: Indian Coastguard For Major Firepower Purchases

-- I know we are constructing OPV's ingeniously. I believe in the case of ship/boat building we are getting better day by day. I am more concerned about guns which we are purchasing from other countries. Why not in India. Relatively easy to make then why go outside....

 

[1nd1a]

The Light Combat Helicopter

Finally, Its here. Its a hard work of 42 months as we all know it is developed from DHRUV. The best part in LCH is it has a narrow fuselage(normally all attack helicopter has) but this was some thing new for INDIAN scientist and they did it.

Looks good. Weapon carrying capacity is good as well. However, I thing is it a bit too late and too less. As per my knowledge IAF wants 65 of them and 114 required by Army.

How well will it prove itself when the world has

# TAI/AgustaWestland T-129
# AH-1 SuperCobra
# Agusta A129 Mangusta
# Eurocopter Tiger
# CAIC WZ-10

To name a few attack helicopter. But still proud to be an India and its accomplishments in 42 months on LCH.

 

[1nd1a]

Indian Army Scouts For Smart Shells

The Indian Army has invited information from global contractors for Sensor Fused Munitions (SFMs) for its 155mm calibre guns. The Army's RFI says it is looking to "enhance the accuracy of existing in-service ammunition.

Photo M982 Excalibur guided shell made by Raytheon-BAE Bofors.

Personally speaking, I am very disappointed. We say that we have expertise to send satellite in space. We are working on chandrayaan II and we have lined for man missing to moon and we don't have any one working on precise weapon like this one.

 

[shaktiman2010]

@topic,

because caste-ism rules India. Baniyas are fearful of punjabi, maratha, southie business lobbies getting too much stronger. And politicians are fearful of private families(ambanis, ruias) getting too much power at national level.

The friction between politicians, races and business families is prime reason responsible for keeping domestic private players out of big defense R&D projects.

Indians are basically same backward fools who were took over by British centuries back. Still today, Indian politicians trust Israeli, Russians more than their own Indian businessmen and families.

On average, Indian politicians prefer Russians, Israelis and Americans to make crucial Radar,missile systems for India than some Indian business family.

Now, you can reject what I said, but thats reality of India.

 

[1nd1a]

INS Shivalik, India's First Home-Built Stealth Frigate

Good to see the progress. I keep seeing couple of freights and destroyers inauguration in a month. It looks like we are finally reaching at a stage where we can be self reliance on ship building capacity, still a long way to go. I am also aware that some part\instruments in Shivalik are imported(read in an article). Still the improvement is preety well.

I was also going through an article where it says that government is taking some steps to increase ship building facilities around the country. I would suggest that lets have some private players in these facilities for there learning purpose.

We have to keep track of Chinese as well. They are building 60 out of 100 ships in the world where as India is just 1.69 out of 100.

 

[1nd1a]

NAL-Mahindra Multirole General Aviation Aircraft NM5-100 Detailed

The first prototype of the 5-seater civil aircraft, NM5, may be ready to take to the skies in July 2010. Jointly developed by NAL and Mahindra Aerospace Pvt Ltd. over the last 26 months, the NM5 is a multi-role, multi-mission aircraft.

The Directorate General of Civil Aviation is expected to certify the aircraft by December next year.

A model of the NM5 is on display at the Aero India show. “The NM5 has been entirely designed and developed by NAL and Mahindra Aerospace. The internal model has already been tested at the IISc’s wind tunnel road facility. The aircraft is expected to be priced between Rs 1.2 crore and Rs 1.4 crore,” project manager, NM5, at the NAL, Satish Rohidekar said.

The engine, propeller and certified seats of the aircraft will be imported as will the raw material like aluminium alloy sheets and hardware such as, nuts, bolts, washers and rivets, he explained.
The NM5 can be used as a trainer, for transporting cargo, medical evacuation, tourism, VIP travel and for training pilots. “We hope to market the NM5 in international markets and have already received a very positive response for it,“ said Dr Karthik Krishnamurthy, chief technology officer, Mahindra Aerospace.


If this baby is ready on time India's Basic Trainer Competition will become hot.

 

[1nd1a]

India's IJT Sitara LSP-1

After a long delay of Intermediate trainer SITARA is here. Alao known as HJT-36 will replace the HJT-16 Kiran in its role as a trainer (Stage-2) in the Indian Air Force. It has a conventional jet trainer design, with a low, swept wing, staggered cockpits and small air intakes on either side of its fuselage.

HAL was awarded a contract in 1999 by the Government of India for the completion of development, testing and certification of two prototype IJT aircraft.

The Indian Air Force has placed placed an order for 73 aircraft, of which the first 12 are in production. The order by the Indian Air Force could eventually grow to 250 aircraft.

The aircraft can also be used in light-attack role. It has five external hardpoints for carrying weapon systems. There is one centre-line hardpoint under the fuselage and two weapon pylons under each wing for carrying rocket and gun pods and bombs. The maximum external payload is 1,000 kg. There are lot of countries buying similar kind of aircraft from Chinese(K-8). We can trap a good foreign sale for Sitara if it proves itself.

 

[1nd1a]

Arjun Tanks!

Some good news for the people who are working on ARJUN for long long time. When it was shown to army for the first time it was hiped and delivered nothing. After ages ARJUN has really improved. I am sure the lesson learned from this will be utilized into ARJUN MARK II.

I keep talking about private players in defense as we see in the US. For tanks I was informed that the infrastructure building is the biggest problem to start with. I was recently going through an article in 8ak that there are some SEZ's coming up for defense industries. I hope that solves the issue and we can see some progress on tanks.

 

[ramu]

@topic,

because caste-ism rules India. Baniyas are fearful of punjabi, maratha, southie business lobbies getting too much stronger. And politicians are fearful of private families(ambanis, ruias) getting too much power at national level.

The friction between politicians, races and business families is prime reason responsible for keeping domestic private players out of big defense R&D projects.

Indians are basically same backward fools who were took over by British centuries back. Still today, Indian politicians trust Israeli, Russians more than their own Indian businessmen and families.

On average, Indian politicians prefer Russians, Israelis and Americans to make crucial Radar,missile systems for India than some Indian business family.

Now, you can reject what I said, but thats reality of India.

Shaktiman, I never thought this day would come but we are 100% in agreement on this.

 

[1nd1a]

HAL's Light Utility Helicopter

Good to see this baby as its going to be inducted in IAF/Army very soon. It reduced foreign competition into half(187:197). This means lot of dollars are saved and self dependence in this field. I hope we don't have to buy these kind of helicopter after the current contract of 197 from outside.

Its derived from DHRUV in looks as well. Point to be noted is that if we have one single successful product many subversion can be created. Good example for other hardware manufacturers of defense goods.

 

[SpArK]

Expertise in one field doesn't necessarily mean we are experts in all the fields. Serious Infrastructure , funding and a free hand in taking crucial decisions at a swift pace and at the right place are very necessary factors in becoming a major player in technology.


Still we are doing a wonderful job even when compared to most European nations.

 

[1nd1a]

@topic,

because caste-ism rules India. Baniyas are fearful of punjabi, maratha, southie business lobbies getting too much stronger. And politicians are fearful of private families(ambanis, ruias) getting too much power at national level.

The friction between politicians, races and business families is prime reason responsible for keeping domestic private players out of big defense R&D projects.

Indians are basically same backward fools who were took over by British centuries back. Still today, Indian politicians trust Israeli, Russians more than their own Indian businessmen and families.

On average, Indian politicians prefer Russians, Israelis and Americans to make crucial Radar,missile systems for India than some Indian business family.

Now, you can reject what I said, but thats reality of India.

Thanks for your opinion. I do agree with you but not totally. I see some private players are starting taking part in R&D like Mahindra, Tata, L&T to name few.

To just add on your thought, I would say it will take time this is a new dimension new industry in itself for Indian companies. We will be there, we can question the time line though. GoI/MoD knows that advanced technologies are hard to come from foreign companies they will have to either develop it or forget about it.

Mahindra bought 2 small aircraft company of Australia and we have a good result the NM5 which is being developed with NAL. This can be used for basic jet trainer in India(I had posted earlier).

Mahindra, Tata and L&T are working with foreign companies for armed vehicles for Indian army and I found them good.

I saw Mahindra AXE(looks like duplicate of Hammer of US army) which is given to Indian army for field trials.

Tata work on F-INSAN is not hidden. They have developed some new stuff.

Work on ship building and helicopters are increased and they are getting better day by day.

So, we just have to wait and watch. We are coming from behind. I know some of them are Public companies(I named) but private companies will be encouraged after they see the success from public companies like HAL, NAL none of the private companies are going to invest and suffer a loss until they see a huge profit.

Thoughts are

 

[hal-fgfa]

Just one question

is there any difference b/w Light Utility Helicopter and Light Observation Helicopter???