Possible steps to counter the rising threat from IAF ?

[M.AsfandYar]

in the 65 war, we had qualitative edge, which we have lost now

1]if we are considering a 400 jets paf inventory , then around 100jets should be of hitech level.. near to the 4.5 gen mark.

2]there should be different jets combo variety
f16/j10 or rafale to deal with su30/f18 combo

so iaf could not make a universal strategy to deal with our frontline jets i.e
if one frontline aircraft fails in war or gets embargoed, others might compensate]

3]our airforce should also be balanced and have aircrafts of light/medium and heavy category..
like indian lca-f18-su30
we should have jf17-f16/j10-rafale?


4]rest of the 300 can be filled by jf17 different batch versions to boost quantity and some quality

5]iaf might endup with f35 aswell.[once iaf tastes the american stuff, theres no going back]
we should keep our eyes open for alternative 5th gen jets

a little note on rafales..
*the platform can be less in quantity.i.e if bought in only couple of squadrons ,, it would not damage our relations with china rather diversify our front line options and take the pressure away from our jf17 fleet
*french equipments are costly yes.. but reliable aswell.also they are willing to sell... these 2 variables are also important... (how many other countries are offering their front line/ 'qualitative/ jets to us?).
cost will always be a problem.... but qualitative defence must always be the priority
now the question would be if the program slows down so much that we would have to skip a 4.5 gen combo [f16 +rafale] in favour of some 5th gen fighter

China is offering J-10. Its their frontline and equivalent to Rafale and considrbly cheaper.

 

[Storm Force]

Assiaiant

J10 is no where near the same technology as the Rafale

The french fighter boasts working AESA radars
fifth generation EW suite in spectra
Soon the most advanced ram jet BVR in the world with meteore
Stealth cruise missles like scalp
Twin engines with crystal blade technology

J10 is cheaper because it has none of the above especialy the engine technology and highly advanced european avionics and weapons mix.

At best a J10 sits at the level of the F16 /52

When IAF does the sign the deal for 126 RAFALES PAF will not a lot more than 36 j10 OR 18 additional F16/52s

Only suitable answers

Typhoon
F60/J31


ESPECIALLY since you guys will buy such smal nos of advanced fighters due to budgets

 

[M.AsfandYar]

Assiaiant

J10 is no where near the same technology as the Rafale

The french fighter boasts working AESA radars
fifth generation EW suite in spectra
Soon the most advanced ram jet BVR in the world with meteore
Stealth cruise missles like scalp
Twin engines with crystal blade technology

J10 is cheaper because it has none of the above especialy the engine technology and highly advanced european avionics and weapons mix.

At best a J10 sits at the level of the F16 /52

When IAF does the sign the deal for 126 RAFALES PAF will not a lot more than 36 j10 OR 18 additional F16/52s

Only suitable answers

Typhoon
F60/J31


ESPECIALLY since you guys will buy such smal nos of advanced fighters due to budgets

Thanks for the info but i still think u underestimate J-10 by a great margin.

 

[ziaulislam]

people are over rating rafale. its doest have any AESA radar as of now as compared to block60 f-16.
i dont think so its too much superior to block 52 f-16.

j-10 we dont have solid info but some decent members rate it quite good here

 

[Storm Force]

Ziaulislam.

Re Rafale AESA let me educate you

PICTURE: France accepts first AESA-equipped Rafale - 10/2/2012 - Flight Global

 

[he-man]

people are over rating rafale. its doest have any AESA radar as of now as compared to block60 f-16.
i dont think so its too much superior to block 52 f-16.

j-10 we dont have solid info but some decent members rate it quite good here

It has an operational aesa for over 1 year now

 

[ziaulislam]

It has an operational aesa for over 1 year now

ok u r right the first of trench 4 was deliverd in sept 2013 to french airforce and is going trials now.

 

[MastanKhan]

I think both when you don't have money you have to focus on only quality but when you have money and lot of money you should go for both quality and quantity @fatman17 @Oscar @Aeronaut

Good job----nothing beats quality-----. Sasta roy baar baar---mehnga roy aik bar

 

[airmarshal]

Both are important.

Quality and quantity are relative terms. Looking at the size of the country and the threats, we need a bigger air force. Not just better fighter planes, but also better surveillance of the air space. Also a wider range of air defence. Thats quantity.

But even with all high tech equipment, if we dont have the right skills and well trained man power, we lose the quantity advantage. Quality of equipment and quality of man power is important to take full advantage of quantity.

With Pakistan meager resources, quality of training becomes extremely important.

 

[Yzd Khalifa]

Quantity comes first.

Pakistan needs to maintain its two-fourth-generation-aircraft platform policy to keep up the good work.

Good job----nothing beets qulity-----.

How good is the J-10?

 

[MastanKhan]

Quantity comes first.

Pakistan needs to maintain its two-fourth-generation-aircraft platform policy to keep up the good work.



How good is the J-10?

Hi,

Our F16 BLK 52 PACKAGE is superior to the J10's so far. If we can get another 50 F 16's MLU and new one---that would make for a potent strike force.

Your weapons systems need to have some kind of parity---. A smaller number must be able to take the enemy's best, one on one and inflict damage. You don't need to match them in numbers.

The americans had 500 superior tanks in germany to take out 1500-2000 inferior russian tanks during the cold war. The 1st gulf war proved that they were right.

 

[acetophenol]

Once a basic quality in achieved ( a decent radar,bvr capability,targeting pods),Quantity must be the priority.

 

[Storm Force]

MASTER KHAN

Re Your Comment

Your weapons systems need to have some kind of parity---. A smaller number must be able to take the enemy's best, one on one and inflict damage. You don't need to match them in numbers.

I DISAGREE

Any inferior nos air power has to bridge the gap by having better quality fighters, superior tactics & leadership,

eg

Iaraeli air force of 265 fighters took on 600= Arab air forces in 1967 and won in seven days.

Why superior tactics starting with a massive PRE EMPTIVE (without warning) air strike.

DOES THE PAF have superior platforms and superior tactics and better leadership.

IMO they do not in either catagory

 

[gambit]

Quantity or Quality...

If you ask any general or admiral, the immediate answer would be that he want both. Of course, this is not always possible, not even for US who develops and builds our own defense, but now we are talking about any country that must import its defense.

From that perspective, the answer should be quantity where and when, and quality where and when. The 'where and when' of each depends on analyses of threats: potential and probable, short and long term, and technical capabilities of each of the listed threats.

For example, if the assessed threat is immediately across the borders but technical analyses indicate a lower technical capability overall, then perhaps importation of current generation of fighters in quantity may make more financial and tactical logic. If the assessed threat is potential, not probable, and is buffered by other neighboring states, like in the case of Israel vs Iran, then importation or development of next generation of higher quality fighters is more viable since threat would take time to build from probable to potential, and in that time, political pressures or current may alleviate or even eliminate that threat.

 

[MastanKhan]

MASTER KHAN

Re Your Comment

I DISAGREE

Any inferior nos air power has to bridge the gap by having better quality fighters, superior tactics & leadership,

Hi,

That is what I was saying----.