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Pakistan's silent partition

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Pakistan's silent partition
by Zehra Abid

src.adapt.960.high.1422342730550.jpg

Men at prayer inside the Ahmadi mosque in Negombo, Sri Lanka.

Pakistan’s story began with a parting — partition from India — and now, for a growing number of people, it is ending with another parting. Negombo, a beach town 24 miles from Sri Lanka’s capital, Colombo, is refuge for hundreds of Ahmadi Muslims fleeing persecution in Pakistan.

According to the Colombo office of the UN Refugee Agency, or UNHCR, there was a nearly 780 percent increase in the number of Pakistani asylum seekers in Sri Lanka from 2012, when 152 people sought asylum, to 2013, when this number jumped to 1,338. While most of them are Ahmadis, the number also includes Pakistani Christians and Shia Muslims, who have also faced increasing persecution in Pakistan over the years.

However, with Sri Lanka becoming less accessible following the suspension last year of on-arrival visa facilities, fewer people have sought shelter here recently. In 2014, only 239 new asylum seekers were registered.

Members of the Ahmadiyya community can be found all over the world. In Pakistan, their population ranges from 600,000 to 700,000, according to Ahmadi leaders in that country (there has been no census there since 1998). They are among a growing number of minorities — people belonging to small sects within Islam and non-Muslims — leaving Pakistan against the backdrop of increasing religious intolerance and attacks on marginal groups in recent years.

In the lottery of birth, Negombo’s newest residents have been terrible losers. There is a law against Ahmadis practicing their religion in Pakistan, where they were declared non-Muslims under a constitutional amendment more than 40 years ago, following months of rioting. Decades later, the legislation has divided both homes and families and sent many into exile. The worst incident in recent times occurred in May 2010 in Lahore when two Ahmadi mosques were attacked, resulting in the deaths of nearly 100 people.

“Ahmadis have a good case for asylum because there is legalized, state-sanctioned persecution against them in Pakistan,” says Asad Jamal, a human-rights lawyer in Pakistan. “There is both formal and informal discrimination against the group, from criminal cases being instituted against Ahmadis for practicing their belief system, being informally barred against being given jobs in state institutions, to their graveyards being desecrated … Students, too, are forced to hide their identity. How can people live in such a situation?”

The Ahmadi mosque in Negombo is a cradle for those seeking asylum. There is a mix of ages, backgrounds and incomes here, but the asylum seekers are united by their loss. Almost everyone has lost a family member, a friend, an acquaintance. Some have lost their homes to looting or arson. At the mosque, they come to socialize, take the free classes that are offered and worship with a freedom that they did not have in Pakistan.

FULL STORY -> Pakistani Ahmadis Seek Asylum in Sri Lanka | Al Jazeera America
 
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I understand Hindus and Christians leaving Pakistan but aren't Ahmadi's muslims too?
Are they shias?

Whats this shia-sunni fight all about?

Its a taboo subject in the country where I live and also I avoid asking questions related to somebody's religion (outside the forum).
 
. . .
I understand Hindus and Christians leaving Pakistan but aren't Ahmadi's muslims too?
Are they shias?

Whats this shia-sunni fight all about?

Its a taboo subject in the country where I live and also I avoid asking questions related to somebody's religion (outside the forum).
Not much fundamental diference is there between Shia and Sunnis. Just that the differences occurred in the very beginning and since then the two have chosen to live with the differences. All muslims believe that the prophet Muhammad (SAW) is the last prophet of Allah (swt) but Ahmadis dont believe in it. Their spiritual leader and founder Mirza Ghulam Ahmad hailed from Qadian, Dist Gurdaspur in Indian Punjab who declared himself to be another prophet and perhaps also as Imam Mahdi.
All these are unacceptable and offensive to the muslims. Pakistan has got them declared as non muslims and in India they are not allowed to be part of All India Muslim Personal Law Board.
 
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Jeez again, another propaganda from Al Jeezara news. There is no things about partitions, just political problems on sects. Obama explained clearly to India to open religious freedom and tolerances.

Why Indians are having fun this thread? Can you show us your stupid dance?

tumblr_inline_naihn6udu01s05k56.gif


:lol:

Obama challenges India on women's rights and religious tolerance

Tuesday 27 January 2015 15.19 GMT
The Guardian

President speaks out in Delhi on importance of empowering women in India in wake of recent high-profile sexual attacks

Barack Obama challenged India’s record on religious tolerance and women’s rights on Tuesday in a parting speech to students in Delhi that contrasted with the at-times saccharin feel of a state visit designed to highlight the closeness of the two countries.

Though careful to acknowledge inequality in the US, the president devoted a substantial part of his speech to a lecture on the importance of empowering women in society and addressed a recent spate of sexual attacks in the emerging south Asian power.

“We know from experience that nations are more successful when their women are successful,” said Obama. “These are facts. So if nations really want to succeed in today’s global economy, they can’t simply ignore the talents of half of their people.”

“Every daughter deserves the same chance as our sons,” he added. “And every woman should be able to go about her day – to walk the street, or ride the bus – and be safe and be treated with the respect and dignity that she deserves.”

A series of high profile gang rapes and other attacks on women in India have prompted widespread public anger. But despite repeated promises by authorities to improve security for women, campaigners say the problem remains acute.

During his only public appearance of the trip without prime minster Narendra Modi by his side, Obama also promoted the rights of religious minorities in the predominantly Hindu country.

“The peace we seek in the world begins in human hearts; it finds its glorious expression when we look beyond any differences in religion or tribe and rejoice in the beauty of every soul,” said the president, who namechecked prominent Indian Muslims, Sikhs and sportswomen. “It’s when all Indians, whatever your faith, go to the movies and applaud actors like Shah Rukh Khan. When you celebrate athletes like Milkha Singh, or Mary Kom,” he said.

Before becoming prime minister, Modi was previously denied a US visa following accusations he had stood by during, or even encouraged, sectarian violence in the western state of Gujarat in 2002, when he was chief minister. More than 1,000 people, mostly Muslims, were killed by rioters. The 64 year old former rightwing organiser has described himself as a Hindu nationalist and been criticised for not being more vocal about religious pluralism since taking power.

“No society is immune from the darkest impulses of men,” said Obama. “India will succeed so long as it is not splintered along the lines of religious faith.”

A series of attempts by rightwing Hindu groups to hold mass conversion ceremonies has sparked controversy in recent months. Last week the hardline Vishnu Hindu Parishad group claimed to have “re-converted” more than 20 Christians in the southern state of Kerala. The organisations come from the same broad political family as Modi’s Bharatiya Janata Party.

However, the US president also acknowledged signs of progress in Indian society, pointing to the symbolic choice of a woman military officer to lead the honour guard on his arrival and to Modi’s humble background as a tea-seller as sign of how India has become more socially mobile.

Modi, a political outsider, comes from low down on the tenacious social hierarchy known as caste which still defines social status and determines opportunities for hundreds of millions of Indians.

Obama’s own background as the first black US president helped soften his blunt message to India as he also highlighted the two country’s shared history of colonialism and oppression. He referenced his grandfather’s work as a cook in Kenya when it was under British control, and when Martin Luther King came to India to draw inspiration from Gandhi, he was introduced to some schoolchildren as a “fellow untouchable”.

“Even as we live in a world of wrenching inequities, we’re also proud to live in countries where even the grandson of cook can become president, even a Dalit can help write a constitution, and even a tea-seller can become prime minister,” Obama said.

“Many countries, including America, grapple with complex questions of identity and inequality,” he added in his speech, delivered before 2,000 students and human rights activists as Siri Fort auditorium in Delhi.

“Right now, in crowded neighbourhoods not far from here, a man is driving an auto-rickshaw, or washing somebody else’s clothes, or doing the hard work no one else will do. A woman is cleaning somebody else’s house. A young man is on a bicycle delivering lunch. A little girl is hauling a heavy bucket of water. Their dreams, their hopes, are just as big and beautiful and worthy as ours.”

The speech prompted lively discussion on Indian television afterwards about whether it would be seen as a snub to Modi, but contrasted with more effusive coverage of earlier speeches and more trivial moments such as pictures of him chewing gum during Republic Day parade.

— Edward-Isaac Dovere (@IsaacDovere) January 27, 2015
How the Indian press refers to the new global Modi-Obama bromance: "MOBAMA" pic.twitter.com/eV0wXAlnsM

Siddarth Varadarajan, a Delhi-based analyst, said that the “very gentle hint” about religious inclusiveness from Obama sent an “important message”.

“He went about as far as any diplomatic visitor can go, and quoted the constitution, so how can anyone object to that. But it highlights the silence of the prime minister on this issue,” Varadarajan said.

Obama concluded by quoting Gandhi on India’s traditions of tolerance: “He said, ‘for me, the different religions are beautiful flowers from the same garden, or they are branches of the same majestic tree’. Branches of the same majestic tree.”

Obama concluded by quoting Gandhi on India’s traditions of tolerance: “He said, ‘for me, the different religions are beautiful flowers from the same garden, or they are branches of the same majestic tree’. Branches of the same majestic tree.”

Barack Obama challenges India on religious tolerance and women's rights | US news | The Guardian

Obama's cautionary advice to India on religious freedom

1422341313-0626.jpg

BS Reporter | New Delhi
January 28, 2015 Last Updated at 00:57 IST



US President Barack Obama on Tuesday tempered the euphoria around his successful three-day state visit to India by reminding his hosts that protecting religious freedom was the job of each citizen, and not the government alone. He said Article 25 of the Constitution of India entitles each citizen to “freedom of conscience” and the “right to freely profess, practise and propagate religion”.

Obama didn’t directly refer to the work by Sangh Parivar affiliates — the Vishva Hindu Parishad, for example — which have carried out campaigns in the name of ‘ghar wapsi’ and against religious conversions in recent months, but spoke of rising intolerance and terror incidents across the world. He said India, as also the US, should guard against the “darkest impulses of man” that might use religion to divide the society. Obama said India will be successful if it isn’t “splintered” on religious or any other lines.

The US president said his wife and his “Christian faith” were a source of strength for them. Obama recalled Mahatma Gandhi’s words on religious tolerance, and said it was important that India upheld its “foundational value” of religious freedom so as to be an example to the rest of the world. Obama named actor Shah Rukh Khan, athletics legend Milkha Singh and boxer M C Mary Kom as examples of India’s diversity.

ALSO READ: Three days in New Delhi

The US president delivered a nearly 35-minute speech – ‘India and America: the future we can build together’ – peppered with inconvenient reminders of how America expected India to do more to protect human rights in its backyard, particularly in Sri Lanka and Myanmar, and shoulder its responsibility towards mitigating the effects of climate change.

ALSO READ: US-India bonhomie missing on climate change

New Delhi hasn’t taken kindly to such lecturing from a visiting dignitary in the past, including from Obama in 2010. But the 2,000-odd people at the Siri Fort Auditorium — most of them university students — listened with rapt attention. The ‘Town Hall’ event was the last engagement of their three-day visit to India before Obama and wife Michelle flew out to Riyadh in the afternoon to pay their condolences at the passing away of the Saudi king.

The audience had waited since 7 am to listen to Obama deliver his typically rousing speech. The US president eventually began his speech at 11 am after receiving a standing ovation that lasted nearly five minutes. Many in the audience broke into thunderous applause when Obama said the US was the “best partner” India could have in the world, or when he reiterated American support for a reformed UN Security Council with India becoming a permanent member.

He welcomed a greater role for India in the Asia Pacific, stating that freedom of navigation should be upheld and disputes resolved peacefully in the region. He also spoke at some length about the need to educate women and said he was deeply impressed at the sight of “incredible” Indian women leading the march past at the Republic Day parade. Obama said nations become successful when their women make progress. Last week, Prime Minister Narendra Modi had launched the ‘beti bachao, beti padhao’ campaign in Haryana’s Panipat.

Obama also identified human trafficking as a scourge the two countries should fight together. Child rights activist and Nobel Peace prize winner Kailash Satyarthi was one of the invitees at the event. He said he hoped to see more Indian students visiting America and vice versa. The US president offered American cooperation in the health sector, in designing smart cities, building infrastructure, etc.

On climate change, Obama called upon India to do more while acknowledging the Indian position of ‘common but differentiated responsibilities’. He said the US admitted to having been a major contributor to climate change, but its current emissions were at a two-decade low. He said India should do its bit to mitigate climate change in its own interest as “few countries will be affected by a warmer planet than India”. Obama promised US technological help for cleaner energy in Delhi, including nuclear energy.

The US president said equality of opportunity was what made nations, recalling how his grandfather was a cook in the British Army in Kenya, and that he himself had faced discrimination in his life because of the colour of his skin. He alluded to his and Modi’s humble origins to stress the need to create enabling structures for all to achieve their dreams and ambitions. Obama pointed at Michelle sitting with 16-year-old Vishal, the son of a daily-wage labourer whom the two had met during their last visit to India at Humayun’s Tomb. Vishal was studying and aspired to join the Indian armed forces, Obama said.

The American president regaled his audience with a smattering of Hindi — beginning his speech with a “namaste” and “dhanyavaad”, and interspersing it with a line from the Shah Rukh Khan-starrer Dilwale Dulhaniya Le Jayenge. He talked of Michelle and his tryst with bhangra and dancing with children during their last visit to India, but said they couldn’t schedule any during the current visit. “Senorita, bade bade deshon mein... you know what I mean,” he said. He ended his speech with a resounding ‘Jai Hind’, before Michelle and him shook hands with several people in the audience. Wishing him a safe journey, Modi tweeted how Obama’s visit “has taken India-USA ties to a new level and opened a new chapter. Wish you a safe journey”.

Obama's cautionary advice to India on religious freedom | Business Standard News
 
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Not much fundamental diference is there between Shia and Sunnis. Just that the differences occurred in the very beginning and since then the two have chosen to live with the differences. All muslims believe that the prophet Muhammad (SAW) is the last prophet of Allah (swt) but Ahmadis dont believe in it. Their spiritual leader and founder Mirza Ghulam Ahmad hailed from Qadian, Dist Gurdaspur in Indian Punjab who declared himself to be another prophet and perhaps also as Imam Mahdi.
All these are unacceptable and offensive to the muslims. Pakistan has got them declared as non muslims and in India they are not allowed to be part of All India Muslim Personal Law Board.

Yeah ok i guess mainstream Muslims does not recognize them, Fair enough but why the persecution ? Do they ask for special privileges ? Are they violent against other religious beliefs ? Do they ask for some kind of separatism / Through violence ? If Pakistani constitution does grant religious freedom why is there official intolerance towards the ahmedi's by the state ? Why is it illegal ? It cant obviously be a cult because they have been practicing their beliefs for centuries

Christianity has many sects, Judaism as well both are Abrahamic religious along with Islam believing in the same god.. And so do the Ahmedi's.. Yeah thier prophet may be different but is that a reason to prosecute them ?
 
.
Jeez again, another propaganda from Al Jeezara news. There is no things about partitions, just political problems on sects. Obama explained clearly to India to open religious freedom and tolerances.

Why Indians are having fun this thread? Can you show us your stupid dance?

tumblr_inline_naihn6udu01s05k56.gif


:lol:

Obama challenges India on women's rights and religious tolerance

Tuesday 27 January 2015 15.19 GMT
The Guardian

President speaks out in Delhi on importance of empowering women in India in wake of recent high-profile sexual attacks

Barack Obama challenged India’s record on religious tolerance and women’s rights on Tuesday in a parting speech to students in Delhi that contrasted with the at-times saccharin feel of a state visit designed to highlight the closeness of the two countries.

Though careful to acknowledge inequality in the US, the president devoted a substantial part of his speech to a lecture on the importance of empowering women in society and addressed a recent spate of sexual attacks in the emerging south Asian power.

“We know from experience that nations are more successful when their women are successful,” said Obama. “These are facts. So if nations really want to succeed in today’s global economy, they can’t simply ignore the talents of half of their people.”

“Every daughter deserves the same chance as our sons,” he added. “And every woman should be able to go about her day – to walk the street, or ride the bus – and be safe and be treated with the respect and dignity that she deserves.”

A series of high profile gang rapes and other attacks on women in India have prompted widespread public anger. But despite repeated promises by authorities to improve security for women, campaigners say the problem remains acute.

During his only public appearance of the trip without prime minster Narendra Modi by his side, Obama also promoted the rights of religious minorities in the predominantly Hindu country.

“The peace we seek in the world begins in human hearts; it finds its glorious expression when we look beyond any differences in religion or tribe and rejoice in the beauty of every soul,” said the president, who namechecked prominent Indian Muslims, Sikhs and sportswomen. “It’s when all Indians, whatever your faith, go to the movies and applaud actors like Shah Rukh Khan. When you celebrate athletes like Milkha Singh, or Mary Kom,” he said.

Before becoming prime minister, Modi was previously denied a US visa following accusations he had stood by during, or even encouraged, sectarian violence in the western state of Gujarat in 2002, when he was chief minister. More than 1,000 people, mostly Muslims, were killed by rioters. The 64 year old former rightwing organiser has described himself as a Hindu nationalist and been criticised for not being more vocal about religious pluralism since taking power.

“No society is immune from the darkest impulses of men,” said Obama. “India will succeed so long as it is not splintered along the lines of religious faith.”

A series of attempts by rightwing Hindu groups to hold mass conversion ceremonies has sparked controversy in recent months. Last week the hardline Vishnu Hindu Parishad group claimed to have “re-converted” more than 20 Christians in the southern state of Kerala. The organisations come from the same broad political family as Modi’s Bharatiya Janata Party.

However, the US president also acknowledged signs of progress in Indian society, pointing to the symbolic choice of a woman military officer to lead the honour guard on his arrival and to Modi’s humble background as a tea-seller as sign of how India has become more socially mobile.

Modi, a political outsider, comes from low down on the tenacious social hierarchy known as caste which still defines social status and determines opportunities for hundreds of millions of Indians.

Obama’s own background as the first black US president helped soften his blunt message to India as he also highlighted the two country’s shared history of colonialism and oppression. He referenced his grandfather’s work as a cook in Kenya when it was under British control, and when Martin Luther King came to India to draw inspiration from Gandhi, he was introduced to some schoolchildren as a “fellow untouchable”.

“Even as we live in a world of wrenching inequities, we’re also proud to live in countries where even the grandson of cook can become president, even a Dalit can help write a constitution, and even a tea-seller can become prime minister,” Obama said.

“Many countries, including America, grapple with complex questions of identity and inequality,” he added in his speech, delivered before 2,000 students and human rights activists as Siri Fort auditorium in Delhi.

“Right now, in crowded neighbourhoods not far from here, a man is driving an auto-rickshaw, or washing somebody else’s clothes, or doing the hard work no one else will do. A woman is cleaning somebody else’s house. A young man is on a bicycle delivering lunch. A little girl is hauling a heavy bucket of water. Their dreams, their hopes, are just as big and beautiful and worthy as ours.”

The speech prompted lively discussion on Indian television afterwards about whether it would be seen as a snub to Modi, but contrasted with more effusive coverage of earlier speeches and more trivial moments such as pictures of him chewing gum during Republic Day parade.

— Edward-Isaac Dovere (@IsaacDovere) January 27, 2015
How the Indian press refers to the new global Modi-Obama bromance: "MOBAMA" pic.twitter.com/eV0wXAlnsM

Siddarth Varadarajan, a Delhi-based analyst, said that the “very gentle hint” about religious inclusiveness from Obama sent an “important message”.

“He went about as far as any diplomatic visitor can go, and quoted the constitution, so how can anyone object to that. But it highlights the silence of the prime minister on this issue,” Varadarajan said.

Obama concluded by quoting Gandhi on India’s traditions of tolerance: “He said, ‘for me, the different religions are beautiful flowers from the same garden, or they are branches of the same majestic tree’. Branches of the same majestic tree.”

Obama concluded by quoting Gandhi on India’s traditions of tolerance: “He said, ‘for me, the different religions are beautiful flowers from the same garden, or they are branches of the same majestic tree’. Branches of the same majestic tree.”

Barack Obama challenges India on religious tolerance and women's rights | US news | The Guardian
Is it too hard to stay on topic? Why bring in India where it's not required.
 
.
I understand Hindus and Christians leaving Pakistan but aren't Ahmadi's muslims too?
Are they shias?

Whats this shia-sunni fight all about?

Its a taboo subject in the country where I live and also I avoid asking questions related to somebody's religion (outside the forum).

No they are not Shias they resemble more to Sunnis. In fact Shias also consider them Non-Muslims.


For the bold part first you need to have very thorough information about Islam and its beliefs, then you need to observe Ahmedis, listen to their spiritual leaders’ sermons may be then you will reach a conclusion.
 
.
All these are unacceptable and offensive to the muslims. Pakistan has got them declared as non muslims and in India they are not allowed to be part of All India Muslim Personal Law Board.
Oh!
Thats interesting. Thanks! :)

One of my muslim friend told me that shias 're not allowed to go to sunni mosques. But my freind ( who is a sunni) dared to take a shia (a common friend of our's) to a sunni mosque. It was during the prayer that my friend realised that shias 've different style of praying, and he wasted no time in bringing the other friend out of the mosque (lol).
Though i dont know what the difference in praying is.
 
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Not much fundamental diference is there between Shia and Sunnis. Just that the differences occurred in the very beginning and since then the two have chosen to live with the differences. All muslims believe that the prophet Muhammad (SAW) is the last prophet of Allah (swt) but Ahmadis dont believe in it. Their spiritual leader and founder Mirza Ghulam Ahmad hailed from Qadian, Dist Gurdaspur in Indian Punjab who declared himself to be another prophet and perhaps also as Imam Mahdi.
All these are unacceptable and offensive to the muslims. Pakistan has got them declared as non muslims and in India they are not allowed to be part of All India Muslim Personal Law Board.

Ahmadis are regarded as non Muslims by almost all major Muslim states. They are banned from performing Haj by Saudi Govt with the consent of both Mosques.

Oh!
Thats interesting. Thanks! :)

One of my muslim friend told me that shias 're not allowed to go to sunni mosques. But my freind ( who is a sunni) dared to take a shia (a common friend of our's) to a sunni mosque. It was during the prayer that my friend realised that shias 've different style of praying, and he wasted no time in bringing the other friend out of the mosque (lol).
Though i dont know what the difference in praying is.

There is no issue between Shias and Sunnis. The issue is between extremist Shias and Wahabi Sunnis.
 
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first you need to have very thorough information about Islam and its beliefs, then you need to observe Ahmedis, listen to their spiritual leaders’ sermons may be then you will reach a conclusion.
Okies.
 
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Is it too hard to stay on topic? Why bring in India where it's not required.

This is relevant to see comparison between India and Pakistan, hence US President Obama already pointed finger to India to allow more religious freedom and tolerances than Pakistan. :P
 
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@OrionHunter There are lots of things which were not written. Now your post is deleted so I want to say that you should read all materials linked to Mirza Ghulam Ahmed. I have already read so many disturbing things. So, leave this thing to scholars.
 
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Oh!
Thats interesting. Thanks! :)

One of my muslim friend told me that shias 're not allowed to go to sunni mosques. But my freind ( who is a sunni) dared to take a shia (a common friend of our's) to a sunni mosque. It was during the prayer that my friend realised that shias 've different style of praying, and he wasted no time in bringing the other friend out of the mosque (lol).
Though i dont know what the difference in praying is.
They have different namaz as well. Almost everything is different.
Source: I used to play cricket in a mosque when it rained. :P

Fair enough but why the persecution ? Do they ask for special privileges ? Are they violent against other religious beliefs ? Do they ask for some kind of separatism / Through violence ? If Pakistani constitution does grant religious freedom why is there official intolerance towards the ahmedi's by the state ? Why is it illegal ?
Answer in order...
i. Because they are non Muslim, but call themselves Muslim
ii. No
iii. No
iv. No
v. You know why :D
vi. Ditto.
 
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