Pakistan's Service Rifle (G-3, Type-56) Replacement Competition 2016.

[pzfz]

USSCOMM hasn't dropped SCAR and marines are going for HK 416

All US military branches and services have stopped fielding 5.56 SCARs (scar-l/mk16). They have been put into storage and/or training purposes only. 762 SCARs (mk17/scar-h) were preferred but ALL additional SCAR procurement has been stopped. Additional procurement only for maintaining stock levels.

Newer orders are going to HK (both 416 and 417).

 

[Zarvan]

Unless they offer something like CZ, long-term relationship with future development and upgrades.

FN are refusing to provide that and also their rifle has a number of short comings, and the PA would want those ironed out, and also a large discount on economies of scale, which FN is also reluctant to do.

SCAR passed all tests neither did CZ nor BREN so so called short comings were in other Rifles and they are offering full TOT and permission to export

 

[Path-Finder]

Unless they offer something like CZ, long-term relationship with future development and upgrades.

FN are refusing to provide that and also their rifle has a number of short comings, and the PA would want those ironed out, and also a large discount on economies of scale, which FN is also reluctant to do.

Unless I am wrong FN have not made a updated SCAR at all Like CZ made BREN 806 based on feedback from troops! As the Colombian chap pointed out FN have very poor customer service!

All US military branches and services have stopped fielding 5.56 SCARs (scar-l/mk16). They have been put into storage and/or training purposes only. 762 SCARs (mk17/scar-h) were preferred but ALL additional SCAR procurement has been stopped. Additional procurement only for maintaining stock levels.

Newer orders are going to HK (both 416 and 417).

That is what I and the Colombian chap said . SCAR is now being removed from active troops and replaced with HK very soon. by the way, welcome to SCAR haters club

 

[Rafi]

SCAR passed all tests neither did CZ nor BREN so so called short comings were in other Rifles and they are offering full TOT and permission to export

Trust me there are a number of technical deficiencies in the rifle, even if the PA was favourably inclined, it would not purchase the rifle without them being ironed out.

Unless I am wrong FN have not made a updated SCAR at all Like CZ made BREN 806 based on feedback from troops! As the Colombian chap pointed out FN have very poor customer service!

That is what I and the Colombian chap said . SCAR is now being removed from active troops and replaced with HK very soon. by the way, welcome to SCAR haters club

In fact they have a totally arrogant attitude, when the PA pointed out somethings, they were very hesitant to address them. Only when it looked like they were loosing did they make an effort.

Another thing if the rifle is too crap and expensive for the US, why does Hazrat think it is good for us?

The Yanks get totally fleesed by defence contractors, billions of dollars of the defence budget unnaccounted for, end up paying 1000 dollars for toilet seats etc.

If they are reluctant about the cost, God help us.

 

[Sage]

Trust me there are a number of technical deficiencies in the rifle, even if the PA was favourably inclined, it would not purchase the rifle without them being ironed out.



In fact they have a totally arrogant attitude, when the PA pointed out somethings, they were very hesitant to address them. Only when it looked like they were loosing did they make an effort.

Another thing if the rifle is too crap and expensive for the US, why does Hazrat think it is good for us?

The Yanks get totally fleesed by defence contractors, billions of dollars of the defence budget unnaccounted for, end up paying 1000 dollars for toilet seats etc.

If they are reluctant about the cost, God help us.

What were those shortcoming pointed out by the PA ?

 

[pzfz]

not a scar hater, though i absolutely loathe its looks. neither guns are the end all be all. i've shot both (well the 805 and scar-l). SCAR simply isn't worth it, maybe for special forces. the 805 was a plastic pos, but incredibly smooth - smoother than the scar. lighter recoil, i can see why it probably failed the stress and burn tests though.

was rooting for an ak variant - the zastava m77/21bs. really really reaching for the fins or denel to enter with their rk95 or r4 variants. cheap, reliable, and simple enough for our troops.

the best rifle i've ever shot is the robinson xcr. loved it. too bad they're not big enough - would've likely won the ussocom trials if it wasn't for some entry compliance issues (ubgl).

 

[Rafi]

What were those shortcoming pointed out by the PA ?

Read Kittens post above, all the points you need to know.

 

[MystryMan]

Read Kittens post above, all the points you need to know.

So Scar is more hyped then what it actually is? We are misled big time by the other club (Scar lovers)

 

[fitpOsitive]

I think even when POF chose G-3, it was not the best at that time either. If SCAR is not the best, even that doesn't make it unfit for the next service rifle of PA.
BTW my sixth sense is telling me that next rifle be coming from Italy or Russia, not Belgium.

 

[Path-Finder]

Invitation declined. I don't hate SCAR. Do I think it would have been the best choice should Norway have floated a tender? No, I don't (and I don't think it's the best option for Pakistan either). But Norway never got a chance to test it against the HK416 or HK417.

SCAR first showed up in 2004, but only just entered a limited production run in 2007, to trial the rifle and work out some problematic ticks. By that time Norway had already selected the HK416 as its main service rifle to replace the AG3. SCAR's problems weren't resolved until 2009, and it still has occasional issues like bolt seizure or frame cracking in cold climates - the HK416 had these issues too, but a Norwegianized, Winterized variant called HK416N applied fixes to the base design to make it more suitable to cold climates. The HK416K carbine also applies these fixes.

The rifles, HK416 variants and HK417 have gone on to serve in the Indian Ocean, in Mali in support of UN operations, Libya, Syria and Iraq where Norwegian special forces and police and military trainers continue to operate, Afghanistan, the Balkans and Baltics and Norway itself. They work in the cold, the hot, the high altitude, the humid and all conditions one would need a rifle to work in.

While USSOCOM adopted the rifle (all variants) in 2004, it was to trial it in-field, same as what Norway's KJK did with the HK417 in 2007 (shown below). USSOCOM didn't field the rifle until 2007 and didn't formally accept the rifle as operational until 2009 after extensive testing. They then dropped the lighter SCAR-L, retained the SCAR-H (with a conversion kit), but don't plan to continue to procure either type.

Rather then hate SCAR, I feel that because of its problematic development and ongoing problems it wouldn't have been the best rifle for the Norwegian Armed Services, especially given Norway selected its primary arm a full two years before SCAR was officially operational.

SCAR wasn't given a chance to prove itself in Norway and I have my suspicions it wouldn't have measured up to the HK416 or HK417 anyway given its complicated history. Unlike the HK models, SCAR variants still have cold weather performance issues.

you have outlined everything beautifully and there is nothing I can add to it. As for membership to the club it's just a running gag we have.

 

[Vergennes]

you have outlined everything beautifully and there is nothing I can add to it. As for membership to the club it's just a running gag we have.

I would like to be part of that club. But hating the Scar means hating FN. Hating FN means hating Wallonia. Hating Wallonia means hating Belgium. Hating Belgium means hating the EU construction and unity. So...

 

[Path-Finder]

I would like to be part of that club. But hating the Scar means hating FN. Hating FN means hating Wallonia. Hating Wallonia means hating Belgium. Hating Belgium means hating the EU construction and unity. So...

You automatically gained the membership when you declined SCAR for HK which is very naughty

 

[PWFI]

I would like to be part of that club. But hating the Scar means hating FN. Hating FN means hating Wallonia. Hating Wallonia means hating Belgium. Hating Belgium means hating the EU construction and unity. So...

 

[pzfz]

I would like to be part of that club. But hating the Scar means hating FN. Hating FN means hating Wallonia. Hating Wallonia means hating Belgium. Hating Belgium means hating the EU construction and unity. So...

flanders to the netherlands, walloonia to france.

 

[DESERT FIGHTER]

After "Everybody loves Raymond"

This thread should be called;

"Everybody hates SCAR".

ThankyouZarvan#

flanders to the netherlands, walloonia to france.

Chichukimalian to Thatha.

Shigar to Sibbi.

Muzzafarabad to Parachinar.