Pakistanis steal electricity worth Rs 380 billion every year

[epebble]

it shouldn’t happen at the level of making market manipulations. Set the market price. It should be the same for every single person. If someone is poor, the govt can give him some additional income. Manipulating the market has never worked under any circumstance. Subsidies, even when targeted to poor people, do not work.

We use it all the time in U.S. very effectively. Universal Access for phone is FCC mandate for more than 60 years. See your phone bill. There is a line item for that. Same with Internet. Certain segments get nearly free Internet. Property taxes, based on square footage, are indirectly taxing by 'market manipulation'; Why I should pay three times my neighbor for property taxes when I have no school going child while he has three?

 

[Ssan]

We use it all the time in U.S. very effectively. Universal Access for phone is FCC mandate for more than 60 years. See your phone bill. There is a line item for that. Same with Internet. Certain segments get nearly free Internet. Property taxes, based on square footage, are indirectly taxing by 'market manipulation'; Why I should pay three times my neighbor for property taxes when I have no school going child while he has three?

For somethings, there are positive externalities that just make them a good business decision for the govt to do. In that case, fine. Things like internet give rise to public access to information which helps the govt. and the market. And improves the economy in general.

Property taxes can be based on property area, that’s fine. In my state, they are based on market trends. That the local govt uses these funds to pay for public schools and public works doesn’t really amount to a market manipulation because these are just taxes.

That govts should tax people to provide services like education and security are a given. This makes sense in Islam as things like life and intellect are god given rights. But electricity does not make the cut. And it should not because it’s a consumable anyways.

 

[epebble]

For somethings, there are positive externalities that just make them a good business decision for the govt to do. In that case, fine. Things like internet give rise to public access to information which helps the govt. and the market. And improves the economy in general.

Property taxes can be based on property area, that’s fine. In my state, they are based on market trends. That the local govt uses these funds to pay for public schools and public works doesn’t really amount to a market manipulation because these are just taxes.

That govts should tax people to provide services like education and security are a given. This makes sense in Islam as things like life and intellect are god given rights. But electricity does not make the cut. And it should not because it’s a consumable anyways.

This thread started on how to collect money from reluctant electricity users. Since the current system has failed spectacularly, the only method that seems feasible is somehow converting electricity into a public good like roads, railways, airports and ports. Otherwise, power has to be shut off to a large segment of the population.

 

[Ssan]

This thread started on how to collect money from reluctant electricity users. Since the current system has failed spectacularly, the only method that seems feasible is somehow converting electricity into a public good like roads, railways, airports and ports. Otherwise, power has to be shut off to a large segment of the population.

The problem is not the market side of it. What I am suggesting is actually standard practice prettt much everywhere in the world where they have markets and produce electricity.

In Pakistan, the problem is that we have signed these horrible IPP agreements and they are based on expectation of there being a demand for that much electricity plus more. If we don’t utilize that much electricity, we will need to pay the full bill anyways.

Instead of discussing giving out electricity for free, let’s discuss the serious thing which is why can’t we default on these IPP agreements? Now is as good a time to kill all these stupid deals once and for all, and frankly, most of them were probably negotiated from the usual corrupt suspects to benefit their usual corrupt suspect friends.

Yes this also means reneging on CPEC deals but frankly who guarantees 16% profit in a currency you do not have.

 

[fisher1]

Propaganda against PTI and KPK has started with the so called plans for provincial elections.

KPK has PTI government for more than a decade and it's good governance model mirrors socialist Scandinavian governance promised and delivered by PTI-Niazi group.

This is true. KPK votes PTI because rivers of honey flow here and for the first time, people from Punjab and Sindh come here for jobs, education and medical issues.

 

[Super Falcon]

Is hamam ma sabhi nanga ha wali bat yad agai over population ki waja se govt kış kış ko pakda

 

[epebble]

The problem is not the market side of it. What I am suggesting is actually standard practice prettt much everywhere in the world where they have markets and produce electricity.

In Pakistan, the problem is that we have signed these horrible IPP agreements and they are based on expectation of there being a demand for that much electricity plus more. If we don’t utilize that much electricity, we will need to pay the full bill anyways.

Instead of discussing giving out electricity for free, let’s discuss the serious thing which is why can’t we default on these IPP agreements? Now is as good a time to kill all these stupid deals once and for all, and frankly, most of them were probably negotiated from the usual corrupt suspects to benefit their usual corrupt suspect friends.

Yes this also means reneging on CPEC deals but frankly who guarantees 16% profit in a currency you do not have.

The issues of IPP and CPEC are valid political topics that deserve serious national debate and action. But they should not be fused with general corruption among the rank-and-file officials and the citizenry in hoodwinking local/provincial utilities. When you have this degree of cancer spread throughout the system, the only options are either completely change the system or just allow it to die.

 

[HAIDER]

Smart meters fix that in a second.

Have a metre on each pylon measuring the energy its receiving and sending out. Have a metre on each connected building measuring how much they've used.

If the usage between all the houses and the pylon doesn't add up - you've got a kundi.

Same if the amount transmitted and received between pylons doesn't add up.

Sir ji ...people can't afford expensive electricity...same go to factories...too many power station but obsolete infrastructure.... PPP and PMLN made billion through IPP..... Pakistan need massive overhauling... these corrupts will back in power, but no money left to steal..but they impose more tax on poor to suck their blood...

 

[S.Y.A]

By the year 2000, these losses had jumped to around 40%

all due to tonnes of internal migration to karachi. karachi may well have the largest slums and squatters in the world (settlements like paharr ganj, orangi, banaras, sohrab goth, gujjar nala, liyari naddi, encroachments in jahangir, jamshed, and martin quarters, jutland lines encroahments, encroachments in kornagi, landhi etc etc). a quick look at google maps satellite imagery confirms this.

Eggjactlee. As long as the masajid are full, Pakistanis are content, happy and ready for the Hereafter. As they wish.

typical desi liberal who wants to blames religion for other shortcomings.

just fyi, masajid arent full either. nor are people actual educated muslims, they are just cultural ones, being born into muslim families. had they been true muslims, they wouldnt be engaging in fraudulent practices.

 

[El Sidd]

This is true. KPK votes PTI because rivers of honey flow here and for the first time, people from Punjab and Sindh come here for jobs, education and medical issues.

Yes this tabdeeli in KPK has charmed and enchanted urban Punjab and Sindh too.