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Pakistan warns Turkey: Don’t make our mistakes

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Pakistan warns Turkey: Don’t make our mistakes
The armed uprising in Syria, with the goal of changing the regime, has given birth to organizations that are threatening the entire population of the region, but Turkey is continuing on its way in total disregard for the perils of "Pakistanization."

As Turkey was discussing the training and equipping of Syrian opposition militants in Turkey, Pakistan recalled its own painful experiences.

In Islamabad, Al-Monitor asked Mushahid Hussein, the chairman of the Pakistani Senate's Defense Committee, about his country’s role in Afghanistan and in creating the Taliban and how he sees Turkey’s involvement in Syria.

Mushahid Hussein, well known for his academic work on international relations and his rich journalism experience, said he had reminded Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu while he was visiting Islamabad about “Pakistanization syndrome.” Hussein added, "I warned Davutoglu when he was here, ‘You are repeating in Syria the mistakes we made in Afghanistan. Organizations you support now will turn against you.’ Pakistan was wrong in becoming party to the war in Afghanistan and was wrong in supporting the Taliban. We are now paying the costs of these mistakes."

No one took Pakistan’s warning seriously. Turkey's persisting with the train-and-equip program that will produce nothing but permanent armed groups shows that Turkey still does not intend to learn from the lessons of Pakistan.

Turkish and American officials are involved in intensive final preparations for the training to be given at Kaman, Kirsehir. On March 11, US CENTCOM Commander Gen. Lloyd Austin visited the training base, followed by visits to Ankara by retired Gen. John Allen, the special envoy of US President Barack Obama to the global coalition against the Islamic State (IS), and Brett McGurk, deputy undersecretary of the US State Department. Their meetings in Ankara focused on the train-and-equip program and Turkey’s contribution to the anti-IS operations. Reports say the program that will last three years will train 1,500-2,000 fighters.

Reading between the lines of the raging debate, it's easy to get the sense is that the idea behind the anti-IS program is to prevent the Damascus regime from taking over territory to be abandoned by IS. But it must also be considered how the region is to survive with so many armed organizations roaming around. Recalling the experience of Pakistan in such misguided adventures may provide Turkey with a guiding light.

You don’t have to walk the sensationally rough terrain of Khyber Pakhtunkhwa or North Waziristan on the Afghanistan border. A visit to an Islamabad bookshop, where hundreds of books on Pakistan’s impasse are available, may be enough.

There are parallels between the process that drew Pakistan to Afghanistan and the motives that dragged Turkey into the Syrian quagmire: expanding spheres of influence and ambitions to become a regional power. There is not much difference between the ambitions of President Mohammed Zia ul-Haq, who dreamed of expanding Pakistan’s sphere of influence first to Afghanistan and then to Asia, and Turkey’s President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, who wanted to pray in Damascus' Emeviye Mosque and become caliph there.

A short reminder is in order here. In 1979, Pakistan, which, together with the CIA, organized the resistance against the invading Russian army, opened its borders to millions of Afghan refugees. Those refugees provided a ready pool of manpower for the anti-Soviet struggle. Fighters, particularly Pashtuns, were also recruited from religious seminaries in Pakistan.

The CIA and Pakistani intelligence services trained about 80,000 fighters in a $2 billion-$3 billion train-and-equip program. In 1989, after the Soviets withdrew from Afghanistan, it was time to restore order to the country. When Pakistan’s trusted man in Afghanistan, Gulbuddin Hekmatyar, the leader of Hezb-i-Islami, could not consolidate his rule in Kabul, the Taliban was created. Students who were studying at Deobendi fought for two years at Pakistan’s guidance to eliminate other groups and capture Kabul in 1996. According to confidential documents of the US State Department, the Pakistani intelligence services continued with their support of ammunition, fuel and food to the Taliban after the group took over Kabul in 1996. After the 9/11 attacks against the United States, Pakistan had to readjust its relations with the Taliban, which then turned its guns on Pakistan. Taliban leaders who were toppled by the US intervention in 2001 settled down in north Pakistan’s Waziristan region, leading to the emergence of local Taliban groups. About 30 organizations that settled along the "Jihadist Highway" in 2007 came together to establish the Tehrik-i-Taliban Pakistan (TTP) under Baitullah Mehsud and quickly became Pakistan's biggest threat. Pakistanis, with their distinction between "good" and "bad" terrorists, began fighting TTP while continuing to work with the Taliban in Afghanistan.

Afghanistan’s ambassador in Islamabad, Canan Musazay, told Al-Monitor at the Think Tanks Forum of the Islamic Countries, organized by the Turkish Asian Center for Strategic Studies, that Pakistan was still making the "good terrorist-bad terrorist" distinction, and that whether Turkey was still supporting extremism-inclined groups is also a topic of debate.

What kinds of risks are awaiting Turkey while it supports a military uprising and armed groups in its neighbor? Tahir Ahmad, a researcher with The Centre for Pakistan and Gulf Studies, made a comparison between Pakistan and Turkey, telling Al-Monitor, "There are stark similarities between these two cases. The groups trained are religious bigots, which would backfire as they want their own brand of Sharia-based governance and they reject democracy and any alliance with the Western countries or secular trends. The country is geographically contiguous. Proxy warfare can be fought only by ethnic or independence movements, not in this kind of religious warfare. Second, it will create indigenous support for such kinds of extremist groups, which can demand indigenous reforms and would create a security issue. Third, the humanitarian issue, in terms of refugees and sectarian conflicts that emerge from these conflicts, are more dangerous than the external threat. In Turkey, it can also be intra-religious clashes. Instead of going into a war, Turkey should play a diplomatic role. It is the best time for diplomacy and leadership, not proxy warfare."

In Turkey, our Islamic mindset is open to treating the war in our neighbor as jihad. We are now seeing the beginnings of a tragic Deobendi-esque transition from Sufism to radicalism, and so are not surprised to hear of hundreds of Turkish citizens joining IS and Jabhat al-Nusra.

While Pakistan could not control its border regions and saw them become a jihad highway, now Turkey cannot control its porous border, where opposition forces cross it freely.

All these symptoms point to Turkey’s subscription to a scenario of Pakistanization, making the warnings of Hussein, who wants nothing but friendship with Turkey, are extremely important.

Pakistan warns Turkey: Don’t make our mistakes - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East
I'm glad Turkey has a brother country like Pakistan who worries about Turkey although we are miles away.
 
Syria was fine four years ago. A harsh dictatorship yes but life mostly went on as normal. Turkey, the US, the GCC and Europe claim they were concerned about the Syrian people but how can fostering such chaos have helped them in any way?
 
:(:(:(

The worst part is if Assad doesn't step down, what will Turkey do if US change its policy to negotiate with Syria/Russia? It is big blow to Turkey and GCC.

Not only Turkey and Pakistan, we will see same situations on Ukraine and other neighbours against Russia.
 
stfu it's not our problem or concern.

Turkey is our friendly country and they call us Millet i Indi.

The President of India, Shri Pranab Mukherjee has extended his greetings and felicitations to the Government and people of the Republic of Turkey on the eve of the National Day of theRepublic of Turkey (October 29, 2014).
In his message toH.E. Mr. Recep Tayyip Erdogan, the President of the Republic of Turkey,the President has said, "On behalf of the Government and the people of India and on my own behalf, I have the pleasure to extend my warm greetings and felicitations to you and to the Government and the people of Turkey on the occasion of your National Day.

It is a matter of satisfaction that the deep-rooted relations between our two countries continue to be marked by friendship, mutual understanding and cooperation. I am confident that our bilateral relations will further diversify and deepen with the passage of time to the mutual benefit of the people of our two countries.

Please accept, Excellency, the assurances of my highest consideration and my best wishes for your good health and well-being, as well as for the welfare and prosperity of the friendly people of the Republic of Turkey”.
 
It is too late for that now. Iran had warned Turkey much before this. In 2012 to be exact (from the same website):

As far back as August 2012, Maj. Gen. Hassan Firouzabadi, commander of Iran’s armed forces, cautioned all three countries by name against “becoming the victims of promoting al-Qaeda terrorism,” adding, “If, they accept such a norm, they must realize that after Syria, Turkey and other [such] states will be next in line.” His remarks appear prophetic in light of what has transpired. Compared to Turkey, whose miscalculations and mistakes in Syria, Egypt and Iraq are glaring, Iran is emerging as the country with focused and consistent policies that are bearing results and appear set to make Tehran a principal regional player.
Will Turkey and Iran find common ground in Iraq? - Al-Monitor: the Pulse of the Middle East
 
Syria was fine four years ago. A harsh dictatorship yes but life mostly went on as normal. Turkey, the US, the GCC and Europe claim they were concerned about the Syrian people but how can fostering such chaos have helped them in any way?
The Iraq invasion pushed the Al Qaeda into Syria, and there they found sympathy because ofthey found quick justice done by these forces. The issue stems to the lack of justice and freedom under the dictator and the massive use of force by Assad to try and crush any voice against his authority. Again do not justify a harsh dictator. Either the US should have stayed out of the region or if it did enter should have made sure the job was done properly. As for Turkey, they will not let the opposition gain support within the Turkish people. We wish the Turkish people safety as do we for the Syrian people.
 
Syria was fine four years ago. A harsh dictatorship yes but life mostly went on as normal. Turkey, the US, the GCC and Europe claim they were concerned about the Syrian people but how can fostering such chaos have helped them in any way?
I agree with your statement Arab spring was farce to change the maps of the middle east but it beared no success. or did it?
 
:(:(:(

The worst part is if Assad doesn't step down, what will Turkey do if US change its policy to negotiate with Syria/Russia? It is big blow to Turkey and GCC.

Not only Turkey and Pakistan, we will see same situations on Ukraine and other neighbours against Russia.


Turkey did tried to make President Assad understand who are behind the arming and providing training to Kurds. Syrian, Iraqi and Libyan people would have never saw so much deaths and destruction after the fall of Saddam hussain.
 
:(:(:(

The worst part is if Assad doesn't step down, what will Turkey do if US change its policy to negotiate with Syria/Russia? It is big blow to Turkey and GCC.

Not only Turkey and Pakistan, we will see same situations on Ukraine and other neighbours against Russia.
Assad won't stay. The US will loose Turkey as an ally if they do. Eventually, Turkey has to take military action with or without the US army. I think Turkey realized they have to do it themselves without help. One difference between Pakistan and Turkey is that we have a huge army with most advanced tech in the region. If we are cornered we can punch well beyond Syria if we have to. It won't come to that if the FSA is successful. The FSA army is getting trained as we speak.
 
The Iraq invasion pushed the Al Qaeda into Syria, and there they found sympathy because ofthey found quick justice done by these forces. The issue stems to the lack of justice and freedom under the dictator and the massive use of force by Assad to try and crush any voice against his authority. Again do not justify a harsh dictator. Either the US should have stayed out of the region or if it did enter should have made sure the job was done properly. As for Turkey, they will not let the opposition gain support within the Turkish people. We wish the Turkish people safety as do we for the Syrian people.

The Iraqi war didn't 'Push' AQ into Syria. Assad let AQ and associates limited free movement to cause chaos in American liberated Iraq.
 
To be fair the Arab Spring did turn out okay in Tunisia.
:no: unfortunately it got replaced with exactly the same type of government except change of face!
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Question I suppose is Turkey may have far more at stake than Pakistan because the region has ISIS where Afghan Taliban fought NATO and a new taliban ttp were raised almost over night who bear the resemblance with isis. However turkey is financially stronger along with competent security apparatus both things Pakistan lacks.
 
Turkey is going to take part in the coming Mosul operation. I think we are going to see friction between Turkey and Iran in Iraq. If Iran makes a provocation towards Turkey. We might see a regional conflict. Iran even had a big mouth when we saved 40 soldiers from our enclave in Syria. I think Iran should look out how they act.
 
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