Pakistan to give access to Russia to warm Water

[Varad]

You cannot compare them with the Soviets like that. Soviets suffered greatly in WWII with the Germans attacking them on their home land. They then had to rebuild itself, only to engage in an arms race with the Americans and then they screwed up on the Afghan war. It never happened to the Americans. They've always fought on other's territories.

The west is in decline and they are still struggling to cope with the recession. It is false imagination to think that they can sustain wars like that.
Needless to say, would its society allow for more wars when they see nothing but doom and gloom on a daily basis everytime they switch on their television? Vietnam was a good example of what people can do to its government. War money only ends up in the pockets of the government, greedy bankers and military. It will do nothing for its overall economy.

As of now, we are anticipating them to leave, but I didn't say it will be soon. It was a calculated guess. There quick withdrawal will bring instability to the region. Therefore it is good to have them there. They will keep secure the region to a degree, it will continue to be a money sink and for the meantime it works in favour of the Russians and the Chinese. I am pretty sure the Russians are relishing this moment as it reminds them of the Afghan war and how it sucked them dry.

Why do you think their stay in Afghanistan is sucking them dry. Do you consider it as a full fledged war. i dont see its as a full fledged war. In my opinion it seems more like they have made Iraq and Afghanistan their military bases. Have you forgot about the n number of international bases they have all over the world.Their economy is again beginning to rev up.
Also consider China can still take lead over USA in nominal terms, but cannot match per capita gdp and resources of the USA. As far as Russia goes, i seriously beleive that there are divergent issues on their Central Asia policy with the US. But Russia will not team up with China against USA.
And from a US point of view Afghanistan in not a liablity but a strategic asset to keep an eye on China and maybe on Russia.

 

[Obambam]

Come on, what the heck does "warn waters" mean to Russia? I mean this is Russia, not the Soviet union, it's the Russian navy, not the Soviet navy -- Think "Bijnis" that's where it's at -- all this "warm waters stuff, it's so cold war

I think Russia still has a foot in the past. Especially with Putin still around. Being anti NATO but being clever to disguise it is one, being in several major blocs is another. Putin is also reintroducing systems that is somewhat similar to that of the Soviet system. Don't blame him either, he was a KGB hardman and also the most successful president that ressurected Russia afterall.

[video]http://www.veoh.com/watch/v6291423F7kBdX39[/video]

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

And from a US point of view Afghanistan in not a liablity but a strategic asset to keep an eye on China and maybe on Russia.

LOL, do you really believe that the Afghanistan war, is "a strategic asset to keep an eye on China and maybe on Russia"???

 

[luckyyy]

Pakistan to give access to Russia ...
Pakistan to give access to china...
Pakistan to give access to US..

for WHAT , to counter india ?

inplace had Pakistan to give just a 10% comparable access to india , pakistan would be a far better country today....

 

[Karachiite]

Lol you bhartis are really paranoid. It's like the world revolves around you. Wake up and smell the coffee we aren't doing this to counter you.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

Why do you think their stay in Afghanistan is sucking them dry.

They have already got a $14 trillion dollar debt, and a massive trade deficit too.

Their national debt, is ten times larger than the total GDP of Russia.

In that situation, why spend hundreds of billions more every year, to fight these pointless wars?

If you're already in so much debt, the proper thing to do is to cut spending. Not increase it.

 

[Varad]

LOL, do you really believe that the Afghanistan war, is "a strategic asset to keep an eye on China and maybe on Russia"???

You may laugh at me man, but i seeing from a strategic point, the US considers China as its rival and to a certain extent the west also. Afghanistan is very close to China, and i seriously beleive they are not going anywhere. The maximum you might see is them scaling down their forces to about 20k or 30k. In a possible future conflict this country will have immense strategic value for the US. China on the other hand has no such strategic partners that can help them so close to the US mainland. They tried at E.Timor but it failed. So, i seriously beleive they are not going anywhere for a very long time and will start economic operations their very soon. They have already started to shift the NAto line towards Central Asia away from pakistan keeping in mind the future.
Also, dont forget they came to Diego Garcia during Cold war and have not gone anywhere instead have started covert operations from there. In reality i see a strategic encirclement starting from Japan all the way from S and E China sea and ending in Central Asia.

 

[Obambam]

Why do you think their stay in Afghanistan is sucking them dry. Do you consider it as a full fledged war. i dont see its as a full fledged war. In my opinion it seems more like they have made Iraq and Afghanistan their military bases. Have you forgot about the n number of international bases they have all over the world.Their economy is again beginning to rev up.

I never said anything about it being full fledged. Are you saying they can make it full fledged? Can America handle the emerging powers alone? Having bases around the world is irrelevent to this argument. Have you thought about the costs of having them? Just look at Britain, they've even come up with stupid proposals of charging kids to play on public playgrounds. That's how sorry the economy is. Britain is also America's strongest and most supportive ally. They may have a big appetite, but they simply don't have the stomach for it buddy.

Also consider China can still take lead over USA in nominal terms, but cannot match per capita gdp and resources of the USA. As far as Russia goes, i seriously beleive that there are divergent issues on their Central Asia policy with the US. But Russia will not team up with China against USA.

GDP means nothing when you take into consideration the percentage of joblosses, the PPP and its public and national debts. If you don't think Russia will team up with China against America, then you must have been missing out on a lot of news. Russia and China in fact are always working together against the west. They are strong political allies, even more so than with India. You have no idea how much Russia wants to get back its former glory, especially with Putin still lurking around. The former KGB hardman will not let the past go so eaily.

And from a US point of view Afghanistan in not a liablity but a strategic asset to keep an eye on China and maybe on Russia.

It maybe a strategic assest to them, but it is also a costly one. They are spending an average of $6.7 billion a month in Afghanistan alone.
You need to look at it from outside of the box. Both Russia and China are teamed together and is growing rapidly both in both econmic and military terms. Having bases in Afghan will not do much to impede them. America will only destroy itself trying to compete with them.

 

[Varad]

They have already got a $14 trillion dollar debt, and a massive trade deficit too.

Their national debt, is ten times larger than the total GDP of Russia.

In that situation, why spend hundreds of billions more every year, to fight these pointless wars?

If you're already in so much debt, the proper thing to do is to cut spending. Not increase it.

That all is true but do you see any cut in their big cut in their defense budget. Brother just realize they are so much ahead in terms of technology that they have ended F-22. They know that or another 2 decades their 187 F 22 are enough for them. Obama has already started steps to bring the debt down. just consider this they are ending their powerful space shuttle program which made its first flight in 1984 and after 3 decades we are still not able to make a single space shuttle. A country of this magnitude is not going down so easily, they are far ahead than the rest of the world.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

That all is true but do you see any cut in their big cut in their defense budget. Brother just realize they are so much ahead in terms of technology that they have ended F-22. They know that or another 2 decades their 187 F 22 are enough for them. Obama has already started steps to bring the debt down. just consider this they are ending their powerful space shuttle program which made its first flight in 1984 and after 3 decades we are still not able to make a single space shuttle. A country of this magnitude is not going down so easily, they are far ahead than the rest of the world.

You're right, they are FAR ahead of everyone else. No question about that.

However, that doesn't mean they can keep increasing their debt to such astronomical levels.

If they want to keep an eye on China and Russia as you say, there are much cheaper ways of doing so.

 

[Varad]

I never said anything about it being full fledged. Are you saying they can make it full fledged? Can America handle the emerging powers alone? Having bases around the world is irrelevent to this argument. Have you thought about the costs of having them? Just look at Britain, they've even come up with stupid proposals of charging kids to play on public playgrounds. That's how sorry the economy is. Britain is also America's strongest and most supportive ally. They may have a big appetite, but they simply don't have the stomach for it buddy.

No i dont say it is a full fledged war, but it looks more like a strong US military base from they get a strong footing on whole of Asia.It was never a full fledged war.

GDP means nothing when you take into consideration the percentage of joblosses, the PPP and its public and national debts. If you don't think Russia will team up with China against America, then you must have been missing out on a lot of news. Russia and China in fact are always working together against the west. They are strong political allies, even more so than with India. You have no idea how much Russia wants to get back its former glory, especially with Putin still lurking around. The former KGB hardman will not let the past go so eaily.

Their job data has started improving, slowly but steadily.
ADP Estimates U.S. Companies Added 179,000 Jobs in April - Bloomberg
About Russia, going through recent wikileaks they are considering to put down their tussle with Japan and focus on China. Also it was in the news they have stationed Su 35 on China's border.
Wikileaks Cables Show Russia Flirted With Japan as China Flexed - China Real Time Report - WSJ

It maybe a strategic assest to them, but it is also a costly one. They are spending an average of $6.7 billion a month in Afghanistan alone.
You need to look at it from outside of the box. Both Russia and China are teamed together and is growing rapidly both in both econmic and military terms. Having bases in Afghan will not do much to impede them. America will only destroy itself trying to compete with them.

Just consider this that even after 6.7billion they have still delayed their departure from 2011 to 2014. Why are they spending so much. I see both Iraq and Afghanistan as a terrible asset to them to keep an eye on Middle East ( Iran) and also on China and Russia

 

[Varad]

You're right, they are FAR ahead of everyone else. No question about that.

However, that doesn't mean they can keep increasing their debt to such astronomical levels.

If they want to keep an eye on China and Russia as you say, there are much cheaper ways of doing so.

Well i am just trying to work out why they are not leaving. I beleive they are trying to keep and eye on Iran as well as China.

 

[justanobserver]

Well i am just trying to work out why they are not leaving. I beleive they are trying to keep and eye on Iran as well as China.

Iran

 

[Obambam]

No i dont say it is a full fledged war, but it looks more like a strong US military base from they get a strong footing on whole of Asia.It was never a full fledged war.

You are talking about military base. It means nothing should war break out with the Asian giants. It is more like talibans keeping eyes on them, not them keeping their eyes on China and Russia. The concept is flawed. It is also costing them billions a month to maintain its operations there.

Their job data has started improving, slowly but steadily.
ADP Estimates U.S. Companies Added 179,000 Jobs in April - Bloomberg

Jobs improving slowly. Reality for them still is - negative impacts on its economy is still grossly outweighing it positive impacts.

About Russia, going through recent wikileaks they are considering to put down their tussle with Japan and focus on China. Also it was in the news they have stationed Su 35 on China's border.
Wikileaks Cables Show Russia Flirted With Japan as China Flexed - China Real Time Report - WSJ

If you choose to be selective, that is fine with me. It its fine for them to do so since they have every rights to protect every inch of its land. The thing to remember here is. We are both members of BRICS, both leaders of SCO, both members of the UNSC and last but not least we are right next to eachother. Our leader visits moscow adveraged 4 times a year also and if you look at how many times the names Russia and China comes up on news articles, you would have spotted the trend well enough to tell that they do a lot of business together and are acting together for similar political cause. Just google 'Russia China' and see for yourself.

Just consider this that even after 6.7billion they have still delayed their departure from 2011 to 2014. Why are they spending so much. I see both Iraq and Afghanistan as a terrible asset to them to keep an eye on Middle East ( Iran) and also on China and Russia

Have you ever thought of the political and social implications if they suddenly withdraw? Afterall they did initiate the wars so they are responsible for the peace keeping missions there. Have you no idea on how many satelites they have in space? Don't you think they are better ways of 'keeping an eye' on someone than it is to have military bases there?

 

[Varad]

You are talking about military base. It means nothing should war break out with the Asian giants. It is more like talibans keeping eyes on them, not them keeping their eyes on China and Russia. The concept is flawed. It is also costing them billions a month to maintain its operations there.

This is the list of US military bases all over the world. Dont you think a war with any country in the world will already have US at an advantage because of these bases.
File:US military bases in the world.svg - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Jobs improving slowly. Reality for them still is - negative impacts on its economy is still grossly outweighing it positive impacts.

The point is that their economy is started picking up. They have braced through these wars in the midst of a bitter recession. Their growth is seen now at 3 % in 2012 and 2.8% in 2013.

If you choose to be selective, that is fine with me. It its fine for them to do so since they have every rights to protect every inch of its land. The thing to remember here is. We are both members of BRICS, both leaders of SCO, both members of the UNSC and last but not least we are right next to eachother. Our leader visits moscow adveraged 4 times a year also and if you look at how many times the names Russia and China comes up on news articles, you would have spotted the trend well enough to tell that they do a lot of business together and are acting together for similar political cause. Just google 'Russia China' and see for yourself.

I just told you what recent wikileaks suggested. Two countries may hold a number of meetings to strengthen relations but that does not mean a country lower its guard especially against a communist country like China.

Have you ever thought of the political and social implications if they suddenly withdraw? Afterall they did initiate the wars so they are responsible for the peace keeping missions there. Have you no idea on how many satelites they have in space? Don't you think they are better ways of 'keeping an eye' on someone than it is to have military bases there?

I see at the most US cutting down troops in Iraq and Afghanistan to subdue political or social sentiments. I beleive they will transition themselves from a military approach to a nation building one which will immensely help their economy. Dont forget Iraq and Afghanistan has huge potential in terms of economy and the US is fully in charge of them. They can easily turn it to a profit making venture.