Pakistan to build a Nuclear submarine

[ares]

Fine, Pakistan is not building nuke subs, its not doing any research in mini nuke reactors, it has no capability to make missiles launch from subs, it can't do anything.

happy now. you guys can make anything including Mars just like earth, and we Pakistanis can't do shiet.

Now Indians kindly go to sleep and let us discuss the news with some sanity.

There is no call sarcasm!!
Every new technology has a steep learning curve involved in it ..for all major powers, it took decades of R&D and billions of dollars to build and deploy such subs (especially when their industrial experience and resources far outstrip your own) and it would be foolish assume, the case will different for Pakistan.

 

[TaimiKhan]

I thought pakistan navy is defensive, and doesn't want to project power or being offensive. These statements where given many times on pdf (even by senior/premier members)....Is there change in doctrine of PN....if there is, kindly explain....

P.S.- If any one finds sarcasm, don't think it is. Asking genuinely...

Defensive doesn't means it can't have small offensive power to make its defence more good. PA is also a defensive force, but it keeps a small offensive capability, so that its not all the time on the defence and sometimes goes on the offensive to make the offensive party think more and become defensive also sometimes. And PN sub force was always for the offensive purpose.

As the saying goes, The best defence is a good offense.

 

[Chanakyaa]

Pakistan Doesnt Really Need Nuclear Subs.

Their Needs are Sufficed by Something Like U-216 ( SSK with 4000 Ton Displacement and Long Under Water Endurance ) , which solves the purpose more practically.

#1. Long Endurance and Moderate size.. 4000 Tons.
#2. Cheap to build n maintain u can get 20 U-216s for the price of 10 SSNs
#3. Silent than Nuclear Subs.. with all benifits of the same.
#4. Can be Delivered in 2-5 Years if Ordered
#5. Pakistan is NOT Looking for a Blue Water Navy so a Nuclear Sub is a waste of Money.
#6. Pakistan Already has Bad Name for Nuclear Proliferation ( Thanks to Dr. Khan ), if it seeks help for reactor miniaturization or technology it may worsen the situation.

 

[God of Death]

So now towards the real topic.

If the news is true, which by the way was already being worked on, its a good step, but some factors need to be thought about.

First is economy and economic conditions, which are vital for any development of such platforms and keeping them running/operational. Till we don't improve our economy, we can field such platforms in numbers and may face operational issues too. A 4-5 nuke subs with atleast 2-3 platforms always operationally ready would be a good start, but we need to focus on the conventional AIP capable subs too, with the capability to launch Cruise Missiles.

With local manufacturing and help from Chinese, we can develop such subs at pretty cheap rate compared to what is sold in the international market.

I say we go for it, plus economic conditions need to be improved too.

Bhai, i respect you most among Mods/admin/super Mods and finds ur post rational, unbiased and informative.

But u are disappointing me 4-5 Nuke subs that to just for starter.

Don't u think its too much to digest.

 

[Saifullah Sani]

Pak Navy to build nuclear submarine
Updated : Friday February 10 , 2012 10:40:34 PM

Pakistan has decided to build nuclear submarine for Pakistan Navy to better meet its defense requirements.

The nuclear submarine would be build in the country.

It would take anywhere from 5 to 8 years to build the nuclear submarine after which Pakistan would join the list of countries that has a nuclear submarine.

Presently Pakistan has a fleet of five regular submarines.
Pak Navy to build nuclear submarine,2/11/2012 12:15:38 AM

 

[TaimiKhan]

Pakistan Doesnt Really Need Nuclear Subs.

Their Needs are Sufficed by Something Like U-216, which solves the purpose more practically.

#1. Long Endurance and Moderate size.. 4000 Tons.
#2. Cheap to build n maintain u can get 20 U-216s for the price of 10 SSNs
#3. Silent than Nuclear Subs.. with all benifits of the same.
#4. Can be Delivered in 2-5 Years if Ordered
#5. Pakistan is NOT Looking for a Blue Water Navy so a Nuclear Sub is a waste of Money.
#6. Pakistan Already has Bad Name for Nuclear Proliferation ( Thanks to Dr. Khan ), if it seeks help for reactor miniaturization or tehnology it may worsen the situation.

First of all the U-boats are practical if they are being sold which they are not and then do we have the money to buy them in numbers, which again is a big question.

nuke boat is not always for a blue water navy purpose, they can be for some other purpose for us.

And US, Europe, France, Israel have a much much more bad name and record of nuke proliferation compared to us, but problem is you guys can't see it, since Pakistan is infront of you guys. Its understandable, we may have done the same if we had been in your guys shoes.

Nuke subs for Pakistan has some benefits which AIP capable subs may not have.

 

[TaimiKhan]

Bhai, i respect you most among Mods/admin/super Mods and finds ur post rational, unbiased and informative.

But u are disappointing me 4-5 Nuke subs that to just for starter.

Don't u think its too much to digest.

Bhai Sb,plz see my whole post, in which i firstly and lastly talked about economic conditions, if they are good, they will give us room to make something like 4-5, otherwise if economic conditions remain the same, we may hardly be able to afford one. So my figure is for the most favorable economic conditions, and 4-5 means 2-3 are operational all the times while 2-3 may be in docks for overhauling or servicing.

But again saying, we need to see to our economic worries and then go for such expensive toys.

 

[farhan_9909]

once again congrats to all my PAKISTAN FELLOW's

for entering in the elite group of atleast started work on Nuclear submarine

News of this year for ME

Mubarak hoo dostooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

 

[TaimiKhan]

There is no call sarcasm!!
Every new technology has a steep learning curve involved in it ..for all major powers, it took decades of R&D and billions of dollars to build and deploy such subs (especially when their industrial experience and resources far outstrip your own) and it would be foolish assume, the case will different for Pakistan.

First of all Pakistan is in the nuke field for decades now, we have been operating nuke reactors for decades and with the help of China been involved in the designing / construction of nuke reactors, so its not something new for us.

And Pakistan has been looking into the nuke reactor miniaturizing thingy for quiet sometime now and after having studied and found capable itself to achieve this hurdle, it has decided to go for this project. Nobody takes a step without first knowing where the step is gonna land. it has taken this decision after some thinking and after looking at its industrial capability.

We are a cash strapped nation, we are not like others who through millions or billions on projects with closed eyes and hope that something will come good out of it, we first think, make a road map, see if the project can be done with what we have and then go with it. Our some military related projects are an example, where with minimum resources and off course with help of others we got some wonderful things.

 

[Safriz]

research into mini ractors is good..
but the cost of building and maintaining a nuclear sub may outweigh benifits...
as for second strike capability...pakistan has enough of mobile launchers..
drop a multi megaton hydrogen bomb on one side of kala chitta and pn the other side of the mountain a kissile launcher will still be able to launch second strike...the mountain will absorb the blast....

 

[Rafi]

To all the naysayers all the nuclear powers have eventually deployed strategic weapons at sea, they are a true stealth weapon as they can remain at sea for months at a time, the only limit being food and crew durability.

The plan for Nuclear Submarines has been on the cards since the early 90's - We will not reinvent the wheel, many of the subsystems will come from Agosta and the Qing submarine projects as well as indigenous systems.

SLIM LINE TOWED ARRAY (SLTA)

Category : Sim Line Towed Array (SLTA)
Manufacturer :
Detail

Introduction



Detection of surface and sub-surface targets in ‘High Seas’ has always been a challenge due to varying sea / environmental conditions in the area. GIDS/MSL has designed and developed a Slim Line Towed Array Sonar to address the inherent limitation of the ‘Hull Mounted’ SONAR due to own noise and environmental conditions of the sea.

The designed is aimed towards long detection ranges (relevant to the prevailing sea conditions). The SLTA comprises the Wet End sub-system i.e. an Analogue Linear Array towed behind the submarine and the Dry End sub-system which is the onboard processing hardware.

Wet-End Configuration

DCM - Deck Cable Module
TCM - Tow Cable module
AAM - Acoustic Array Module
VIM - Vibration Isolation Module
SDM - Snubber Drogue Module
Features



1.

Outer Diameter

Less than 55 mm

2.

No of Acoustic Channels

More than 75

3.

Overall Weight

1,000 kg approx.

4.

Handling Onboard

5-6 men

5.

Installation Procedure

- Simpler

- Allows free movements

6.

Deployment & Recovery

Easy

a. Front End Conditioner Module ( FECM) . The FECM performs amplification of multi-channel analogue acoustic signals from wet end. It performs a multiplexing, analogue-to-digital conversion and then grouping the channels according to wet-end geometry. It provides an adequate dynamic range, anti-aliasing filtering function with variable sampling rate and accuracy. The resulting data from FECM is then transferred for further processing on the DSP cards.



b. Digital Signal Processing Module (DSPM). The DSPM is responsible for signal processing of the digitised data. It performs beam forming, high-resolution spectral analysis, and audio processing for target detection purposes. The DSPM forms beams of signal coming from the wet-end and also performs vernier analysis on selected channel groups. Audio beams are also formed in DSPM and passed to DPM for performing and classification. After signal processing the resultant data is forwarded to DPM for further processing.



c. Data Processing Module (DPM). The DPM receives digitised data from DSP module and then performs post detection processing, involving parameter estimation, and data transformation in accordance with operator requirements for Sonar Display. It performs normalisation, multi-target-tracking and DEMON analysis for target localisation and classification purposes. The output data of DPM is then displayed on the screens running on the MMI machine.



d. Control Processing Module (CPM). The CPM is responsible for overall system synchronisation and message passing among the processing chain modules. It performs event initialisation, performance monitoring and fault localisation.

e. Man Machine Interface Module (MMIM) . This module is responsible for operator interaction and exhibits all the functionality of the SLTA system in the form of displays that operator can manipulate according to the scenario. The major passive displays are broadband surveillance, broadband history, narrowband surveillance, narrowband review, signals analysis, performance monitoring and fault localisation.

MMI Software Characteristics

The MMI is a part of dry end sub system. It provides the operator with the control to interact with the system through displays and input devices. The five octaves are processed simultaneously and their results are displayed on the MMI. Tracking capability is given in the MMI. Provision is given to the operator to listen to the audio.

Broad Band Surveillance

The TA Broadband Surveillance provides a basis for the following functionalities:

Initial detection i.e. identification of a signal as a possible contact
Initiation and maintenance of target tracks achieved by tagging it with an OIT (Operator Initiated Track).
To show the real time behaviour of the contact over short period of time by providing a history of contact motion to allow the operator to predict future movement and possible destination of target.

::GLOBAL INDUSTRIAL AND DEFENCE SOLUTIONS ::

 

[farhan_9909]

Rafi@@@@bhai jaan

Marine limited has developed battle management system as well as a ATAS sonar and the agosta90B has the local one instead of french one..

MSL Advanced Towed Array Sonar (ATAS) - a towed array sonar developed by Maritime Systems Ltd. (MSL) and MTC to replace old systems in service with the Pakistan Navy (PN) and for export. Project started during 1990s, Commodore Sarfraz appointed as program chief. System was designed to cope with Arabian Sea environment and is stated to be superior to foreign systems being offered for export. Expected to be installed on Agosta 70 and Agosta 90B class submarines currently in service with the PN, also being integrated with the Agosta 90B's SUBTICS combat management system, as well as future vessels to be acquired by the PN such as new submarines and corvettes.[2]

Work on Sub based nuclear reactor is arlready started years backk
battle management system as well as Sonar of ATAS by marine system karachi
france has upgraded and has installed the necessary infrastructure for construction of submarine at karachishipyard
weapon either frrom china or developing one on our own

 

[mirage 5000]

but officer of pns hamza told me its very very hard to work on a sub .and you guys making nuke sub to send them under water for months lolz BTW agusta was loaded with so many torpedoes and they give us sweets too

 

[mirage 5000]

chalo aik or dekho jab tak main unban nhi ho jata aik aik per guzara kero

 

[Saifullah Sani]