Pakistan tests Ghauri Missile

[CriticalThought]

Russian forces experienced this kind of attack in Syria in 2018: https://www.cnbc.com/2018/01/11/swa...s-attacks-russian-military-base-in-syria.html

As you can see, that attack flopped.

Again, we need to keep in mind that S-400 will not be operating in isolation. Expect additional set of defenses around it.

EW sounds good but S-400 is jamming resistant to large extent. According to Russian military professionals, only US have sufficient airborne EW capabilities to affect/disable S-400 and similar systems. Surface-based EW systems will not do.

PAF Blinders squadron strength: 3 x French Dassault Falcon 20F EW aircraft. Not sure if these are up to the task since S-400 is 21st century Russian product. India will induct 6 in total.

If India position S-400 systems near Pakistan, they would be able to track movement of various aircraft deep inside Pakistan, and keep IAF informed. Conversely, standard interceptor of S-400 (i.e. 48N6E2) can take out an aircraft from up to 200 KM away.

Indians might not operate S-400 FTR at full capacity on 24/7 basis (expensive). Maintenance breaks can also be expected. However, they will not be sleeping in times of escalation.

As I pointed out earlier, S-400 systems will change the calculus of engagement between India and Pakistan. Situation will not be the same.

Agree 100% with your assessment here. We have options, but they are very limited options,

 

[The Deterrent]

@The Deterrent shouldn't we be testing Ababeel , Babur , Ra'ad , and Nasr with longer range ??

We should also be maintaining operational readiness. Ghauri launches are exercised more often because its launch preparation SOPs are much more complex than those of the solid-fueled missiles.

Training launch and this time they show missile hitting ground (not full missile but only reentry vehicle) which means Indian ABM service mien anay se pehley hi obsolete ho gaya..
@The Deterrent

Nonsense. A successful and precise impact has nothing to do with any ABM.

Also the fact that this was test fired from Tilla, meaning that test range is operation again. Good news.

Who said that it was launched from Tilla?

Ghauri might be a testbed to test some stuff for 3rd stage of Ababeel ? As it is speculated, 3rd stage is liquid fuel a ? It's been 2 years since Ababeel was tested. Perhaps it is difficult to master MIRV technology on its own ?

No, Ghauri is not used for testing anything new. It can potentially be used, but the Shaheen series is a much better testbed for those purposes. Ababeel's third stage cannot be simulated via Ghauri since both rocket engines would have drastically different parameters, even if Ghauri's rocket engine was made restart-able.

I believe Ababeel's third stage is not liquid but solid as well.
@The Deterrent

Ababeel's third stage HAS to be restart-able, therefore must be liquid-fueled.

Many thought Ghauri was dead but I am also curious why Ghauri is being brought back.

Nothing is being "brought back". This was just an exercise.

@Oscar @The Deterrent -- it seems the Ghauri was iteratively improved over the years. Is this an example of Pakistan improving its liquid fuel rocket technology?

Nope, Ghauri still has the same maximum range as it did when it was first deployed. In fact, its range decreased over time (since the 1998) because Pakistan introduced its 'own' guidance and subsystems.

The original Nodong (improved Scud) could strike as far as 1300km. Thats where the 1300 figure comes from. Since the first few Ghauris were just repainted Nodongs, they had the same range. However it had terrible accuracy, so Pakistan modified the Ghauri by introducing the same guidance and subsystems used aboard the Shaheen series (no wonder NESCOM Chairman witnessed the exercise). The added weight incurred a penalty on max range, which was substantially reduced.
The press release should be (sometimes) taken with a pinch of salt.

I understand the SLV work is completely separate, but any chance the resources that had gone into the Ghauri et. al were shifted to SLVs (thus leaving the bulk of all new ballistic missile work for solid fuel)?

You're onto something here.
All I can say is that the SLV is a joint project.

 

[Maarkhoor]

Nonsense. A successful and precise impact has nothing to do with any ABM.

You are stupid ?
What I am saying is reentry vehicle hit the ground not full missile like scud....


shame on you,..

Ababeel's third stage HAS to be restart-able, therefore must be liquid-fueled.

Not third stage but reentry vehicle UNCLE......

 

[The Deterrent]

You are stupid ?
What I am saying is reentry vehicle hit the ground not full missile like scud....


shame on you,..

Ghauri had a separable RV from day one. But of course, shame on me for knowing that it has been this way for 20 years.

Not third stage but reentry vehicle UNCLE......

You said "I believe Ababeel's third stage is not liquid but solid as well." Anyways, why and how would the RV be solid-fueled?

As for your remark in caps..

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

It is in American interest to have a non-NATO ally with S-400. They will use them for practice just like they used the Su-30 for practice. I expect major exercises with IAF in the future.

Unfortunately, Russians might know it too!!! Hence, standard products are for exports....

 

[CriticalThought]

Unfortunately, Russians might know it too!!! Hence, standard products are for exports....

It all depends on what the Indians are able to negotiate.

 

[MimophantSlayer]

Ghauri Ballistic Missile - Pride of Pakistan.

This is the ballistic missiles that frightened India into carrying out nuclear tests in May 1998.

Yaar tumlog thakte nahin? From all that self back patting?

The Pokhran 2 tests were planned way before 1998, before even Ghauri was tested.
US satellites had detected activity at the Pokhran test sites way back in 1995.
http://nuclearweaponarchive.org/India/IndiaMomentum.html

 

[GodToons]

lol!! Seriously bad choice when talking to International agency to get some money to keep home running.
Getting into the trap laid by your neighbour.

 

[Safriz]

Do we have different versions of Ghauri?
Both above in pics are Ghauri and look different?

 

[Ultima Thule]

View attachment 504773

View attachment 504774

Do we have different versions of Ghauri?
Both above in pics are Ghauri and look different?

Which one is new @شاھین میزایل

 

[Safriz]

Which one is new @شاھین میزایل

none..both are old pics

 

[Thorough Pro]

There is no problem without a solution, one just needs to think outside the box.
I have a wild idea, it may or may not work but that needs to be tested. How about using a ballistic or cruise missile as a launch vehicle to carry and release hundreds of very small suicide drones (as in the vid) with very small explosives (but not three grams) to attack the defensive target. Let s see which S400 or AD battery can deal with that.

The calculus changes significantly with cheap drones and EW.

I always propose a defensive posture, but a defence that is impregnable. And I have no dreams of any kind of peace with India. They have a Hindu fundamentalist mindset, and they are looking for regional hegemony. The American agenda is to have India as the regional power with its powerbase ranging from Afghanistan to Vietnam. It sees Pakistan bending backwards to appease Indian whims. This is untenable for Pakistan, hence why we are labelled as revisionist. Our national interests DO NOT align with the World Order.

 

[CriticalThought]

There is no problem without a solution, one just needs to think outside the box.
I have a wild idea, it may or may not work but that needs to be tested. How about using a ballistic or cruise missile as a launch vehicle to carry and release hundreds of very small suicide drones (as in the vid) with very small explosives (but not three grams) to attack the defensive target. Let s see which S400 or AD battery can deal with that.

This technology doesn't exist today.

 

[Arsalan]

Who said that it was launched from Tilla?

The pictures, plus i did not saw a statement claiming otherwise. Ghauri series was developed by KRL and they use Tilla for test firing. Also the landscape of the area in pictures from the last test looked similar to landscape of that area anyway so i said it. Do you know something else? where was it fired from? The pictures sure look like Tilla range.

 

[Inception-06]

We should also be maintaining operational readiness. Ghauri launches are exercised more often because its launch preparation SOPs are much more complex than those of the solid-fueled missiles.


Nonsense. A successful and precise impact has nothing to do with any ABM.


Who said that it was launched from Tilla?


No, Ghauri is not used for testing anything new. It can potentially be used, but the Shaheen series is a much better testbed for those purposes. Ababeel's third stage cannot be simulated via Ghauri since both rocket engines would have drastically different parameters, even if Ghauri's rocket engine was made restart-able.


Ababeel's third stage HAS to be restart-able, therefore must be liquid-fueled.


Nothing is being "brought back". This was just an exercise.


Nope, Ghauri still has the same maximum range as it did when it was first deployed. In fact, its range decreased over time (since the 1998) because Pakistan introduced its 'own' guidance and subsystems.

The original Nodong (improved Scud) could strike as far as 1300km. Thats where the 1300 figure comes from. Since the first few Ghauris were just repainted Nodongs, they had the same range. However it had terrible accuracy, so Pakistan modified the Ghauri by introducing the same guidance and subsystems used aboard the Shaheen series (no wonder NESCOM Chairman witnessed the exercise). The added weight incurred a penalty on max range, which was substantially reduced.
The press release should be (sometimes) taken with a pinch of salt.


You're onto something here.
All I can say is that the SLV is a joint project.

Is The Ghaznavi (missile) also from the Shaheen family missile program and are the Hatf-1 Abdali missile and Ghaznavi still in production, which role have this 4 Types of missiles, Hatf-1,Ghazvani, Ghaurie when we have shaheen 1-2 and 3