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Pakistan navy post 2020 - Future Plans

You aren't an expert either, and think of old military concepts. I'm 16 years old and I know I'm much smarter than you were at my age m8.
ok mr self proclaim expert, so you're a teenager with no basic knowledge of defense/ strategies/tactic, can you tell me what is the difference between high by pass ratio engine and low by pass engine mr self proclaims teenager expert
 
ok mr self proclaim expert, so you're a teenager with no basic knowledge of defense/ strategies/tactic, can you tell me what is the difference between high by pass ratio engine and low by pass engine mr self proclaims teenager expert
That topic is not solely defense, therefore I will not answer it although I have studied aircraft it is not my main focus. I need something solely used in defense and I will answer it without using Google on God.
 
That topic is not solely defense, therefore I will not answer it although I have studied aircraft it is not my main focus. I need something solely used in defense and I will answer it without using Google on God.
but concepts and theories to put medeium range SAMs on fast attack crafts are really ridiculous, and with current circumstances there is a least chance PN will get ESSM/RAM from USA
 
but concepts and theories to put medeium range SAMs on fast attack crafts are really ridiculous, and with current circumstances there is a least chance PN will get ESSM/RAM from USA
That doesn't make sense, PN has been operating Oliver Hazard Perry frigates for a while and they haven't been sanctioned yet. I'm sure US would allow missiles to PN. Give me 5 reasons why mounting medium range SAMs on FAC is ridiculous? Even Bilal Khan upvoted my answer which leads me to think he agrees with me.
 
That doesn't make sense, PN has been operating Oliver Hazard Perry frigates for a while and they haven't been sanctioned yet. I'm sure US would allow missiles to PN. Give me 5 reasons why mounting medium range SAMs on FAC is ridiculous? Even Bilal Khan upvoted my answer which leads me to think he agrees with me.
USA currently tends toward India and in congress have strong lobby of India, you don't know what is the current relations between USA and pakistan

Main thing is tactics is different from large ships for FAC, and only few medium range SAM FAC can carries after that what would happened to your beloved FAC equipped with medium range SAMs
 
USA currently tends toward India and in congress have strong lobby of India, you don't know what is the current relations between USA and pakistan

Main thing is tactics is different from large ships for FAC, and only few medium range SAM FAC can carries after that what would happened to your beloved FAC equipped with medium range SAMs
Resupplies...?
 
Your FACs -- or sub-1,000-ton ships in general -- shouldn't be the main anti-air warfare (AAW) or even anti-ship warfare (AShW) asset. Rather, they're a low-cost means of delivering anti-ship missiles (or in the PNS Himmat's case, land-attack cruise missiles).

So, if you fit those FACs with medium-range SAMs, you should look at them as supporting assets, like filling blind spots. But definitely not your central naval assets.

However, adding VL-SAMs to a FAC is still costly. It'd be an extra $20-30 m to the cost, and that cost is the same whether it's on a FAC or a 2,000+ ton ship like the Jinnah-class. It's a luxury we can't afford (in that we have to put that money on more urgent areas, like LRMPAs).

Europe's into inserting VLS to FACs, but Turkey decided (for its FAC-55 design) to just install a pedestal SAM (RAM) for self-defence purposes only. I think the PN will likely go this route.
 
it seems between now and 2022/23 PN will induct 10 ships of 2000+ ton, not a bad progress.
 
Defence Turkey: PNS Moawin (AOE-39), a 17,000-ton class marine tanker built within the scope of the Pakistan Navy’s Fleet Replenishment Ship Project, the first export of STM on the basis of military ships and the largest export of our country in a single lot at that time, was launched on August 19, 2016 at Karachi Shipyard & Engineering Works and was put into service on October 16, 2018. What would you like to tell us about the experience gained from this project, where STM has been the Main Contractor and what type of feedback have you received from the end user regarding the ship during the previous year?

Murat İKİNCİ: PNS Moawin has been actively used in the Pakistan Navy since its entry to service and has accomplished many tasks and exercises. It successfully performed its duties in the international exercise AMAN-2019, which was organized by the Pakistani Naval Forces with the participation of senior government representatives. During this exercise and following Pakistan National Exercises, senior guests and press members followed the naval phase of the exercise at PNS Moawin.

During the course of the exercises the ship attended and underwent activities such as the replenishment of fuel, water, food, medicine, etc. to the other navy vessels. It was also observed that the ship was able to cruise smoothly even under harsh sea and wind conditions and that it was able to perform helicopter operations successfully thanks to its helicopter deck and hangar, and also provided medical support to other navy units through its medical facilities.

As expressed by Pakistani President Arif ALVI during the launching ceremony and the press statements in the media, the PNS Moawin is a modern and state of the art technology combat support ship. It is a ship capable of assuming many tasks in peacetime as well as emergencies and times of crisis. The commissioning of the ship into the inventory will provide the Pakistani Naval Forces superior flexibility in long-term operations. If required, the ship will also be performed in humanitarian operations as well.

STM has gained substantial experience in the establishment and maintenance of high-level cooperation with the Ministry of Defence Production, Naval Forces and military shipyards of a friendly and allied country, as well as in military shipbuilding, equipping, commissioning and testing activities. One of the most important gains in this project was the creation and development of a common working culture in all processes from the determination of ship configuration to the date of commissioning. This experience is positively reflected toward prospective projects.

Defence Turkey: STM recently signed a contract with the Pakistani Ministry of Defence Production on June 22, 2016, surpassing French DCNS Shipyard, Naval Group, the submarine manufacturer, in an international tender opened for the Mid-Life Update (MLU) of Khalid Class Submarines ‘Agosta 90B’. During this period, three contract amendments were signed in June 2017, February 2018 and March 2019 for the provision of two submarines and important subsystems from Turkish companies. Could you please inform us on the current status of the project, activities performed so far and the important milestones of the project in the upcoming period?

Murat İKİNCİ: As the main contractor, we are in the phase of Assembly and Integration on the first ship, disassembly of system devices because of unavailable space on the second ship and the preparation of the location for the assembly. By the end of 2019, we plan to complete the installation and integration activities of the systems supplied within the scope of Mid-Life Update in the PNS/M HAMZA submarine, the first submarine of the Project, and to finalize the Setting to Work (STW) tests. We aim to deliver the first submarine of the project PNS/M HAMZA to the Pakistan Navy at the end of December 2020, after the completion of Harbor Acceptance Tests (HAT) in the first quarter of 2020, followed by the Sea Acceptance Tests (SAT).

Simultaneously with the first submarine activities, we plan to complete the Factory Acceptance Tests (FAT) of the systems belonging to PNS/M KHALID which is the second submarine within 2020, to perform the Assembly and Integration activities and to finalize the Preparations for Set to Work (STW) tests by the end of 2020. Our main goal is to deliver PNS/M KHALID to the Pakistani Navy in December 2021, one year after the delivery of the first submarine PNS/M HAMZA.

Defence Turkey: The MLU of the first submarine, which started in 2018, was planned to be delivered within September 2020 or the first quarter of 2021, and the MLU of the second submarine PNS/M Saad (S-138) was scheduled to start in 2019. Could you please provide information about the modernization and improvement work to be carried out on submarines, the products to be procured from Turkish Defence Industry companies, especially from Aselsan and Havelsan, and the estimated labor / man x hours for each submarine?

Murat İKİNCİ: Our main goal for the French originated KHALID class submarines, which are the most popular underwater platform of the Pakistan Navy, is to incorporate the cutting-edge technology products which are indispensable in terms of both effective duty execution and deterrence in a modern submarine. STM, following the completion of our efforts on activity analysis and customer requirements for such platforms, we will provide the Integrated Underwater Command Control System (ESKKS) and Sonar Suite and Sonar Subsystems that work in integration with it, the Submarine Information Distribution System, Underwater/Torpedo Fire Control System, Attack and Navigation Periscopes, ESM, Navigation Radar, Static Converters, Steering Control System, Ship Self-Noise Measurement System, Submarine Rescue Buoy and Digital Bridge Information Console with a 45 bar strength, and in addition to these systems we provide the Auxiliary Cooling Water System to cool the ESKKS, Torpedo Counter Measure System and Electronic Map Display and Information System.

The integrated Underwater Command Control System (ESKKS) and Submarine Information Distribution System are supplied by Havelsan, the ESM, Torpedo Counter Measure System and Navigation Radar System are supplied by Aselsan and the Auxiliary Cooling Water System by Bronswerk, Turkey. STM provides the Submarine Rescue Buoy, 45 bar resistant Digital Bridge Information Console, Electronic Map Display and Information system in addition to all materials for all structural/technical design, analysis, documentation and installation. We can express with pride that we have involved dozens of Turkish defence industry companies in this ecosystem considering the cables for installation, pipes, valves, flanges, panels, consumables, etc.

In addition to the aforementioned supplies, we are working together with Poyraz3M Ltd for activities within the scope of Integrated Logistics Support (ILS). In addition, for the first time in the world in a modernization project in the field of “Diving Safety”, which is vital for the submarine platform, we cooperate and procure services from the IACCS member DNV GL for the control of all the modifications made in the resistant boats and waterproofing bulkheads, control of certifications for all materials and the workmanship towards such parts and finally for the provision of “Diving Safety Certification” for the submarines.

For each submarine, an average of 930-man x months is estimated within the scope of the MLU. This figure does not contain the man x month values of our Subcontractors and the Pakistan Military Shipyard that provide labor activities. We proudly state that the number of companies or countries that can undertake a submarine MLU project on such a scale is countable on just one hand.

Defence Turkey: STM is also involved in the Pakistani Navy’s Miniature Submarine Program that includes 3 Cosmos MG110 (SX756 / W) mini submarines which were purchased in the 1980s and are currently in the inventory. At the signing ceremony held on February 8, 2019, you presented the scale model of the new design mini submarine to the officials of the Pakistani Ministry of Defence Production. What would you like to say about this Project?

Murat İKİNCİ: The first project prepared by STM in line with the needs of the Pakistan Naval Forces was submitted in 2017. Within this framework, efforts on the design of small-sized submarines capable of addressing a wider market are continuing within the scheduled plan.

Defence Turkey: During the AMAN 2019 Multinational Naval Exercise held in February 2019, Pakistani Navy officials were very pleased with STM and its activities. According to the information we obtained, the Pakistan Naval Forces plan to meet the needs for the MoShip Submarine Rescue Mother Ship if the necessary budget allocation is made. In addition, the feasibility study of Gwadar Port was carried out by STM. Could you please inform us about the projects that STM is currently interested in and about the activities conducted in Pakistan?

Murat İKİNCİ: As you mentioned, the Pakistan Navy brought to the agenda the need for the MoShip Submarine Rescue Ship and they are making efforts to meet such a need depending on the proposals that will be in line with their budgets. STM continues to search for alternative solutions for this request, and we will submit our study that includes alternative solutions for the Pakistan Navy in the near future. As mentioned before, the MLU of the Agosta-90 Submarines in the Pakistan Navy inventory is currently being carried out in Pakistan under the main contractorship of STM. In addition, Ormara Naval Harbor (ONH) Hydrodynamic studies and the port approach and in-port design are being carried out within the scope of our existing contract. STM is carrying on feasibility studies for the Submarine Maintenance Shipyard design to be located at Ormara Naval Harbor and Gwadar and Gwatar forward naval bases.

Defence Turkey: Has STM assumed any task/role in the Pakistan Naval Forces MiLGEM Corvette Project (later named the Jinnah Class by the Pakistan Naval Forces), the contract of which was signed on July 5, 2018 and was effective on March 11, 2019? Has there been any negotiation or cooperation with ASFAT? The construction of the first ship was planned to begin in September 2019.

Murat İKİNCİ: As I mentioned in the beginning of the interview, the export of the MiLGEM project, in which we take place in every phase from the outset, has been our target toward which we have been making great efforts as STM from the beginning and we continued these activities under the management and support of the Presidency of Defence Industries.

STM’s first contact with the Pakistan Naval Forces was at the IDEAS/Karachi Fair in 2006. The Pakistan Naval Forces expressed their desire to participate in the design and prototype construction of the Turkish Naval Forces MiLGEM Corvette, and as a result of the ongoing negotiations since 2015, detailed studies have been initiated with a focus on the Pakistan MiLGEM “Jinnah” Class Corvette Project.

During this process, with the close support and contribution of our Naval Forces, the Pakistani delegation was invited to Turkey to examine the MiLGEM Class ships.

As a result of the ongoing efforts, the MiLGEM “Ada” Class Corvette was chosen as the platform thanks to our solutions and engineering recommendations, and a Letter of Intent was signed by the Defence Ministers of both countries at IDEF’ 17 for the construction of MiLGEM corvettes in Karachi. The ongoing supply model was decided upon to be transformed into the model of direct purchase from Turkey and in the contract phase it was ensured to be a single Country and Ship as Turkey-MiLGEM.

Throughout this process, our main goal, as STM, has been to provide support for the sustainable development of technology and our defence industry through the national knowhow that gained via the MiLGEM Project, in addition to the export of the platforms that emerged during the MiLGEM Project.

As it is known, the contract for the supply of MiLGEM Class ships that will be constructed together by two allied countries and are to be acquired by the Pakistan Navy was signed with ASFAT. What is important is not the party of the contract; the important thing is that Turkey has obtained this project and the MiLGEM Corvette will be put into service of our friendly and allied country. We, as an organization with the greatest engineering experience in MiLGEM, are always ready to give our utmost support.

As STM, our efforts in shaping the Pakistan corvette project (the construction and delivery of which will be realized by ASFAT) as MiLGEM and obtaining it for our country will continue to bring forth benefits also to the navies of other countries.

https://www.defenceturkey.com/en/co...ojects-with-the-turkish-defence-industry-3635
 
PN is working according to a development plan, after the current programmes are well advanced. The follow up will include (if finances and economy are sufficiently strong to allow).

1. 6-8 new frigates (either newer type 054 or next gen PLAN).

2. Jet powered LRMPA to gradually replace P3.

3. Drone aircraft that can perform MP and ASW.

4. A type 071 or similar vessel 1 or 2.

5. A further 4 or 6 Jinnah Corvette/light frigate.

6. A further order of submarines after Hangor program is completed.

7. Coastal sub/special forces program.

8. Further expansion of Pak Marines.

9. Dedicated small number of fighter aircraft.

10. 4 - 6 destroyer vessels with 052 DDG most likely purchased. With talks between Chinese and Pakistani officials already taken place.

11. Development of SSBN and SSN and have a true 2nd and 3rd strike capability.

12. Long Range SLBM and SLCM.

This is very ambitious and any number of things could halt or stop these programs (finances being the most likely). But all the services and especially the Navy are thinking forward.
 
PN is working according to a development plan, after the current programmes are well advanced. The follow up will include (if finances and economy are sufficiently strong to allow).

1. 6-8 new frigates (either newer type 054 or next gen PLAN).

2. Jet powered LRMPA to gradually replace P3.

3. Drone aircraft that can perform MP and ASW.

4. A type 071 or similar vessel 1 or 2.

5. A further 4 or 6 Jinnah Corvette/light frigate.

6. A further order of submarines after Hangor program is completed.

7. Coastal sub/special forces program.

8. Further expansion of Pak Marines.

9. Dedicated small number of fighter aircraft.

10. 4 - 6 destroyer vessels with 052 DDG most likely purchased. With talks between Chinese and Pakistani officials already taken place.

11. Development of SSBN and SSN and have a true 2nd and 3rd strike capability.

12. Long Range SLBM and SLCM.

This is very ambitious and any number of things could halt or stop these programs (finances being the most likely). But all the services and especially the Navy are thinking forward.
2 LRMPA. What are the planes which can replace P3Cs considering thier capabilities?
6. Would they include Type 041s?
10. Love it. Hope they go forward with it
 

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