‘Pakistan missile project ahead of India’s’

[TOPGUN]

Haha hey comon just take it learn to be men and take it the truth is the truth it reality my indian friends get with a the pogram like i always say our indian's brothers always try to cover things up !!!!! unreal

 

[Logic note]

learn to be men and take it the truth is the truth

Here s truth - be a man and take it
Ministry of Defence Slams Mainstream Media's Slanderous Lies - Missile Program On Track | India Defence

i always say our indian's brothers always try to cover things up !!!!! unreal

And what are you ? Goutam Buddha ?

 

[Contrarian]

India to develop new missile systems with foreign collaboration | TwoCircles.net

Malay:

Far from being unsuccessful, I think the new approach has worked wonders - especially keeping in mind the recent tests. In that respect I disagree with the articles headline, but considering the jingoism in the media of the two countries, that is to be expected.

I agree, people here get overexcited on Indian or Pakistani news reporting for that matter. There is a reason why Indian defence media is referred to as DDM=Desi Dorky Media. They get almost even the basics wrong most of the times in the articles they write. THey conduct no background research. Ofcourse there are a few notable exceptions to this, those who are fabulous journos, and those who know their stuff and dont engage in stupid sensationalism.

India's overall missile program is slightly more successful than Pakistan's, at this point. India's program is definitely more diverse, and with all the collaboration being mentioned, it is only going solidify that advantage, unless Pakistan has something in the works or can initiate collaborative efforts of its own. Given resource constraints though, I doubt the Pakistan is going to invest in local development of the sort of variety of missiles India has - in the short term at least.

I agree partially mate. India's missile program has grown by leaps and bounds in the last 5 years particularly, when the results or fruits of previous decades of research bore fruit. For example everyone commented on how IGMDP was a failure, till about 5 years back, now its a Ringing success.

All these efforts till now have been indegenous, from the near ICBM range Agni III+, Dhanush(ship launched IRBM), Akash SAM, Astra AAM, there are loads of things that Pakistan has not managed till now, which undoubtably it will soon enough, but not at this point of time. And trust me, i believe that Nag will clear user trials just as spectacularly as Akash did.

All the money which was sunk in , is finally bearing fruit.

As far as establishing am industrial and scientific base, I agree that the IGMPD has allowed India to do that, and it would be unreasonable to suggest that Pakistan has not accomplished the same, though , like I said, not to as diverse a level as India's.

Mate, the industrial and scientific base related to military or defence is quite small compared to what India has and all this has been the result of 'failed' projects as some call it like the IGMDP, LCA, Arjun among others. THis is something that producing equipment on ToT can simply not replicate. Case in point is India producing MKI under ToT. Sure it gives exposure, but not even close to what the above mentioned projects have given.

Now, India has achieved a level of industrial and scientific pool such that JV's actually mean JV's and not renamed ToT's. The pool will allow the technology and skill to be absorbed, faster designing and development of equipment.

The long and hard way has paid India off much more compared to Pakistan.

To give you an idea of how fast things are progressing with respect to just the SAM environment!...Barak 8 based Long Range Area Defence Systems are being build in a JV with Israel, Akash SAM for mid level coverage, SPYDER quick Reaction SAM for complementing Akash. Maitri LLRQM(Low level quick reaction missile)-SAM for low level coverage. This is in addition to the AAD based BMD system being made, which itself has the ability to engage planes and CM's, this would be ultra long range and itself is of two types, endo atmospheric and exo atmospheric!. And this is in addition to the existing SAM's India already posses...

And here i am discounting even the possibility of DRDO converting Astra to an SAM, which has been done by many companies, the notable examples being SLAMRAAM, and IRIS-T SL.

 

[Skywalker]

Let these Indians live in fools paradise, that whatever stolen or so called indegineously built technology they have its superior, their super douper missiles can do anything, their lca is better than all the western aircrafts but there is a big question mark...whatever they have will be operated by an Indian m bit reliefed that when the time comes wont be much problem and would be tackled easily.

 

[Black Stone]

The Indians does seem to love the word "indigenous"

Anyways....the French video was funny lol.

Funny French.

 

[blain2]

Failures happen everywhere. I am sure Pakistan has seen her share in this difficult work of military production. I think the key point for Pakistan is not to become complacent regardless of the problems on the Indian side. India has enough resources to make up for such problems by buying systems from outside. We don't.

With the conventional disparity increasing by the day, a credible, comparable nuclear capability is a must for Pakistan (I am not suggesting that India is waiting to eat up Pakistan or anything like that, but if we do not want to be unduly pressurized then there is no room for complacency).

 

[EagleEyes]

Ministry of Defence Slams Mainstream Media's Slanderous Lies - Missile Program On Track | India Defence



Our strength is perceived as our weakness but they fail to realise our strength is their weakness
Its like Nano Vs Sitara

Buddy you do like to talk to youself.

 

[Contrarian]

With the conventional disparity increasing by the day, a credible, comparable nuclear capability is a must for Pakistan (I am not suggesting that India is waiting to eat up Pakistan or anything like that, but if we do not want to be unduly pressurized then there is no room for complacency).

India is not doing something miraculous with its nuclear capability mate. The missiles are just getting newer and more accurate. In the end the nuclear capability and the delivery platforms of Pakistan will remain the same as for India. India is just increasing the range of its nuclear missiles so that the whole of China gets in range. Pakistan has no need for that, it can already target the major cities in India.

 

[KENT]

What on earth are you going about? The article clearly mentions the Indian Newspaper it sources from, and also the Indian individuals who are making the claim:


Grasping at straws aren't you, to try and paint this as a "biased Pakistani perspective". The headline is the statement in the Indian Newspaper, not an invention of the author of the Dawn report. This is all your crap. Take it up with the Indian publication, and the Indian scientists making those statements. I made my views clear on this in my first post

If you had comprehended my post correctly, you didn’t made such a statements. Go back and read what I had wrote. “I claimed that India by its ideology is democracy which means people have the freedom of expression and voice and hence anyone can come forward and express their annoyance and opinions on any kind of Military project being perceived by India whether it is positive or negative.


I had raised question mark over the crediability of DAWN article which was lacking in Factual observations without knowing the ground reality of missile tech between India and Pak and even name of the correspondent was absent.

And once again, criticizing just so you can? What accusation? How is what you said any different from my post? How are you judging "sincerity" (and for that matter what do you mean by being sincere in this context) from my post?

Your pervious post about India space research extensively being sourced from Russia, lacking in description and hence I had to add Europeon and NASA’s space establishments to made it much more descriptive.





[/QUOTE]
Take a chill pill - collaborative efforts are the way forward, and now the Indians have finally "officially" accepted that approach.[/QUOTE]

After all an authentic approach.

 

[fatman17]

Jane's Defence Weekly - January 16, 2008

India calls time on indigenous Integrated Guided-Missile Development Programme
Rahul Bedi JDW Correspondent - New Delhi

Key Points
India has closed its Integrated Guided Missile Development Programme after 24 years characterised by delays and escalating costs

The DRDO is to look overseas and to local industry to deliver future missile systems


India's Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) has announced the termination of its indigenous Integrated Guided Missile Development Programme (IGMDP) after 24 years marked by technical over-reach, lengthy delays and cost escalation.

Announcing the closure of the INR17.17 billion (USD440 million) programme - at a time when only two of its five missile systems had been inducted into service - the DRDO's Chief Controller, Dr S Prahlada, said on 8 January in New Delhi that the organisation would henceforth turn to foreign collaborators and local private industry to design new systems.

It would, he added, now take only five to six years to develop a missile system, compared with the two decades and more that it previously took, given that past technology embargoes were no longer in place.

Prahlada said some 14 countries, including France, Germany, Israel, Russia, Singapore, the UK and the United States, were "knocking on the DRDO's doors" to collaborate in the missile field, while the country's industrial base had also grown in capability. Strategic programmes to build long-range nuclear missiles to reinforce India's deterrence would, however, be undertaken "in-house" by the DRDO.

With Russian collaboration, the DRDO recently designed the supersonic BrahMos cruise missile configured on the 3M55 Oniks/Yakhont system (NATO designation: SS-NZX-26) with a range of 292 km. Astra, a beyond-visual-range air-to-air missile that can hit targets at a range of 80 km, is under development with French help. India's private sector is involved in both of these programmes.

Launched in 1983 by Dr A P J Abdul Kalam, who rose to become India's president in 2002, the IGMDP involved the development of the Agni ('Fire') I & II intermediate-range ballistic missiles (IRBMs), Prithvi surface-to-surface missile (SSM) variants and Akash ('Sky') and Trishul ('Trident') surface-to-air missiles (SAMs).

Army trials for the fifth system, the Nag ('Snake') anti-tank missile, which has been under development for more than two decades, are scheduled for later this year.

"By December 2008, all five missile systems will have been transferred to the users," Prahlada stated.

The Indian armed forces, however, conceded that the two Agni systems and the Prithvi tactical battlefield SSM variants were "riddled" with operational glitches, while the Trishul has proven a failure because of inadequate guidance and stabilisation system, in addition to numerous other drawbacks.

In 2003 the government informed parliament that the Trishul had been shelved and withdrawn from user service and that it would be treated as a "technology demonstrator".

However, a dogged DRDO - under military pressure for non-performance, alleged arbitrariness and a lack of accountability - refused to abandon the system and recently declared it a success without adequate corroboration from the armed forces.

The Trishul's failure forced the Indian Navy in 2000 to meet its operational needs by importing Israel Aircraft Industries/Rafael Barak air-defence missile systems for its warships and lone aircraft carrier at great expense.

"In technological terms the IGMDP has been a learning curve for the DRDO, but its end products have not measured up to the services' expectations," said retired Brigadier Arun Sahgal of the United Services Institute in Delhi.

Although the Indian Air Force has agreed to induct the delayed Akash, following extended user trials in December 2007, the army has sprung a surprise by rejecting the system, claiming that it failed to meet its requirements to plug vital gaps in its weak air defence. The army also believed that the DRDO would be unable to develop the Akash for the force's specific use for at least a decade.

Consequently, the army will soon float global tenders for three regiments of Quick Reaction Surface-to-Air Missile (QRSAM) systems for around USD1 billion as urgent replacements for its obsolete, Russian-built Kvadrat SAMs.

In an associated development, the DRDO's V K Sarawat announced India's intentions to test an advanced nuclear-capable Agni III+ IRBM with a range of more than 5,000 km early next year.

The proposed missile would build on the Agni III, the 3,000-km IRBM successfully test-fired in April 2007, as part of India's goal of developing a strategic deterrent against neighbouring nuclear rival China.

© 2008 Jane's Information Group

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Malay:

While the Anza and Bakhtar Shikan system could be considered ToT - the development of the Shaheen, Babur and Raad missiles indicates that the infrastructure is in place. Even if the initial knowhow was from the Chinese, the fact that Pakistan was able to increase the range of both the Shaheen and Babur, and then develop the air launched Raad (along with reported development of a naval version) indicates that Pakistan has moved quite ways beyond simple ToT.

An ADS is reportedly in the works, something Musharraf publicly demanded, and pointed out the gap in our air defense capability. Nothing that takes away from India's capability though.

 

[KENT]

Jane's Defence Weekly - January 16, 2008

India calls time on indigenous Integrated Guided-Missile Development Programme
Rahul Bedi JDW Correspondent - New Delhi

Key Points
India has closed its Integrated Guided Missile Development Programme after 24 years characterised by delays and escalating costs

The DRDO is to look overseas and to local industry to deliver future missile systems


India's Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) has announced the termination of its indigenous Integrated Guided Missile Development Programme (IGMDP) after 24 years marked by technical over-reach, lengthy delays and cost escalation.

Announcing the closure of the INR17.17 billion (USD440 million) programme - at a time when only two of its five missile systems had been inducted into service - the DRDO's Chief Controller, Dr S Prahlada, said on 8 January in New Delhi that the organisation would henceforth turn to foreign collaborators and local private industry to design new systems.

It would, he added, now take only five to six years to develop a missile system, compared with the two decades and more that it previously took, given that past technology embargoes were no longer in place.

Prahlada said some 14 countries, including France, Germany, Israel, Russia, Singapore, the UK and the United States, were "knocking on the DRDO's doors" to collaborate in the missile field, while the country's industrial base had also grown in capability. Strategic programmes to build long-range nuclear missiles to reinforce India's deterrence would, however, be undertaken "in-house" by the DRDO.

With Russian collaboration, the DRDO recently designed the supersonic BrahMos cruise missile configured on the 3M55 Oniks/Yakhont system (NATO designation: SS-NZX-26) with a range of 292 km. Astra, a beyond-visual-range air-to-air missile that can hit targets at a range of 80 km, is under development with French help. India's private sector is involved in both of these programmes.

Launched in 1983 by Dr A P J Abdul Kalam, who rose to become India's president in 2002, the IGMDP involved the development of the Agni ('Fire') I & II intermediate-range ballistic missiles (IRBMs), Prithvi surface-to-surface missile (SSM) variants and Akash ('Sky') and Trishul ('Trident') surface-to-air missiles (SAMs).

Army trials for the fifth system, the Nag ('Snake') anti-tank missile, which has been under development for more than two decades, are scheduled for later this year.

"By December 2008, all five missile systems will have been transferred to the users," Prahlada stated.

The Indian armed forces, however, conceded that the two Agni systems and the Prithvi tactical battlefield SSM variants were "riddled" with operational glitches, while the Trishul has proven a failure because of inadequate guidance and stabilisation system, in addition to numerous other drawbacks.

In 2003 the government informed parliament that the Trishul had been shelved and withdrawn from user service and that it would be treated as a "technology demonstrator".

However, a dogged DRDO - under military pressure for non-performance, alleged arbitrariness and a lack of accountability - refused to abandon the system and recently declared it a success without adequate corroboration from the armed forces.

The Trishul's failure forced the Indian Navy in 2000 to meet its operational needs by importing Israel Aircraft Industries/Rafael Barak air-defence missile systems for its warships and lone aircraft carrier at great expense.

"In technological terms the IGMDP has been a learning curve for the DRDO, but its end products have not measured up to the services' expectations," said retired Brigadier Arun Sahgal of the United Services Institute in Delhi.

Although the Indian Air Force has agreed to induct the delayed Akash, following extended user trials in December 2007, the army has sprung a surprise by rejecting the system, claiming that it failed to meet its requirements to plug vital gaps in its weak air defence. The army also believed that the DRDO would be unable to develop the Akash for the force's specific use for at least a decade.

Consequently, the army will soon float global tenders for three regiments of Quick Reaction Surface-to-Air Missile (QRSAM) systems for around USD1 billion as urgent replacements for its obsolete, Russian-built Kvadrat SAMs.

In an associated development, the DRDO's V K Sarawat announced India's intentions to test an advanced nuclear-capable Agni III+ IRBM with a range of more than 5,000 km early next year.

The proposed missile would build on the Agni III, the 3,000-km IRBM successfully test-fired in April 2007, as part of India's goal of developing a strategic deterrent against neighbouring nuclear rival China.

© 2008 Jane's Information Group

Once again another tredgey has took place within this article, once from Jane defence weekly or Rakesh Bedi, just look at the date of the articles "January 16, 2008"


once such article about submarine accident being posted in Naval thread with same date manipulation.

 

[Proud to be Pakistani]

Nothing to laugh at but its true that DRDO is a white elephant being fed by Indians for 25years and only God knows why.

As for the Missile tech, its a known Fact that Pakistani Missile Infrustructure is advanced then Indians and doesnot need any proof. When the time comes all will know the potential of Pakistani Missiles.

 

[Goodperson]

Nothing to laugh at but its true that DRDO is a white elephant being fed by Indians for 25years and only God knows why.

As for the Missile tech, its a known Fact that Pakistani Missile Infrustructure is advanced then Indians and doesnot need any proof. When the time comes all will know the potential of Pakistani Missiles.

Its very good if at all it makes you happy, At least DRDO program are open to media scrutiny. Can you claim same about pakistan's programe ?

 

[Proud to be Pakistani]

Its very good if at all it makes you happy, At least DRDO program are open to media scrutiny. Can you claim same about pakistan's programe ?

Its not open to any one and that is the way it should be!.