Pakistan in talks for 4 Ada Class Corvettes, T-129 Helicopters & modernization of agosta fleet

[HRK]

Many sources implied that Pakistan will get Milgem with VLS but I don’t know what has been changed during negotiations, maybe money factor. It is not that difficult to provide a ship which is similar to Istanbul class in terms of mission profile but I think Milgem corvette without VLS is what PN required for their threat perception. If There is a seperate deal with China for VL SAM to integrate to a new platform, We can feed our hopes to see a Milgem with VLS in PN but current direction of deal sheding light to classic variant of Milgem.

View attachment 484485

Yes bro if the cost is $250mil per ship, there is no way it'll be extended version (I-Class) with VLS... Perhaps in the future Pakistan can go for STM variant being offered to Brazil or I-Class, the interoperability with similar equipment would be advantageous to maintenance and training.

though it is bit disappointment but the reason to opt the non VLS configured design form Turkey is very simple to understand
- Current VLS system on offer with I-class frigate is MK-41 with ESSM both are American systems, so PN might have opted to go with low risk approach with this project rather to go over ambitious approach,

- No alternative is available by Turkish defence Industry, in fact Hissar series is still in development for land base air defence use if and when Hissar family is adopted in Naval role PN might find interest for future project or for mid life upgrade of ADA corvette.

- Seeking SAM and VLS from any third party might post integration and testing issues with Ada corvette and its combat management system which would eventually raise the cost and duration of the project

 

[war&peace]

The construction work is too slow. This is where China is truly the champ. China has the ability to build such vessels in months if not days.

Mate, don't worry we are getting type 54s from China as well so KS&EW will be pretty busy in the next fews ...yeah 8 subs also so imagine a lot of expansion work is needed.

 

[Armchair]

It would still make sense to leave space for an 8x VLS. Otherwise it would be very difficult to modify an already made ship.

 

[KediKesenFare3]

People should stop comparing two different types of military vessels to each other. It doesn't make sense at all. They have a different area of operation and that's why PN has decided to buy both.

Congratulations to my Pakistani friends. I <3 u guys.

 

[Neptune]

The construction work is too slow. This is where China is truly the champ. China has the ability to build such vessels in months if not days.

National and NATO standards on safety and the maintenance of naval platforms and the shipbuilding industry had always been a top priority for both the Navy and the MoND after the unfortunate and deadly experience our sailors faced, in 1953. This is where China, Russia and India all together fail where they often try to fasten the time period of ship building by compromising from safety standards.
It’s best to have it perfectly assembled and late than to have it early with a fame of being built on lives lost.

 

[khanasifm]

How much extra benefit it will provide compare to type 22p frigate unless it kept basic version . I think I-class with VLS would be value for money giving both anti submarine as well as ASW capabilities.

I think f-22 has 30 day at
Sea vs just 15 or so for corvette

Plus a more than 1000 tons heavier f-22 is frigate vs 2000 ton corvette

Ada may be more Morden especially with western technologies guessing

Not sure if there is difference in sea state operations

F22 is at sea state 5 or 6 not sure Ada can operate at what sea state

 

[-------]

It would still make sense to leave space for an 8x VLS. Otherwise it would be very difficult to modify an already made ship.

There isn't much space behind 76mm cannon, so it would be very difficult to fit it in... CAMM might fit in..

though it is bit disappointment but the reason to opt the non VLS configured design form Turkey is very simple to understand
- Current VLS system on offer with I-class frigate is MK-41 with ESSM both are American systems, so PN might have opted to go with low risk approach with this project rather to go over ambitious approach,

- No alternative is available by Turkish defence Industry, in fact Hissar series is still in development for land base air defence use if and when Hissar family is adopted in Naval role PN might find interest for future project or for mid life upgrade of ADA corvette.

- Seeking SAM and VLS from any third party might post integration and testing issues with Ada corvette and its combat management system which would eventually raise the cost and duration of the project

You should have seen our disappointment when the Milgem we wanted with VLS in 90s was no to be

 

[BRAVO_]

i have a question ... what is the meaning of technology transfer???????????? pakistan made an agreement with china for four F-22p frigates under technology transfer terms ... after commissioning all four, why did;t they used the same technology to made new frigates?? because according to my understanding technology transfer mean the transfer of technology from the originator to a secondary user which includes knowledge, process and evaluation ... but in case of pakistani naval projects does it mean, just the maintenance technology??

 

[Armchair]

There isn't much space behind 76mm cannon, so it would be very difficult to fit it in... CAMM might fit in..

You should have seen our disappointment when the Milgem we wanted with VLS in 90s was no to be
View attachment 484504

Thank you that was very informative and insightful. This is why they need to keep the deck space before building it. 8x VLS should be possible if planned from now, rather than later. It would be a lot harder later.

To clarify - I'm not saying go for a current VLS - I'm saying keep the space for a future VLS. Which is only a matter of time.

 

[Bilal Khan (Quwa)]

i have a question ... what is the meaning of technology transfer???????????? pakistan made an agreement with china for four F-22p frigates under technology transfer terms ... after commissioning all four, why did;t they used the same technology to made new frigates?? ... does it mean, meaning of this technology transfer is .. the maintenance technology??

The transfer-of-technology being referred to here are basically technical documents describing how to manufacture a ship once you have the necessary inputs, e.g. engines, steel, etc. It's an instruction book and some facilities that are compatible with the technology used by those ships. This also includes maintenance, overhauling, refitting, etc.

The interesting thing about the MILGEM is that unlike the Agosta 90B, F-22P or Hangor (II), the MILGEM was built on mostly commercially-off-the-shelf (COTS) inputs. Yes, you'd need Turkey's help to modify the design, but when it comes to selecting engines, sensors or even the steel OEM, these things might be open-ended as Pakistan gets better (hopefully) on design and integration.

 

[BRAVO_]

The transfer-of-technology being referred to here are basically technical documents describing how to manufacture a ship once you have the necessary inputs, e.g. engines, steel, etc. It's an instruction book and some facilities that are compatible with the technology used by those ships. This also includes maintenance, overhauling, refitting, etc.

The interesting thing about the MILGEM is that unlike the Agosta 90B, F-22P or Hangor (II), the MILGEM was built on mostly commercially-off-the-shelf (COTS) inputs. Yes, you'd need Turkey's help to modify the design, but when it comes to selecting engines, sensors or even the steel OEM, these things might be open-ended as Pakistan gets better (hopefully) on design and integration.

thanks for a comprehensive and prompt reply... appreciated

 

[dani191]

Indian Defence News
Thursday, July 05, 2018
By: Dev Discourse

Source Link: CLICK HERE

• 
  
• 
  

Turkey will sell four corvette ships to Pakistan's navy, Defence Minister Nurettin Canikli was quoted as saying by state-run Anadolu agency on Thursday.

Turkey said last year it signed a memorandum of understanding for the sale, and Canikli said the tender was now finalised, describing it as Turkey's biggest single miltary export deal and "a very important day" for the defence industry.
http://www.defencenews.in/article/Turkey-to-sell-four-corvette-ships-to-Pakistan--559274

 

[dani191]

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Turkish Firm Wins Tender To Build Four Corvettes For Pakistan Navy
Our Bureau

12:18 PM, July 5, 2018

1007

MILGEM Project Corvette: Illustration by STM


A Turkish firm has won a tender to build four corvettes for the Pakistan Navy making it the biggest ever defence export from Turkey.

“A tender opened by the Pakistan Navy to supply four corvettes has just been concluded and Turkey has won the tender,” Defense Minister Nurettin Canikli told reporters today during a visit to Montenegro Anadolu Agency (AA) reported.

He described the deal as “the largest defense export of Turkey in one agreement.”

Turkey signed a memorandum of understanding with Pakistan in May 2017 to produce four corvettes for its Navy under the MİLGEM project.

Deputy General Director of Turkish shipbuilder Savunma Teknolojileri Mühendislik ve Ticaret AŞ (STM), Murat Çift, had said in late 2017 that STM’s negotiations with prospective overseas MILGEM customers including Pakistan are in the advanced stages. Though the value of the contract was not disclosed, Pakistani media report that closing the MILGEM sale would raise the value of STM’s business activities in Pakistan to $1.5 billion.

Pakistan’s Minister of Defence Production (MoDP) Rana Tanveer Hussain had told AA in December 2017 that “the process was complete and construction of the ship will start in near future.”

The MİLGEM project covers the construction of a number of corvettes (Ada class) and frigates for the Turkish Navy. Until now, four warships have been commissioned and the fifth one is under construction, Anadolu said quoting Turkish officials.

The “Ada-class” naval corvettes, which are 99.5 meters in length, have been designed to carry out missions such as surface warfare, anti-submarine warfare, air defense, surveillance and reconnaissance.



The corvettes are armed with a 76-millimeter gun, missiles and torpedoes. They can accommodate a crew of 93 and a Seahawk

 

[BHarwana]

By Sarp Ozer

ANKARA

Turkey has won a tender to build 4 corvettes for Pakistan Navy, Turkish National Defense Minister Nurettin Canikli said on Thursday.

"This will be the largest single export in the history of Turkish defense industry," Canikli told Anadolu Agency and TV broadcaster TRT during his official visit to Montenegro.

Turkey to sell 4 corvettes to Pakistan
Turkey to sell 4 corvettes to Pakistan
05.07.2018
The agreement is a milestone for Turkish defense industry and has proven its adequacy, the minister said.

"Turkey has undertaken such a sophisticated project for the first time," Canikli said.

Recalling that negotiations had continued for six months, he said the parties decided to build two of the corvettes in Istanbul Shipyard and other two in Pakistan’s southern port city of Karachi.

Reporting by Sarp Ozer:Writing by Tuba Sahin


https://www.aa.com.tr/en/economy/turkey-to-sell-4-corvettes-to-pakistan/1195596

 

[BHarwana]

Turkey to sell four corvette ships to Pakistan: Minister
ANKARA

Turkey has won a tender to procure four corvettes for the Pakistan Navy, Defense Minister Nurettin Canikli has said.

“A tender opened by the Pakistan Navy to supply four corvettes has just been concluded and Turkey has won the tender,” Canikli told reporters during an official visit to Montenegro on July 5, as quoted by state-run Anadolu Agency.

He described the deal as “the largest defense export of Turkey in one agreement,” while not giving any financial details about the agreement.

Turkey signed a memorandum of understanding to produce four corvettes under the MİLGEM project in May 2017 for Pakistan.

Recalling that negotiations had continued for six months, Canikli also said the parties decided to build two of the corvettes in Istanbul Shipyard and other two in Pakistan’s southern port city of Karachi.

The MİLGEM project covers the construction of a number of corvettes (Ada class) and frigates for the Turkish Navy.

Until now, four warships have been commissioned and the fifth one is under construction, according to Turkish officials.

The indigenous “Ada-class” naval corvettes, which are 99.5 meters in length, have been designed to carry out various missions such as surface warfare, anti-submarine warfare, air defense, surveillance and reconnaissance, command-control and asymmetric defense warfare missions.

The first was the TCG Heybeliada (F-511), launched in 2008.

The ships, which are named after the Princes’ Islands off Istanbul, are designed for search and rescue, patrol and anti-submarine warfare duties and are armed with a 76-millimeter gun, missiles and torpedoes.

The corvettes can also accommodate a crew of 93 and a Seahawk helicopter on their flight deck.




http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/tu...-four-pakistan-navy-corvettes-minister-134200