Pakistan has to accept India as big brother

[lamayuru]

I think eventually, Pakistan would have to abandon the goal of achieving near-parity with India in military terms. Perhaps settle for protection from the PLA as a substitute.

Yup that will be like a replay of China-Taiwan-US. US has Taiwan under a defence umbrella, against a powerful China. But why and this is just a hypothesis, this may not happen is China is not so far out ahead of India. Pakistan is not too far back (militarily) from India. In any case Pakistan never sought parity with India, otherwise they would not be sleeping with China/CENTO/NATO etc. rather doing something on their own.

I guess they are just frightened of being swallowed up, esp post '71. They lost their leading light within a year of their formation. Having forgotten their raison de'etre, they have relied on Islam and India as the foundations to keep 170 million of them together, Shias and Sunnis who as it is dont get along too well. If the intolerance from religion was not bad enough they are psyching their peoples into believing India is out to get them.

They still believe they won 1965 and Kargil! I guess it is all fine so long as it is in the name of "successfully internationalizing Kashmir"!


In a much larger context though it has to do with the fact that Muslims ruled India for a thousand years. You just have to see Zaid Hamid rub his hands in glee at the thought of the green and white flag on Red Fort. They have books as a part of school curricula in which the authorities teach them Hindus aint no good for them. That may be the largest scale trolling you ever came across!

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Yup that will be like a replay of China-Taiwan-US. US has Taiwan under a defence umbrella, against a powerful China. But why and this is just a hypothesis, this may not happen is China is not so far out ahead of India. Pakistan is not too far back (militarily) from India. In any case Pakistan never sought parity with India, otherwise they would not be sleeping with China/CENTO/NATO etc. rather doing something on their own.

I guess they are just frightened of being swallowed up, esp post '71. They lost their leading light within a year of their formation. Having forgotten their raison de'etre, they have relied on Islam and India as the foundations to keep 170 million of them together, Shias and Sunnis who as it is dont get along too well. If the intolerance from religion was not bad enough they are psyching their peoples into believing India is out to get them.

They still believe they won 1965 and Kargil! I guess it is all fine so long as it is in the name of "successfully internationalizing Kashmir"!


In a much larger context though it has to do with the fact that Muslims ruled India for a thousand years. You just have to see Zaid Hamid rub his hands in glee at the thought of the green and white flag on Red Fort. They have books as a part of school curricula in which the authorities teach them Hindus aint no good for them. That may be the largest scale trolling you ever came across!

Thanks for the rant - can we get back on topic please?

 

[lamayuru]

@Developero:
I had to pick up on the Jewish center you highlighted. How do you think India-Israel relationship is going to play in the US? If Jews are powerful in the US and the Indian lobby is co-operating with the Jewish one, do you see a permanent tilt in US towards India?

---------- Post added at 10:16 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:15 PM ----------

Thanks for the rant - can we get back on topic please?

Sorry. My bad. But barring the superlatives, most of it is true, isn't it?

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Israel is losing international support very quickly right now, because of the illegal settlement-building and other high-handed tactics by the right-wing establishment.

They will have to reach a settlement with Hamas, because the international headlines are slowly tilting away from Israel's favour as the days go by.

Goodbye Mr. troll.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Sorry. My bad. But barring the superlatives, most of it is true, isn't it?

Back to topic please, and no.

 

[maverick2009]

Agonostic.

You said Pakistan will maintain a suitable Conventional deterrance enough to make it a fruitless excercise by India.

I disagree

I think this now becoming difficult and in the near future impossible.

India,s Conventional military Gap OVER pakistan is large today ,,and will expand rapidly in next 10 years.

Just one look at the Shear Nos and average size of pipleine military orders in the next decade india is at a completely different level to Pakistan.

The Gap will get bigger and THE TOP BRASS in pakistan are acknowledging this by their continued upgrade to missles and nuclear delivery programmes.

Their answer is you start to do untold damage to our infrastructure and we will at some point/threshold nuke you.

This fear is reflected in pakistan,s nuclear policy/statement of FIRST USE.

CONTRAST india who confident of successful conventional war have the opposite veiw of FIRST NO USE only massive 2ND strike in retaliation.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Agonostic.

You said Pakistan will maintain a suitable Conventional deterrance enough to make it a fruitless excercise by India.

I disagree

I think this now becoming difficult and in the near future impossible.

India,s Conventional military Gap OVER pakistan is large today ,,and will expand rapidly in next 10 years.

Just one look at the Shear Nos and average size of pipleine military orders in the next decade india is at a completely different level to Pakistan.

The Gap will get bigger and THE TOP BRASS in pakistan are acknowledging this by their continued upgrade to missles and nuclear delivery programmes.

Their answer is you start to do untold damage to our infrastructure and we will at some point/threshold nuke you.

This fear is reflected in pakistan,s nuclear policy/statement of FIRST USE.

CONTRAST india who confident of successful conventional war have the opposite veiw of FIRST NO USE only massive 2ND strike in retaliation.

Off topic - but the idea of a minimum conventional deterrent inherently implies that Pakistan will be at a disadvantage. And while you may have massive 'projected' acquisitions, at the end of the day it is about what you actually possess, not what is projected.

At the moment, India simply does not possess the conventional capability to steamroll Pakistan outside of a very long and bloody war that will set India back decades as well.

Will this change in the future? You argue yes, but I'll reserve my opinion given that nothing is certain and Pakistan will not remain static either.

Back to topic please - what is it with you guys anyway? Can't ge a straight answer on the topic, and dragging in everything else under the sun.

 

[lamayuru]

Can't ge a straight answer on the topic, and dragging in everything else under the sun.

What was your question again?

 

[Imran Khan]

What was your question again?

now pleaes stop your drama of star plus only big brother we hate you we hate you we hate you

 

[Imran Khan]

Yup that will be like a replay of China-Taiwan-US. US has Taiwan under a defence umbrella, against a powerful China. But why and this is just a hypothesis, this may not happen is China is not so far out ahead of India. Pakistan is not too far back (militarily) from India. In any case Pakistan never sought parity with India, otherwise they would not be sleeping with China/CENTO/NATO etc. rather doing something on their own.

I guess they are just frightened of being swallowed up, esp post '71. They lost their leading light within a year of their formation. Having forgotten their raison de'etre, they have relied on Islam and India as the foundations to keep 170 million of them together, Shias and Sunnis who as it is dont get along too well. If the intolerance from religion was not bad enough they are psyching their peoples into believing India is out to get them.

They still believe they won 1965 and Kargil! I guess it is all fine so long as it is in the name of "successfully internationalizing Kashmir"!


In a much larger context though it has to do with the fact that Muslims ruled India for a thousand years. You just have to see Zaid Hamid rub his hands in glee at the thought of the green and white flag on Red Fort. They have books as a part of school curricula in which the authorities teach them Hindus aint no good for them. That may be the largest scale trolling you ever came across!

same time when indians sleeping with USSR AND ISRAEL???????????????

we do something our own wake up nuclear missiles thunders alkhalids zarars hundreds of projects in civil and militry .are you mean to say pakistan is same like it was in 47 then shamfull

 

[DesiGuy]

What was your question again?

who are these 2 girls in your avatar?

just curious to know!


:

 

[lamayuru]

who are these 2 girls in your avatar?

just curious to know!


:

Not some people I know.. but they are peaceniks for sure.. a sentiment I share with them

 

[lamayuru]

See this is what it has come to with an obstinate Govt in Pakistan:

India will urge US to pressurise Pakistan

DAWN.COM | World | India will urge US to pressurise Pakistan

NEW DELHI: Indian Home Minister P Chidambaram begins an important four-day visit to the United States this week when he will discuss international terrorism and Pakistan’s inaction against perpetrators of the Mumbai attack with the American establishment.

Chidambaram will urge the American leadership to put pressure on Pakistan to take firm action towards dismantling the terror infrastructure in the country as well as prosecution of Mumbai attack accused, who are in Pakistan.

The visit is aimed at carrying forward dialogue with the US with regards to assessment of the security situation in South Asia, understanding the counter-terrorism institutions and structures in America as well as meeting with top officials involved in security and intelligence matters.

Besides getting an in-depth understanding of the functioning of the National Counter-Terrorism Centre, the Home Minister will also be interacting with heads of Homeland Security and intelligence agencies including the FBI and look at the functioning of the New York Police Department.

Chidambaram will also be discussing issues related to combating financing of terrorism and the steps which will be required in this regard as well as prevention of money laundering.

The Indian home minister would also get first-hand knowledge of the capabilities of the US security agencies in dealing with a terror strike.

Chidambaram will be accompanied by an official each from the Intelligence Bureau and RAW and a joint secretary from the Home Ministry.

 

[lamayuru]

Meanwhile..

DAWN.COM | Pakistan | Gilani urges India to resume dialogue

Gilani urges India to resume dialogue:

<snip>
KARACHI: Prime Minister Yousuf Raza Gilani on Saturday again called upon India to agree to an early resumption of the composite dialogue.

Talking to journalists after launching a housing scheme at the Governor&#8217;s House, he said the suspension of India-Pakistan composite dialogue would be exploited by others and help terrorists, a common enemy of both countries.

Mr Gilani declared that Pakistan would not allow its soil to be used for terrorism and would not tolerate violation of its sovereignty. Pakistan, he added, wanted peaceful relations with all countries, particularly its neighbours.

</snip>

 

[gubbi]

More cliches, this time about 'wearing pants'.

All that rambling aside, what does this India-Pakistan lopsoided relationship specifically look like to you?

You just dont accept good ol' plain facts now, do you?
This is how I see it. Pakistan is in a weaker position and conversely India is definitely stronger. Of course India will bully the weaker, for its nature of any beast to do so. You did that in Afghanistan and in your ertswhile East Pakistan.
But your ego and arrogance which comes with ego does not let you accept that India is far ahead of your league. You always try to bring in China vis-a-vis Indo-Pak relations hoping, in vain, that China will come to your aid should a crisis arise. Aint happening. Too much at stake for both India and China. (here's a pointer, Indians hate, in a healthy way, the Chinese and vice-versa because we see them as very strong competition).
So Pakistan (non-state actors -whatever that stupid term means) is pretty much on her own and now when many a nefarious activities are exposed and accepted by the whole world over as the source of Taliban menace (not to mention the source of terrorist attacks in India), finds itself with its back to the wall.
When once you were the darling of cocktail parties in the US congress, this recent fall from grace has hurt the collective pride of Pakistanis and cannot come to terms with failed policies of the alternative military and civilian govts. You still think in terms of what could have been, instead of whats presently happening. And that my friend, holds you back from giving up giving 'moral' support to terrorist activities in India or Afghanistan, and which in turn stymes the growth potential in the sub-continent.