Pakistan Has Tested Missiles.

[Kompromat]

The thread is losing its track i guess it should be closed !

 

[gambit]

Anza is infrared guided missile which senses heat (heat seeker missile). Infrared guided missiles can only work for short ranges same as in the case of Air-to-Air missiles like AIM-9 which is for short range only, for longer range AIM-120 AMRAAM; which is radar guided missile.
There is no SAM system in the world which is long range and work on the principle of infrared guidance, reason is because the limitation of the infrared guidance to detect the heat at longer ranges (as for longer ranges the system is simply ineffective).

The main problem with IR detection is not detection but discrimination...

early warning satellites

...satellite sensors to view a missile above the horizon of the Earth against the cold background of space, which is easier than viewing it against the warm Earth background.

Even with rocket exhaust, it is best to contrast this heat source against space to eliminate the need to discriminate. Against an endoatmospheric target, there are so many other IR sources that it is best to reduce the range between the sensor and the target to reduce the discrimination burden on the sensor/guidance section. So keep in mind that after detection, discrimination is necessary only if there are competing IR sources within the sensor's PoV and with extreme contrast, like the ICBM example above, the need to discriminate diminishes to near zero.

The best lesson for the general readership regarding the main difference between active (radar) and passive (infrared) sensors is one involving a bird, a bat and a glass window.

A bird has a greater chance of colliding with the glass window than a bat. The bird must rely on target characteristics, which may or may not be available to him depending on factors like his flight angle to the glass surface, if there are any light sources that may reflect off the glass surface and how opaque is the glass surface. In other words, the bird has no control over the sensor medium. This is passive sensor.

A bat, on the other hand, transmit a medium -- sound waves -- that actually collided with the glass surface and instead of passing thru the glass the way light waves does, the sound waves deflects off the glass surface, providing the bat with vital target information, namely that there is a solid object nearby. In other words, the bat has control of the sensor medium. This is active sensor.

As a side note, this is just as much sonar as how some underwater animals uses sound as active sensor. Airborne sonar and underwater sonar differs in environment but still is sonar. Our current data processing technology from radar is still orders of magnitudes inferior to how bats and porpoises processes their sonar data. Try tens of millions of years of evolution in data processing experience, for example...

SpringerLink - Journal Article

Wing flutter detection suggests that H. ruber exploit the Doppler-shifted information in echoes of their echolocation calls. These bats fed primarily upon moths, usually those of between 10 and 25 mm wingchord, although moths of less than 5 mm and greater than 40 mm wingchord were also attacked and captured. They showed no evidence of selecting moths on the basis of species or other taxonomic distinction, and occasionaly captured other insects.

Bats have been processing Doppler information long before we discovered the effect and exploit it in radar. So good are they at it that they can distinguish different insect size based upon insect wing dimensions and wing flutter frequencies.

In sum, there are situations where a missile is better off with one type of sensor over the other and there are situations where it is best to have a hybrid sensor system to increase the odds of success. In flight, weight is the penalty and miniaturization via technology is the solution. May the best tech win, and usually does in the fight.

 

[gambit]

Why need of testing. I think PA gets tested missiles.

They need to do just one test for training (user test) before buying it.

PS: single pakistani test is failed so far.

The highlighted is significant, not just for Pakistan but for all customers, no matter the product.

http://ftp.rta.nato.int/public//PubFullText/RTO/MP/RTO-MP-016///$MP-016-12.PDF

Two of the missile firings were conducted with missiles that had angular rate gyros installed in the inert warhead section to measure dynamic response of the launcher and launch transients imparted to the missiles. During launch, pitch, roll, and yaw rate data were recorded as the missile traveled along and off the rail. Data were recorded until the approximately twenty foot long breakaway aircraft/missile umbilical was pulled away from the aircraft. Analysis of these data indicated that the AGM-114 missile experienced no adverse effects when ground launched from the LHEP of the SH-60.

The example above revealed many things about the testing regime. Ignore the 'umbilical cord' for now. Somewhere along the way of development, someone came up with a 'what if' situation where aircraft movements could affect missile launch. We have launcher and missile. Each is an aircraft in its own right. The missile may not be able to compensate for the launcher's position and induced movements at the time of launch, thereby throwing the missile off target. This is a valid and serious issue when there are independent avionics systems supposedly working together. Someone came up with the methodology of testing if the missile does accept said inducements and whether or not said inducements are adequately compensated by the missile's own avionics.

The larger question is how is it that anyone can come up with such a question. The answer is experience and it does not come easy.

If you are selling a luxury passenger airliner, who would you select as your test pilot, a lifelong Delta pilot, or a lifelong FedEx pilot? Keep in mind that human beings are very much 'cargo' the same way that washing machines are also 'cargo'. But human beings demands comfort while machines do not. It would be the lifelong Delta pilot who would be able to give you, the manufacturer, the appropriate feedback as to how your design would perform for humans, not inanimate objects. It would be the lifelong Delta pilot who would come up with 'what if' questions applicable to transporting humans, not the lifelong FedEx pilot.

It would be foolish for Pakistan, or any customer, not to perform independent testing prior to purchase, but the question is whether or not the Pakistani military establishment is capable of coming up with these 'what if' situations that are applicable to the potential battlefields that Pakistan may engage in. May be the environment affects missile sensors in ways that the manufacturer did not anticipate. May be Pakistani aircrafts have the wrong type of pylons to carry the missiles. In this type of market, refunds can be hard to come by.

 

[Sinnerman108]

I am sorry Jana to burst your bubble, but this is a fake video of someone cutting and pasting of videos. This is the true video
YouTube - Indian Missile Test Fails
Get out of your little nutshell and face the facts that Pakistan missile tests were successful. Quit living in denial

What the HELL !

This woman is going about bragging the good Indian missile test,

doesn't she stop to wonder why there is PTV insignia on the video if this was an indian missile test ?

F.U.S !

 

[pakistanguide]

this Tested Missiles. gifts for india.......

 

[blackcobran]

asssalmoalaikum
yeah i also saw clouds(shadows) which shows the sign of missile testing at the time of DAWN PRAYER(NAMAZ-E-FAJR) and they were(shadows) going towards arabian sea im from KARACHI same as the people are saying here I also guess the were tested b/w last decade of feb to first decade of march

 

[blackcobran]

Good job windjammer very nice

 

[Dalai Lama]

I don't know why Pakistanis deny that they're missile tests ever fail. Testing and failure is just an essential phase in engineering. Otherwise your products's faults etc. would never be ironed out and fixed.

 

[Silk]

I don't know why Pakistanis deny that they're missile tests ever fail. Testing and failure is just an essential phase in engineering. Otherwise your products's faults etc. would never be ironed out and fixed.

Well, I think you must understand some engineering. First all components are tested in a black box situation. They are then tested in a real situation. That is not the same as in India where they throw a lot of air of making Indian parts. And int he end they have only pushed the button to see it explode. About the engineering etc. Did you ever compare the JF17 assembly with LCA assembly? Even the cloths are showing a big difference. Then just look at the dirty chaotic Baharti lay out with the superb shining Pakistani. Same goes for all maintenance area's. You should look for the largest Indian maintenance centre. I bet you will have an heart attack. The problem with you internet guys is that you do not know facts and start acting like you know the insights.

 

[The Deterrent]

asssalmoalaikum
yeah i also saw clouds(shadows) which shows the sign of missile testing at the time of DAWN PRAYER(NAMAZ-E-FAJR) and they were(shadows) going towards arabian sea im from KARACHI same as the people are saying here I also guess the were tested b/w last decade of feb to first decade of march

I'm not saying that u r wrong...maybe you saw something else...because our missiles are tested around about between 9 am to 11 am...and there was only the Babur test...reports of multiple tests are false...

 

[Silk]

Let us look at the positive way. There is good development on both sides.