Pakistan faces economic challenges: A conversation with Princeton economist Professor Atif Mian and Shuja Nawaz

[Norwegian]

The US is the same country that has made absolutely no secret of hurting Pakistan economically, militarily etc.

Except the fact Pakistan had highest economic growths during dictatorships funded by US taxpayers money

All of it might be true, but I doubt the sincerity and intentions.

Who cares what you think?

 

[Kharral]

Oh, so the best way to check loyalty to Pakistan now is if West admires a Pakistani or not?

Haqqani was associated with corrupt Zardari govt. Is Atif Mian connected with some corrupt party in Pakistan? You are comparing apple and oranges.

You can disagree much as you like but it’s a pretty good indication of facts.

 

[Norwegian]

Frankly, we don't need Atif Mian's advice on something we have already figured out ages ago. This was known long before the PTI government won the elections in Pakistan.

If it was well-known, how come 3 govts before PTI went through the very same import led growth "boom-and-bust" cycle?

 

[Pak Nationalist]

The people you mention have no loyalty towards Pakistan. Just because a person is related to the COAS doesn't mean we should automatically worship that person. Besides, most of these people are settled in the US and are participating in a US think tank forum. First and foremost, I want forum members to be cognizant of the fact that US sponsored topics related to Pakistan need to be viewed with a critical lens. The Americans are experts at manufacturing BS. It is also no secret that US think tanks are involved in nefarious propaganda against Pakistan. Are you going to deny this?

Now let's get to the crux of the matter. Why are US think tanks suddenly so interested in Pakistani economy? There are elections on the way. The Americans want Imran Khan gone. It is no secret that the Americans don't approve of Imran Khan. Imran Khan speaks for Pakistan first. Every lie the Americans can make up they will manufacture against PTI and Imran Khan.

Bhai, he is talking about systemic problems that had marred Pakistan since the 1980s when our economic growth stagnated compared to India, and a process of decline set in from the '90s. He is talking about structural problems that brought us where we are. Imran Khan factors into all this only to the extent that, according to him, (we can agree or disagree with it; I personally think he has done more than others) he did not pursue the much-needed reforms to fix the underlying structural problems marring the economy, which have left us in perpetual boom and bust cycles. Listen to the interview. You would find yourself agreeing with many things he says. IK himself relied on his counsel until he was sworn to power and faced the realities of ruling a society like Pakistan, which would rather die hungry than face the prospect of being lifted by a Pakistani whose faith is heretical. With his withdrawal, we should remember that some of the other top Pakistani minds in the field of economics abroad also tendered their resignation from the EAC. Meritocracy is blind to all discriminations. If you want to fix a complex problem, you need to apply your best tools towards that end. As simple as that.

 

[Norwegian]

You can disagree much as you like but it’s a pretty good indication of facts.

West admires Dr Abdus Salam because he combined 2 of the 4 fundamental forces of nature and was thus eligible for Nobel prize in physics. But for Pakistanis he was a Qadiani traitor. Same goes for other Pakistanis admired by the West such as Malala. Pakistanis hate every Pakistani admired by the West.

 

[Dil_Pakistan]

Haven't watched the video yet, but honestly the basic fundamental problems have already been identified and PM himself is cognizant about it. Point A that we need to increase our exports and bring more dollars in and create wealth. Point B that FBR needs to be reformed. At initial period of his government PM IK even tried to push for this overhaul but faced major pushback by the mafia and the reforms stalled.
Unfortunately PM IK hands are tied because of a weak coalition government and all thanks to our establishment twice, just bcz of their own thirst to keep power.In 2013 they did 36 puncture and handed 2/3rds majority to Nawaz govt. which basically destroyed the economy. If PTI that time had more seats and had been leader of opposition, they could have put a check.
But establishment didn't learned and in 2018 again ate up 15-25 seats of PTI, handing a weak and hand tied govt. to PM IK.
Hence no fundamental reforms can be done and now with this alleged and speculated latest episode btw GHQ and PM office over an appointment we can expect offsprings of the crooks aka Nawaz and Zardari to return to power. So Pakistan is basically never going to progress if this continues.

 

[Norwegian]

In Pakistan we let clowns like Kaiser Bengali give lectures on economy

At least he is not Qadiani so we cannot doubt his loyalty to Pakistan. Mind you, Zardari and Sharif family is also not Qadiani and thus very loyal to Pakistan.

 

[Pak Nationalist]

I hear you; Trust is important, especially if people are going to be asked to make tough reforms. If we have an issue with this specific person, let’s take what he has to say and hire experts we trust to review it. Considering how well they have developed and the economic integration we hope to achieve with them, let’s hire Chinese experts to go over what is proposed.

‘CPEC on track, but Pakistan needs to employ Chinese experts’

ISLAMABAD: Outgoing Chinese Ambassador to Pakistan, Amb Yao Jing, has said that the China Pakistan Economic Corridor (CPEC) would be better served if Pakistan appointed officials who are experts on th

profit.pakistantoday.com.pk

We can hire foreigners to run policy for us, but we view our own (due to their religious identity) with suspicion? How are we any better than Afghanistan if we outsource running our country to other nations because we do not have skilled human resources? No sir, we do have it, we are just too thick-headed to employ our own bright minds. I am with you when you say his prescriptions could be reviewed by Pakistani experts. Even amateurs like us talk about what he is talking about on economic threads each day on PDF. I have just come across @Norwegian's excellent snapshot comparing our Exports as a percentage of GDP to that of Indians and Bangladeshis. What he is saying is not particularly rocket science. Many who read the business section of papers know the problems and how these could be fixed (in general terms). However, fixing structural problems requires getting hands dirty in the political economy of Pakistan. At the end of the day, our problem is the political economy. Our social construct is one based on client-patron relationships (Anatol Lieven's Pakistan: A Hard Country, is a must-read)., there are powerful interest groups/lobbies, whatever you want to call them, who protect their turf (elites have entrenched themselves in political, security, judicial, media spheres of state and captured it). These parties are impediments in the way of upending the status quo. The path to fixing structural problems and reforms lies in dismantling their interests.

 

[Zibago]

At least he is not Qadiani so we cannot doubt his loyalty to Pakistan. Mind you, Zardari and Sharif family is also not Qadiani and thus very loyal to Pakistan.

His commie points are insane
They would tank our economy worse than Lebanon if they were implemented

 

[Azadkashmir]

Everyone knows it. These think tanks are affiliated with a government and even have linkages with intelligence agencies. They serve an agenda. Why the heck should Pakistanis living in Pakistan listen to foreign funded think tanks who have interests at stake? It doesn't make any sense whatsoever.

The US is the same country that has made absolutely no secret of hurting Pakistan economically, militarily etc. Now according to some we should lean back and pretend that a US funded think tank is going to tell all Pakistanis the truth regarding the state of its economy.

i tell you wat makes me angry is the fact eastern Europe and south america have alternative medicine that actually cures diseases but pakistan has expensive western health care system which is fraud. western insititutions have suceeded in miseducating Pakistanis by giving free tutorship. read about ozone therapy. in this case they had to import machine from germany.

 

[Norwegian]

IK himself relied on his counsel until he was sworn to power and faced the realities of ruling a society like Pakistan, which would rather die hungry than face the prospect of being lifted by a Pakistani whose faith is heretical.

That's not true at all. People said we would eat grass but never accept a Qadiani as macro economist in govts economy team. 3 years later same people are cursing the govt for not solving their economic and financial hardships. Why don't they eat grass now as they bragged to do 3 years ago?

 

[Pak Nationalist]

All of it might be true, but I doubt the sincerity and intentions.

Like I said, for me it is end of discussion when an American think tank is behind any Pakistan related discussion. We need to ask ourselves the question whether US organised Pakistan discussions are worth viewing. They are politically motivated and the US is always involved in some sort of nefarious propaganda. There is always a catch with the Americans.

I fully endorse discussions related to any topic as long as the source is authentic. Indians also hold various Pakistan related discussions. Do we take Indian discussions seriously? We should treat US sponsored Pakistan discussions in a similar fashion in my opinion.


We already know that there are a bunch of problems in Pakistan. No one is denying that. My only concern is the authenticity of the source.

American sponsored Pakistan discussions should be treated in a similar fashion as we treat Indian diatribe. I don't care what the panel looks like. Even if an angel participated in A US sponsored think tank event I would view it with grave suspicion.

Let's not pretend that America is a friend of Pakistan. It is not. The United States speaks Indian tounge.

That's not true at all. People said we would eat grass but never accept a Qadiani as macro economist in govts economy team. 3 years later same people are cursing the govt for not solving their economic and financial hardships. Why don't they eat grass now as they bragged to do 3 years ago?

Yeah, I pointed at that self defeating trait of our polity.

 

[Norwegian]

With his withdrawal, we should remember that some of the other top Pakistani minds in the field of economics abroad also tendered their resignation from the EAC.

Exactly. The other two non Qadiani experts from Harvard and London school of economics resigned as well when they saw how easily govt failed to defend position of Dr Atif Mian as a member of govts economic advisory council.

More embarrassment for govt as second economist resigns from EAC over Atif Mian's exclusion

Dr Imran Rasul says he "profoundly disagree[s]" with the circumstances in which Atif Mian was asked to resign.

www.dawn.com

 

[Kharral]

West admires Dr Abdus Salam because he combined 2 of the 4 fundamental forces of nature and was thus eligible for Nobel prize in physics. But for Pakistanis he was a Qadiani traitor. Same goes for other Pakistanis admired by the West such as Malala. Pakistanis hate every Pakistani admired by the West.View attachment 783712

Which Pakistanis ? How was he considered a traitor by Pakistanis ? Please elaborate.

 

[Norwegian]

Which Pakistanis ? How was he considered a traitor by Pakistanis ? Please elaborate.

Read this article

Dr Abdus Salam and all the wrong choices Pakistan made | The Express Tribune

What we did to him is shameful. On his return to Pakistan with the Nobel Prize no one even received him at the airport

tribune.com.pk

Like Dr Atif Mian is world class macro economist, Dr Abdus Salam was world class physicist. Both are shunned by Pakistanis because they are Qadianis admired by the West