Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

[jupiter2007]

NO, they havent, they blocked the Jordanian f16s as per our own minister

That was before, almost 3 years ago, things are different now.

 

[mingle]

That was before, almost 3 years ago, things are different now.

We need some diplomatic approach all we need NOC that's all these F16s are dirt cheap should get as many as we can.

 

[araz]

We need some diplomatic approach all we need NOC that's all these F16s are dirt cheap should get as many as we can.

They may all need upgrading and the last package we got cost us 20 million a pop. Labour was not included so add that as well. Now even with that it is a nice bargain but whereas the US may allow us to buy these planes they wont issue the upgrade pack or create hurdles by raising prices.
The upgrade pack alone will be roughly 600 million which we are going to struggle to pay.
1200 hours on a platform is not enough for us to make that investment. So do we have a solution?
We may be able to run them as is but what capabilities do they have radar and avionics wise needs to be thought through. I think PAF might sit this one out. For what it is worth there may be no other buyer for it either.
These remain my thoughts so feel free to disagree. PAF will go for MLUed platforms with 2k+life in them and it will chose its planes very carefully.
If you look at the article they want to sell 28 together to one country. Why do members think they have lumped them together? You may find that a lot of them may be beyond upgrading and therefore salvage for spares.
A

 

[araz]

You may all remember thst even with the Jordanoan 16s we avaided those with less than 2K life on the frame.
A

 

[Viper27]

US has no issues selling anything to Pakistan as long as we pay from our pocket. The problem with getting used F-16s from outside the US is that we will need Congressional approval. That however, should not be too difficult if we can work out a way to get them upgraded from Lockheed which will mean more business for US companies. I have seen too many negative comments here but we tend to forget that only recently United Technologies was awarded a contract for supporting PAF F-16s. That should address some of our concerns.

Whether PAF has the means to pay for any such purchase is a different story.

 

[Haris Ali2140]

US has no issues selling anything to Pakistan as long as we pay from our pocket. The problem with getting used F-16s from outside the US is that we will need Congressional approval. That however, should not be too difficult if we can work out a way to get them upgraded from Lockheed which will mean more business for US companies. I have seen too many negative comments here but we tend to forget that only recently United Technologies was awarded a contract for supporting PAF F-16s. That should address some of our concerns.

Whether PAF has the means to pay for any such purchase is a different story.

If there were any ethics in arms sale the industry wiuld have collapsed. Its all about money.

 

[araz]

US has no issues selling anything to Pakistan as long as we pay from our pocket. The problem with getting used F-16s from outside the US is that we will need Congressional approval. That however, should not be too difficult if we can work out a way to get them upgraded from Lockheed which will mean more business for US companies. I have seen too many negative comments here but we tend to forget that only recently United Technologies was awarded a contract for supporting PAF F-16s. That should address some of our concerns.

Whether PAF has the means to pay for any such purchase is a different story.

I think by sitting on approved CSF and other unpaid bills and then additionally asking for money is where the topic of contention is. If accounts can be cleared it would help in crystallizing where we stand. On 2 occasions US has offered us armaments based on part payment from CSF and then backed down. This in its own rights is an indication of their ill intention. PAF has been stung before so wont get anything by upfront payment. Plus our dire finances do not help and US currently is in no mood to help us out.
A

 

[Chak Bamu]

The only affordable way to get the Norwegian F-16 jets is to get them with spares & not waste money on upgrading them. Use them for flying hours and put them in storage when the useful life goes below 200 or so hours. I am guessing that spares would be more than enough for these 28 units and may contribute towards the rest of the fleet.

 

[araz]

The only affordable way to get the Norwegian F-16 jets is to get them with spares & not waste money on upgrading them. Use them for flying hours and put them in storage when the useful life goes below 200 or so hours. I am guessing that spares would be more than enough for these 28 units and may contribute towards the rest of the fleet.

Do we know whether they are MLUed or not? It might sway PAFs decision on whether to buy them or not. However I think the US in its current mood will not allow us and this is where the problem lies. If the approval was forthcoming we could have gotten th ex Jordanian 16s which are in a much better condition.
A

 

[Windjammer]

 

[ziaulislam]

Do we know whether they are MLUed or not? It might sway PAFs decision on whether to buy them or not. However I think the US in its current mood will not allow us and this is where the problem lies. If the approval was forthcoming we could have gotten th ex Jordanian 16s which are in a much better condition.
A

All are MLU..issue is simple..USA will not allow arms sale..and pakistan doesnt has any leverage ..pakistan wants stability in afghanistan more than USA will to leave afghanistan..

If things go bad USA can pack up and leave the mess again to pakistan

Pakistan want a negotiated settlement and some sort of govt in afghanistan With international aid otherwise everyone will be back in pakistan...we are talking about millions of refugees, if 4-5b$ of aid stops flowing in afghanistan ...worse if full blown civil war breaks out...

This will not effect USA...USA will simply swallow a one time bitter pill of failure but consequences for pakistan & neighbors are real ...

So we have no bargaining chip ...USA knows that and we know that...

Our role will be after USA leaves with negotiated settlement and wants to keep it that way...

Reality is that's not the mood in USA

USA thinks an unstable afghanistan isnt an issue

 

[denel]

Do we know whether they are MLUed or not? It might sway PAFs decision on whether to buy them or not. However I think the US in its current mood will not allow us and this is where the problem lies. If the approval was forthcoming we could have gotten th ex Jordanian 16s which are in a much better condition.
A

agreed, the mood in US is inwards does not matter which ally it is; even Isreali intel and leadership is concerned about TiT's stability and already considers it not dependable.

 

[Viper27]

Do we know whether they are MLUed or not? It might sway PAFs decision on whether to buy them or not. However I think the US in its current mood will not allow us and this is where the problem lies. If the approval was forthcoming we could have gotten th ex Jordanian 16s which are in a much better condition.
A

The current mood in the US is simple: fund your items yourself. Had the US been unwilling, we wouldn't have logistics and engine support for our F-16s either. The latter was approved recently. The problem is whether PAF can arrange the requisite funds. The same issue has kept the AH-1Zs held up. We can get those tomorrow if we make the full payment. Any US subsidies depend on the progress we make in Afghanistan.

 

[cloud4000]

US has no issues selling anything to Pakistan as long as we pay from our pocket. The problem with getting used F-16s from outside the US is that we will need Congressional approval. That however, should not be too difficult if we can work out a way to get them upgraded from Lockheed which will mean more business for US companies. I have seen too many negative comments here but we tend to forget that only recently United Technologies was awarded a contract for supporting PAF F-16s. That should address some of our concerns.

Whether PAF has the means to pay for any such purchase is a different story.

Help settle Afghanistan and the doors will open. The money will be released and approval cleared for military sales.

 

[Nasr]

Trump may want to pull out U.S troops from Afghanistan, just like he wanted to pull out U.S troops from Syria and Iraq. He may be "Commander in Chief" but it makes little difference what he wants. The "Deep State" which is America, is owned and controlled by Zionist-Swines and they want U.S military in Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq, Arabia and elsewhere in the world to project dominance in the world until such time when they have no use of American supremacy, just like they did with it's predecessor, the British Empire which was largest empire (territorially) ever in the history of humanity.

It is evident, that the Zionist-Swines who own and control American Empire, as they did the British Empire, have zero intention of pulling any of the American military presence, anywhere in the world. The only time in the history of America, they ever retreated or pulled out, was in Vietnam and that was after paying a huge price in loss of life, money and military hardware. Since then, America has focused it's energy on destroying countries through clandetine means, before they could ever muster enough strength (unity) or independence (economic) to challenge the Zionist-Swines.

For Pakistan, the best strategy in Afghanistan is by making every legal effort in restoring peace in that country by becoming economically independent and strong. The best available route to achieve this by simultaneously exterminating corruption, stop borrowing money from IMF/WB and establishing strong economic and trade agreements with Russia & China. And finally, start building a large reserve of Gold and liquidate all US Dollars, British Pounds and EU Euros which stand as Pakistan's currency reserves.