Pakistan - Continuous Improvement vs. Breakthrough Innovation Strategy

[R2D2]

1. Is Iran not under sanctions for being suspected of trying to build a nuclear bomb. If it forms a union with Pakistan would not all those sanctions affect pakistan as well. The US, KSA are against Iran getting nucleae bombs, would that not as well take counter measures against such a union. It is not as simple as changing your name and the world powers forget who you were and the problems they had before. It doesnt reset like that.

2. The government in Afghanistan is not currently recognised worldwide as a legitimate government, if it merges with pakistan would not that distrust extend to Pakistan as well as being seen as an attempt to legitimise a rogue governent

3. What leverage does Pakistan currently have to navigate these challenges

4. What benefit does Pakistan get from facing these additional challenges

Pakistan's nuclear controls have been praised by IAEA. When we combine, Iran's nuclear program would fall under Pakistan's nuclear control. So there won't be a problem. Pakistan has got diplomatic recognition, so we will use Pakistan's diplomatic status when Afghanistan joins us. We have China to solve our diplomatic and other problems.

 

[SoulSpokesman]

@R2D2

The military will agree if it realizes that this is the best option for Pakistan. Historically, this region and Afghanistan have been under one rule for long periods of time.

Not a bad idea- the idea is validated by history. The Caliph will have to come from Afghanistan though- historically the leadership from Ghazni and Ghauri to Abdali has been from this part only. The Afghanis can provide the military might, the people from plains (aka Pakistani Punjoos and Sindhis) can provide the labour and taxes as always.

Regards

 

[R2D2]

@R2D2

The military will agree if it realizes that this is the best option for Pakistan. Historically, this region and Afghanistan have been under one rule for long periods of time.

Not a bad idea- the idea is validated by history. The Caliph will have to come from Afghanistan though- historically the leadership from Ghazni and Ghauri to Abdali has been from this part only. The Afghanis can provide the military might, the people from plains (aka Pakistani Punjoos and Sindhis) can provide the labour and taxes as always.

Regards

He who declares the Caliphate will be the Caliph.

 

[Krptonite]

Pakistan's nuclear controls have been praised by IAEA. When we combine, Iran's nuclear program would fall under Pakistan's nuclear control. So there won't be a problem. Pakistan has got diplomatic recognition, so we will use Pakistan's diplomatic status when Afghanistan joins us. We have China to solve our diplomatic and other problems.

Lets be frank, those are really childish reasons.

You're entire assertion is based on China woukd take care of us, that is neither true nor have you given a compelling reason for why that is the case.

Its like fanfiction at this point, this is a defence forum, if you're going to be making threads here they should stand up to logicall questions. You've answered none so far.

 

[R2D2]

Lets be frank, those are really childish reasons.

You're entire assertion is based on China woukd take care of us, that is neither true nor have you given a compelling reason for why that is the case.

Its like fanfiction at this point, this is a defence forum, if you're going to be making threads here they should stand up to logicall questions. You've answered none so far.

Not interested in your arguments to highlight problems to be faced by the new Caliphate. We will solve all the real problems as they arise and not the imaginary ones in yours and that American's head.

 

[Sliver]

so you want to have
1) trade route to Russia through china
2) combine with Afghanistan and Iran

and then have good relations with USA?


the whole point of USA not happy with Pakistan is because Pakistan is
1) too close to China
2) supported Afghanistan at the end of the war

also - you said "Pakistan land mass will increase 3 fold"

so many afghan refugees in Pakistan are creating problems and many want them gone. you are effectively saying what the Taliban wants - no more Durand line.

just because you "Declared" to be the khilafa, will Afghanistan and Iran join Pakistan? what's in it for them? they can see what Pakistan has become - millions of people fighting for basic necessities, killing themselves over electricity bills and the elites living in DHAs.

which country will want to join this?

 

[R2D2]

so you want to have
1) trade route to Russia through china
2) combine with Afghanistan and Iran

and then have good relations with USA?


the whole point of USA not happy with Pakistan is because Pakistan is
1) too close to China
2) supported Afghanistan at the end of the war

also - you said "Pakistan land mass will increase 3 fold"

so many afghan refugees in Pakistan are creating problems and many want them gone. you are effectively saying what the Taliban wants - no more Durand line.

just because you "Declared" to be the khilafa, will Afghanistan and Iran join Pakistan? what's in it for them? they can see what Pakistan has become - millions of people fighting for basic necessities, killing themselves over electricity bills and the elites living in DHAs.

which country will want to join this?

We want to use the trade route developed by your ally India that connects Iran with Russia. Its called the North-South Trade Route.
When Pakistan was created, the situation was worse than what it is today. The electricity bills are high because we have been pressurized by IMF to increase indirect taxes so that we can pay off interest payments to it which are unlawful in Islam. The rupee lost its value because friendly IMF pressurized us to devaluate it with respect to the dollar so that the West could get cheap imports from Pakistan. When we are rid of the IMF and World Bank instructions to kill our economy with more and more taxes then we will stand on our feet.

 

[Sliver]

The rupee lost its value because friendly IMF pressurized us to devaluate it with respect to the dollar so that the West could get cheap imports from Pakistan. When we are rid of the IMF and World Bank instructions to kill our economy with more and more taxes then we will stand on our feet.

as of now a war torn Afghanistan has better economy (currency rate) and forex (totaling $9.5 billion ) and is a much more sharia compliant government.

Iran has $40 billion in forex reserves and much better economy

why will they join Pakistan which is neither sharia compiant, nor has better economy - what does Pakistan offer?

 

[R2D2]

as of now a war torn Afghanistan has better economy (currency rate) and forex (totaling $9.5 billion ) and is a much more sharia compliant government.

Iran has $40 billion in forex reserves and much better economy

why will they join Pakistan which is neither sharia compiant, nor has better economy - what does Pakistan offer?

We can provide all kinds of consumer and industrial goods manufactured in Pakistan as well as vegetables and fruits. We have huge deposits of coal in Thar. We can provide land connectivity for trade with China. We can do trade with Europe via Iran and Turkey. We can also provide skilled manpower for projects in Iran and Afghanistan.

 

[Krptonite]

Not interested in your arguments to highlight problems to be faced by the new Caliphate. We will solve all the real problems as they arise and not the imaginary ones in yours and that American's head.

Its like we're speaking different languages.

When you posit something, its up to you to defend its validity with reasons that are convincing.

So far:
1. You haven't explained why Iran or Afghanistan would like to merge into a union

2. Why Pakistan would like to merge with the above two countries

3. What reason makes you think China would help you out to that extent

If your intent is to write fictional stories, I do apologize for disturbing you with reason. You've made it abundantly clear that it is not a universal value to be expected from you.

 

[Sliver]

We can provide all kinds of consumer and industrial goods manufactured in Pakistan as well as vegetables and fruits. We have huge deposits of coal in Thar. We can provide land connectivity for trade with China. We can do trade with Europe via Iran and Turkey. We can also provide skilled manpower for projects in Iran and Afghanistan.

ok - I ll bite
"consumer and Industrial goods" -> what Industrial goods does Pakistan produce that can be exported to Iran? can you name some?
we can provide vegetables, fuits etc - but currently our own citizens are suffering from inflation and high costs of for food - do we want to export food at the cost of our own citizens
Iran does not need coal - they have oil, lots of it - Afghanistan does not need coal - they dont have any insudtry that needs coal.
skilled man power for Iran - dont think they need
Afghanistan - for what projects?

Land connectivity for trade with China - again - we cannot trade with iran for risk of sanctions from USA
China has direct connection to Afghanistan - Pakistan is not needed.

what Pakistan could provide to Afghanistan is a port that Afg can use - but then again, risk of sanctions from USA hang like a sword of damocles.

 

[Ich]

as of now a war torn Afghanistan has better economy (currency rate) and forex (totaling $9.5 billion ) and is a much more sharia compliant government.

Iran has $40 billion in forex reserves and much better economy

why will they join Pakistan which is neither sharia compiant, nor has better economy - what does Pakistan offer?

Didnt know that Afghanistan and Iran has dept or something like that at IMF.

 

[epebble]

This proposal is at the idea stage right now. When the idea permeates the general population and the leadership in the three countries, then the problems you have listed will be sorted out and solved. Military budget size will be increased as we will get the armies of Iran and Afghanistan joining us.

We are also using Iranian products in Pakistan like plastic based products such as utencils, Iranian petrol and diesel, iranian fruits and vegetables. There is border trade with Iran at a number of places. We are getting electricity from them. We are selling them rice. We get many fruits and vegetables from Afghanistan as well as coal. We sell medicines and consumer goods to them. So, there is compatiability in trade with these two countries.

Even as an idea, if you apply Business logic used in mergers and acquisitions, the country with greatest capitalization today is Iran, both fiscally and by human capital. Both Pakistan and Afghanistan are not going concerns by any stretch of imagination over at least next few decades. Iran is also an already established theocracy with their Ayatollah system continuously in operation from 1979. It only makes sense to merge Pakistan and Afghanistan into Iran under the Ayatollah and may be rename it as Islamic Republic of Greater Iran. That way, Pakistan and Afghanistan will get some liquidity using Iran's oil and Iran can use the large population for labor and military for its security.

 

[R2D2]

ok - I ll bite
"consumer and Industrial goods" -> what Industrial goods does Pakistan produce that can be exported to Iran? can you name some?
we can provide vegetables, fuits etc - but currently our own citizens are suffering from inflation and high costs of for food - do we want to export food at the cost of our own citizens
Iran does not need coal - they have oil, lots of it - Afghanistan does not need coal - they dont have any insudtry that needs coal.
skilled man power for Iran - dont think they need
Afghanistan - for what projects?

Land connectivity for trade with China - again - we cannot trade with iran for risk of sanctions from USA
China has direct connection to Afghanistan - Pakistan is not needed.

what Pakistan could provide to Afghanistan is a port that Afg can use - but then again, risk of sanctions from USA hang like a sword of damocles.

Pakistan produces light machinery, tractors, cars, trucks, sugar mills, tube wells, motors, electrical equipment, medicines. For fruits and vegetables, when there is more production than need in full season, we can export and when there is shortage, we can import. We can have similar arrangement with India for cereals, fruits and vegetables. We will trade with our interest in mind. America is an ex-super power. We can risk its sanctions if it comes to that. We have other options in the shape of China, Russia and Europe. We can have peace with India and spend the money saved on the economy.

Even as an idea, if you apply Business logic used in mergers and acquisitions, the country with greatest capitalization today is Iran, both fiscally and by human capital. Both Pakistan and Afghanistan are not going concerns by any stretch of imagination over at least next few decades. Iran is also an already established theocracy with their Ayatollah system continuously in operation from 1979. It only makes sense to merge Pakistan and Afghanistan into Iran under the Ayatollah and may be rename it as Islamic Republic of Greater Iran. That way, Pakistan and Afghanistan will get some liquidity using Iran's oil and Iran can use the large population for labor and military for its security.

At present, I am inviting the Pakistani leadership to declare Khilafah and invite Iran and Afghanistan to join us and maybe Turkey too. Gen Asim Munir is from a Syed family (Descendant of Prophet Mohammad SAW) and they are given equal respect among Sunnis and Shias, plus he is a Hafiz (Remembers the whole Holy Quran by heart) which is a mark of prestige and learning among Muslims.

 

[epebble]

At present I am inviting the Pakistani leadership to declare Khilafah and invite Iran and Afghanistan to join us and maybe Turkey too.

Greater chance of success if the strongest party, Iran, starts the initiative. A merger initiative by weak hand may be considered hostile.