Pakistan can not sell JF-17: China

[Windjammer]

Just to enlighten some, PAF has been training the Sri Lankan airforce for over a decade while it's aircraft are overhauled at PAC Kamra.

The four Pakistan Air Force instructor pilots who
were assisting in the training of SLAF students
commenced their work on July 27, 2001, just two
days after the attack. As they taxied out on their
first mission that day, they went past three burnt out
K-8 hulks. The PAF instructors had been seconded
to the SLAF for 18 months, but due to an increased
threat from India and the build up of their troops on
Pakistan’s border the pilots were subsequently posted
back to their units by mid-2002. Unfortunately, one
of them, Sqn Ldr Niswan, was subsequently killed in
a Mirage crash in 2003. A Pakistan flag flies along
with Chinese and Sri Lankan flags outside the CO’s
office as a tribute to those countries that assisted in
the creation of the unit.
Three replacement K-8s were delivered in 2005
and today 14 Squadron is on the verge of moving
to China Bay, where all the SLAF flying training
will be consolidated. This will help to ease the air
traffic worries at Sri Lanka’s international airport.

http://www.airforce.lk/pdf/news paper/slaf/srilanka_ariforce.pdf

 

[Amolthebest]

As some one said, you are complete opposite of your avatar......never knew SU-30 was an Indian creation. !!

TOT and fincial contribution. on both we done better than you. Pakistan's contribution in is ar contribution is good as your Hatf missiles. Every body knows they are corrupt copy of north Korean Missiles.

 

[Gandalf]

Just to enlighten some, PAF has been training the Sri Lankan airforce for over a decade while it's aircraft are overhauled at PAC Kamra.


http://www.airforce.lk/pdf/news paper/slaf/srilanka_ariforce.pdf

And where is JF-17 in this.

India is training dozens of SL military cadres and delivered 5 Mi 17's Armed versions to SLAF.

 

[Secur]

TOT and fincial contribution. on both we done better than you. Pakistan's contribution in is ar contribution is good as your Hatf missiles. Every body knows they are corrupt copy of north Korean Missiles.

So basically license producing an aircraft gets you more transfer of technology than what being a co-partner program does ? Is that how I should understand it ? As for the " fincial " contribution , Pakistan provided half the money for the development , do not tell me that somehow you paid for the development of SU 30's too !

Every country was but reverse engineering and copying other technologies at first , check the history of all the major defense equipment exporters of the world ...

 

[IndianArmy]

As some one said, you are complete opposite of your avatar......never knew SU-30 was an Indian creation. !!

Su-30 MKI is the first aircraft Russia ever jointly developed. If you want me to continue, I can explain with evidence, the Indian contribution to both its design and Avionics.

 

[Backbencher]

Su-30 MKI is the first aircraft Russia ever jointly developed. If you want me to continue, I can explain with evidence, the Indian contribution to both its design and Avionics.

The story doesnt ends here !
The Russians are again developing jointly with India the beast known as the Pak-fa .
There has to be something about Indian engineers .

 

[foxbat]

So basically license producing an aircraft gets you more transfer of technology than what being a co-partner program does ? Is that how I should understand it ? As for the " fincial " contribution , Pakistan provided half the money for the development , do not tell me that somehow you paid for the development of SU 30's too !

Every country was but reverse engineering and copying other technologies at first , check the history of all the major defense equipment exporters of the world ...

Different deals have different constructs. Some license productions provide 100% TOT and some none.. Specifically, in the MKI deal, there is 100% ToT which is the reason why, since last year, every single part of Su 30 MKI is locally produced in India.. I repeat, not just assembled, but manufactured.
Tarmak007 -- A bold blog on Indian defence: Desi Sukhoi performs supersonic ballet on debut | Aircraft built from complete raw material phase makes a silent entry

Pakistan is still a few years away from getting that level of indigenous manufacturing for JF 17 . If I remember right, the target is 70% by 2015

 

[Windjammer]

Su 30 MKI is more Indian than JF 17 is Pakistani. At present, 100% of MKI's production is done in India, including manufacturing of the engine. Unlike that, JF 17 is still mostly manufactured in China and then assembled in Pakistan, with the engine still being manufactured and imported from Russia.

While Pakistan's non monetary contributions to JF 17 design (not requirements) are mostly non verifiable claims on forums and those too limited to stationing Pakistani engineers in China, India has actually designed and fitted most of the MKI avionics..

There is surely no limit to fan boy's chest thumping.....at one time F-16 was being produced in three NATO countries, none ever claimed it to be their creation....Indian may be entirely producing the MKI.....but how much Indian design and specifications went into the prototype. The first SU-30s were designed, produced, tested by Russia then sold to India with subsequent TOT.
On the contrary, The PAF designers/engineers were involved with the JF-17 from scratch, hence the pre-fix JF (Joint Fighter).
Even for the much vaunted PAK-FA....the Indian contribution is not exactly something to shout about.

Sukhoi director Mikhail Pogosyan has projected a market for 1,000 fighter aircraft over the next four decades, which will be produced in a joint venture with India, 200 each for Russia and India and 600 for other countries.[97] He has also said that the Indian contribution would be in the form of joint work under the current agreement rather than as a joint venture.[98] The Indian Air Force will "acquire 50 single-seater fighters of the Russian version" before the two seat FGFA is developed.[99]

 

[KRAIT]

What's the conclusion ? Is the news true or not ?

 

[Gandalf]

Pakistan is still a few years away from getting that level of indigenous manufacturing for JF 17 . If I remember right, the target is 70% by 2015

Thanks for this info.

There is surely no limit to fan boy's chest thumping.....at one time F-16 was being produced in three NATO countries, none ever claimed it to be their creation....Indian may be entirely producing the MKI.....but how much Indian design and specifications went into the prototype. The first SU-30s were designed, produced, tested by Russia then sold to India with subsequent TOT.
On the contrary, The PAF designers/engineers were involved with the JF-17 from scratch, hence the pre-fix JF (Joint Fighter).
Even for the much vaunted PAK-FA....the Indian contribution is not exactly something to shout about.

Nothing in the JF 17 is Pakistani design except maybe useless subsystems,they are either Chinese or European,the Engine is made in Russia,(not even Licence produced)!

 

[Amolthebest]

Thanks for this info.



Nothing in the JF 17 is Pakistani design except maybe useless subsystems,they are either Chinese or European,the Engine is made in Russia,(not even Licence produced)!

You troll

 

[Backbencher]

What's the conclusion ? Is the news true or not ?

Can we sell MKI ?? No
However we manufacture it for indegenous demands.
Similarly Pakistan cannot sell a Chinese maal

 

[Gandalf]

IN the Airvraft Engine development Arena Pakistan is yet to built even a licence build engine.
Whereas India has the licence to produce TVC equipped AL-31's for years.

Afterall though India still has a significant way to go in indigenous engine development still the capability to produce an engine which can hit 70KN+ with afterburner and 50KN with dry thrust isa great achievement.

 

[graphican]

lol, JF-17 is already obsolete.

5th generation is whats going to be in focus in the next few years.

I'd be quite surprised to see any airforce seriously go for any 4th generation plane in the near future.

JF-17, I think was just meant to be a short-term solution to a short-term problem.

I couldn't disagree with any post more.

 

[foxbat]

There is surely no limit to fan boy's chest thumping.....at one time F-16 was being produced in three NATO countries, none ever claimed it to be their creation....Indian may be entirely producing the MKI.....but how much Indian design and specifications went into the prototype. The first SU-30s were designed, produced, tested by Russia then sold to India with subsequent TOT.
On the contrary, The PAF designers/engineers were involved with the JF-17 from scratch, hence the pre-fix JF (Joint Fighter).
Even for the much vaunted PAK-FA....the Indian contribution is not exactly something to shout about.

Whoa! Easy mate.. we are just talking.. Dont go off all flying off your handle now..

A couple things.. We are talking Su 30 MKI and not Su 30 per se.. MKI has been jointly developed using an existing frame as a base. Just like JF 17 is built on FC1

Sukhoi Su-30MKI - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Sukhoi Su-30MKI[3] (NATO reporting name: Flanker-H) is an air superiority fighter jointly developed by Russia's Sukhoi and India's Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) for the Indian Air Force (IAF). A variant of the Sukhoi Su-30, it is a heavy, all-weather, long-range fighter.

Development of the variant started after India signed a deal with Russia in 2000 to manufacture 140 Su-30 fighter jets.[4] The first Russian-made Su-30MKI variant was accepted into the Indian Air Force in 2002,[5] while the first indigenously assembled Su-30MKI entered service with the IAF in 2004.[6] In 2007, the IAF ordered 40 additional MKIs.[7] The IAF has 157 Su-30MKIs in active service as of January 2012;[1] it plans to have a fleet of 272.[8] The Su-30MKI is expected to form the backbone of the Indian Air Force's fighter fleet to 2020 and beyond.[9]

The aircraft is tailor-made for Indian specifications and integrates Indian systems and avionics as well as French and Israeli subsystems.[10] It has abilities similar to the Sukhoi Su-35 with which it shares many features and components.[11][12]

Now moving on, I did not claim that su 30 MKI is an indian creation.. Only that it is more Indian than JF 17 is Pakistani. Frankly that was more a comment on Pakistani contribution to JF 17 than Indian contribution to MKI.

As I said, the non monetary contributions are limited to unverified claims. Stationing engineers does not translate to creating designs. For all you know they may have been there to learn about FC 1 so that assembly and maintenance in Pakistan for the plane is easy.

Are there any components at all in JF 17, for which the technology IP is owned by Pakistan or even jointly owned by China and Pakistan ?

You may also do well to read the line in your quote just preceding the one that you highlighted in red. Also, joint work under current agreement can or can not be something to write home. about.. Unfortunately, you can not comment on that unless you know the details of CURRENT AGREEMENT