Pakistan blocks NATO supplies

[lem34]

Best expose of "our" Cheng by Chyphercide:

Re: US responsible for the Murder of Pakistani Troops - Pak Rejects NATO Pr
I think the onus lies on both sides to come up with a workable arrangement, keeping in mind Pakistan's newfound spine, as long as it lasts.
Original Post By VCheng

There was this village boy who gets a horse on his 14th birthday

Everybody in the village says; "What a wonderful gift"

The Zen master says "We'll see"

A year later, the boy falls off the horse and breaks his leg.

Everyone in the village says; "How terrible that the boy is suffering"

The Zen master says, "We'll see"

A war is on the horizon and the boy isn't sent off to fight on account of his injured leg.

Everybody in the village exclaim "How lucky this boy is !!!"

The Zen master says "We'll see......"

I think you catch the drift.

This is the infinite loop on the argument that you keep tapping into for your posts and at the end of the ordeal you come off as the wise Zen master and poor ol' me as the village imbecile who didn't know any better than to pick sides.Pretty much pointless to argue against until you define just where your line in the sand is...bugging out!!!


Cheng has stated that within 30 days transit routes would be reopened. clearly he was wrong. He now awaits them reopening so that he can tell us that he was right.

Rafbhai I am pleased you thought the expose was fitting

 

[Rafi]

This cheng is a curious creature, well it takes all sorts.

 

[VCheng]

from: ‘Pakistan to allow US trainers, not drones’ | Newspaper | DAWN.COM

WASHINGTON: US military trainers will be invited back into Pakistan “as early as April or May”, but the nation has ruled out allowing CIA drones back into the country, American Fox News reported late on Friday night.

Relations between the two nations have been at an all-time low since 24 Pakistani soldiers were killed in air strikes by Nato in November.

A committee of the Pakistani parliament is reviewing the nature of the country’s relationship with the US, and politicians are expected on Jan 30 to deliver a list of conditions for cooperation to resume.

The stipulations will include no covert CIA or military operations on the ground in Pakistan, and no unauthorised incursions into its airspace. Drones, which are the CIA’s biggest weapon against militants hiding in the tribal belt dividing Afghanistan and Pakistan, “can never return”, a senior Pakistani official told Fox News.

“They will never be allowed back, at Shamsi or anywhere else,” the official added, referring to the base from which many of the unmanned aerial vehicles were deployed before the Nato attack in November.

In return, Pakistan would allow back US military trainers, including special forces teams, and a resumption of close cooperation with the CIA in targeting militants who use the Pakistani side of the border as a safe haven and breeding ground for extremism.

It would also reopen the Torkham and Chaman border crossings into Afghanistan, which have been closed to Nato supply convoys since the attack.

“After this is presented to the Americans, a lot could happen very quickly,” the senior official told the TV channel.

Islamabad also would reopen its doors to high-level US diplomats after an embarrassing snub this week to President Obama’s special envoy to the region, Marc Grossman, who was denied his request to visit Pakistan in the middle of his tour of South Asia.

Pakistan says it wants working conditions with Washington that provide “respect for the nation, its sovereignty — both its soil and airspace — and equal terms of cooperation”. Government members have said publicly that there has never been equality in the relationship.

“We understand the government of Pakistan is still working on its review of US-Pakistan relations, and we have not yet received a formal report from the government,” Pentagon spokesman Capt John Kirby said in an emailed statement.

“Decisions about the level of Pakistani commitment to our military relationship are obviously theirs to make, and we respect that.”

“We continue to desire a close military relationship with Pakistan. We both have a fundamental interest in cooperation, in eliminating Al Qaeda’s ability to operate from Pakistan, and in ensuring a stable Afghanistan and stable region.”

Pakistan, especially its military, has been reeling since US forces killed Osama Bin Laden in a raid in May.

The raid, which sparked nationwide protests and stoked further anti-Americanism, and civilian casualties caused by drone attacks are considered by Pakistan to be flagrant violations of its sovereignty by an ‘arrogant’ American government.

Pakistan’s Foreign Minister Hina Rabbani Khar said this week that ties “are on hold until we start re-engaging”, but Pakistan is now motivated by the US elections to move forward swiftly in rebuilding trust between the countries. Islamabad fears that if foundation stones are not laid before presidential campaigning begins in earnest in the summer, it will not be able to renegotiate with Washington until the middle of next year.

But the senior official suggested there might be a benefit to waiting.

“We would prefer it if there was a Republican government again,” he said. —Dawn monitoring desk

=================================

It would be foolish to raise hopes of a change if a Republican wins the White House in 2012. The continuity of policies will span administrations, just like before.

 

[Al Bhatti]

US military trainers will be invited back into Pakistan “as early as April or May”

Of course, as the Pakistani government, politicians and generals want to get as much as po$$ible before the elections in Pakistan.

The stipulations will include no covert CIA or military operations on the ground in Pakistan, and no unauthorised incursions into its airspace. Drones, which are the CIA’s biggest weapon against militants hiding in the tribal belt dividing Afghanistan and Pakistan, “can never return”, a senior Pakistani official told Fox News.

Yes but it can come back in this ca$e anytime.

“They will never be allowed back, at Shamsi or anywhere else,” the official added, referring to the base from which many of the unmanned aerial vehicles were deployed before the Nato attack in November.

A question: From where did the drones take off then and who gave the green signal? and who recieved the head money.

Pakistan says it wants working conditions with Washington that provide “respect for the nation, its sovereignty — both its soil and airspace — and equal terms of cooperation”. Government members have said publicly that there has never been equality in the relationship.

Read: Politicians and Generals say they want working conditions with Washington that provide “respect for them, and their image — both inside and outside Pakistan— and equal term$ of cooperation”. Government members have said publicly that there has never been equality in the relation$hip. (yeh dil mangey more, pepsi )

“We understand the government of Pakistan is still working on its review of US-Pakistan relations, and we have not yet received a formal report from the government,” Pentagon spokesman Capt John Kirby said in an emailed statement.

Of course they are talking all the politicians in confidence so that all can get the appropriate a$$urances.

“Decisions about the level of Pakistani commitment to our military relationship are obviously theirs to make, and we respect that.”

The generals are highly commited to this along with the politicians.

Pakistan’s Foreign Minister Hina Rabbani Khar said this week that ties “are on hold until we start re-engaging”, but Pakistan is now motivated by the US elections to move forward swiftly in rebuilding trust between the countries. Islamabad fears that if foundation stones are not laid before presidential campaigning begins in earnest in the summer, it will not be able to renegotiate with Washington until the middle of next year.

Yes, becasue the rules may change after the elections and their (the politicians') $hare may shrink.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Please allow me to direct your attention to the post with your new Ambassador's words to the President: "...dismissed suggestions that the review would have a negative impact on bilateral relations."

Given that commitment of NO NEGATIVE IMPACT ON BILATERAL RELATIONS, I can safely conclude that the process being followed by the PNSC is a topi drama, since the outcome has already been conveyed.

Or would you perhaps like to state in public here your confidence that the PNSC will come up with a credible conclusion that will further Pakistan's national interests?

It is rather rich that a person as biased as you are in moderation would accuse anyone else of being biased. You, like many others, are blinded by your own zeal and indoctrination. (A sad and sorry spectacle indeed.)

For example, if I add a relevant and pithy image to my posts, both you and Irfan Baloch are quick to delete them, yet the image of the face palm above and even blatantly abusive posts like the one below directed at me remain.

Who is biased and who is not is plain to see.

I'll just quote some of your own comments to 'expose' your pretense of 'unbiased objectivity':

I think we have to wait to hear the other side too. Simple.

Well, let's read the report first and then critically analyze it. 12-23 is not that far away.

Exactly. I am sure if there are lies in it, we can catch them and discuss it all here.

Knee jerk reactions are many times just plain too emotional to be useful or productive. Taking one's time may not be a cover-up but rather a thorough job.

I am not regarding the Pakistani report as worthless. All I am saying is to let the other side speak too.

That is all.

I agree with your arguments above; however, presently, there is no option but to wait for 12-23. I hope we can discuss this important post of yours at that correct point in time.

Pakistan can derive important political and military gains once its stand is confirmed, I am sure, if it plays its hand well.

I would respectfully decline to speculate at this point in time. It is only a few more days.

Edit: I will not post in these threads until 12-23 voluntarily. This is my last post here.

Perhaps you should follow your own advice in the last line of that last post of yours quoted above.

 

[VCheng]

I'll just quote some of your own comments to 'expose' your pretense of 'unbiased objectivity':
.................

Perhaps you should follow your own advice in the last line of that last post of yours quoted above.

Aren't NATO supplies the topic, not me:

Pakistan's Future is For Sell just for 1.5 thousand dollars per container of NATO.The Zardari league is considering to open supply line of NATO as low as 1.5 thousand dollars per container While the army doesn't want that.Army wants solutions of some really big geopolitical issues while Zardari league is just selling us out.Here is the article from most believed news paper.

Pakistan's Future is For Sell just for 1.5 thousand dollars per container

I find it interesting how the increase in the tariff rate is enough to cover up loss of personnel: blood money by any other name, perhaps?

 

[RazPaK]

Mr. Cheng the Yankee doodle, at it again. I respect you now that you have finally shown us your true colors.

 

[VCheng]

Mr. Cheng the Yankee doodle, at it again. I respect you now that you have finally shown us your true colors.

=====================================

Back on topic:

from: US links Grossman

WASHINGTON: US special envoy Marc Grossman will go to Pakistan when the Pakistanis are ready for talks with the United States on a multi-faceted bilateral relationship, says the State Department.

Mr Grossman, who is now in the region, wanted to visit Pakistan for consultations on exploratory talks with the Taliban but Islamabad asked him to postpone the visit.

At a news briefing, the department’s spokesperson, Victoria Nuland, explained that Pakistan was still reviewing its relationship with the US.

“Right now they are still going through their internal review about where they want to go in our bilateral relationship, so the visit is premature.

“So it was on that basis that he decided not to go. We never got to the stage of submitting visas or any of that.”

“Is it your understanding that they’re debating whether to have a relationship with you at all?” asked a journalist.

“They did not judge that it was timely to have these conversations, but they did make clear that they want to do it at a future date, and frankly, we need to give them the space that they need to work on their issues so that we can have a good set of meetings when they are ready,” said Ms Nuland.

“And Ambassador Grossman has made it clear, the Secretary (Hillary Clinton) has made it clear that when they’re ready, he will go back.”

Ms Nuland noted that the Pakistan Foreign Office also had expressed the desire to rebuild a multi-faceted relationship with the US. She also pointed out that the relationship with Pakistan had continued despite the problems the two countries had faced after the Nov 26 Nato raid on Pakistani border posts.

“Our ambassador and our Embassy are in contact with the Pakistanis on a daily basis. Our civilian assistance is continuing to flow. Our full range of programmes that we do on economic support, infrastructure, all of these, educational things are going forward,” she said.

Asked to comment on Foreign Minister Hina Rabbani Khar’s statement that the US must stop drone attacks, Ms Nuland said she would not like to discuss individual issues before Pakistanis completed their parliamentary review.

“They’re going to review it inter-agency. Then they will brief us on the entirety of their thinking, and we’ll have a consultation on it. I’m not going to prejudge pieces of that when they’re in the middle of their own process,” she said.

The US official disagreed with an Indian journalist who suggested that during his visit to New Delhi on Friday Ambassador Grossman had asked India to do more in Afghanistan.

“No. I think our view is that India has been a strong supporter of a regional strategy, is playing a key role in supporting Afghanistan, and (he visited New Delhi) just to compare notes on those issues,” she said.

 

[StrikeForce]

Just a curious question , Are there any alternative supply route to NATO troops in Afghanistan apart from using Pakistan.

 

[Safriz]

Difa-e-Pakistan Council to sit in if Nato supplies resumes | The News Tribe

 

[RazPaK]

Just a curious question , Are there any alternative supply route to NATO troops in Afghanistan apart from using Pakistan.

Yes but they are too costly, and almost unreliable during winter times.

 

[VCheng]

Difa-e-Pakistan Council to sit in if Nato supplies resumes | The News Tribe

This "sit-in" is going to be as fruitless as IK's "dharnas".

 

[Safriz]

This "sit-in" is going to be as fruitless as IK's "dharnas".

No....this is on a much larger scale than IKs Dharnaa....and he will surely join in...and now he too is much larger than before...

 

[VCheng]

No....this is on a much larger scale than IKs Dharnaa....and he will surely join in...and now he too is much larger than before...

This old Zen master says to wait and see what happens!

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Aren't NATO supplies the topic, not me:

The intent behind posting your earlier comments about the NATO investigation was to expose your arguments on the topic as biased and nonobjective, and quite clearly hypocritical.

And yes, your arguments on the topic are open to criticizm.