Pakistan Air Force | News & Discussions.

[LKJ86]

the two leading countries in aviation, Russia is out of the picture in this one!

USA is still top.

China needs to keep working very hard for a long time.

 

[SD 10]

USA is still top.

China needs to keep working very hard for a long time.

CHINA will get there!

 

[StormBreaker]

CHINA will get there!

No, probably china will create standards in near future, take an altogether different path.

Reason : USA have mustered 5th gen fighters. China still doesn’t know the 100% or even to my guess 60% of F-22/F-35 tech and yet they have J-20 claiming to be 5th gen. They tried their level best but don’t know all the studies USA have for 5th gen. So china will definitely carry on a different path and will introduce something totally new in this field

 

[araz]

A ..... No. But better answer for me is to speed up AZM system development.

B & C ..... We are doing upgrades to 1960s vintage mirages ..... There will be lots of upgrades to JF17 platform (Both Software and Hardware). Newer block (more fighters) and upgrade both will need to be there. Azm should have different production lines.

D ..... Agree with you. Think Azm as AZM system, not only 5th gen fighter. Speed up is the only answer. JF17 model (starting with available mature tech and then incremental capability increase) is excellent in reducing timeline. Things should start coming out in 3-5 years with final product should be there in 8-10 years. we don't always need to be reactive to Indian developments. We need to be visionary and proactive.

And one more thing is that if I am not wrong (I could be as I am no technical person) stealth shaping with internal weapon bay is less difficult task then the other 5th gen goodies. Leaving only these 2 won't be a good thing and cause more waste of time.

I could be wrong but these are my views.

You cannot speed up products like that. It is not without reason people are saying that the project will take 10 yrs to materialize. I think it is very likely we might not see a platform till 35. This leaves me with a decade+/-5yrs to contend with (I think in planning one takes the worst possible scenario ) and hence my assumption of newer blocks of JFT which is where this discussion started. I understand the fact that there may be 2 separate assembly lines but that is quite an expense for PAC unless we have significant orders.
The story of Mirages is a very different one so let us not complicate things unnecessarily by including those here.
A

No, probably china will create standards in near future, take an altogether different path.

Reason : USA have mustered 5th gen fighters. China still doesn’t know the 100% or even to my guess 60% of F-22/F-35 tech and yet they have J-20 claiming to be 5th gen. They tried their level best but don’t know all the studies USA have for 5th gen. So china will definitely carry on a different path and will introduce something totally new in this field

There is 100 years of industrial development backing the Us aviation industry. China has only really been there since the last 40 years. It will take them another10 -20yrs to catch up to the US.
A

 

[MastanKhan]

No, probably china will create standards in near future, take an altogether different path.

Reason : USA have mustered 5th gen fighters. China still doesn’t know the 100% or even to my guess 60% of F-22/F-35 tech and yet they have J-20 claiming to be 5th gen. They tried their level best but don’t know all the studies USA have for 5th gen. So china will definitely carry on a different path and will introduce something totally new in this field

Hi,

Here is what is going to happen---. China may never be able to compete with the 'white devil' for another 50 years---but they will come out with something else to take it down----.

And that would be a better tracking system--- better surface and air to air missiles---better radar and early warning system---ability to take down the opponents air refuellers at a critical time.

 

[ARMalik]

I have said it plenty of times that if China wants to be a TRUE Superpower than it can never become a Superpower if it tries to copy the US because it will always lag the US. The Only way that China can beat US and others is to innovate and come up with New Energy Source and new weapons systems based on an entirely different design philosophy. People say that you DO NOT need to reinvent the wheel. I say why do you even need WHEELS?? Come up with something extraordinary and you will not need wheels ever again. And this is what any nation which wants to the supreme power needs to do.

 

[ziaulislam]

I have said it plenty of times that if China wants to be a TRUE Superpower than it can never become a Superpower if it tries to copy the US because it will always lag the US. The Only way that China can beat US and others is to innovate and come up with New Energy Source and new weapons systems based on an entirely different design philosophy. People say that you DO NOT need to reinvent the wheel. I say why do you even need WHEELS?? Come up with something extraordinary and you will not need wheels ever again. And this is what any nation which wants to the supreme power needs to do.

And where will that innovation going to come from.?
China population is getting old and decades old policy of single child is now showing its colors while minorities are prosecuted ...talent is being sucked into USA.
In USA half of the people in MIT are immigrants inculding chinese

 

[ARMalik]

And where will that innovation going to come from.?
China population is getting old and decades old policy of single child is now showing its colors while minorities are prosecuted ...talent is being sucked into USA.
In USA half of the people in MIT are immigrants inculding chinese

As a nation, China needs to figure out how to move past all obstacles. Achieving a Superpower status and then maintaining it is extremely difficult.

 

[Chak Bamu]

When I was a mere teenager in 80's, I thought that it would be great to have a joint fighter program with Turkey, with perhaps Iran as third partner (I was obviously more naive back then).

Each partner could take the lead in either airframe, or engine, or avionics. I thought that it could be done within a decade (yes, naive again), to get a fighter that would be dependable & cutting edge.

It would be great if Pakistan could partner with Turkey on a complete jet, minus the engine perhaps? Going the FGFA route independently could become cost-prohibitive. Just look at recent GDP growth numbers.

 

[LKJ86]

And where will that innovation going to come from.?
China population is getting old and decades old policy of single child is now showing its colors while minorities are prosecuted ...talent is being sucked into USA.
In USA half of the people in MIT are immigrants inculding chinese

USA also thinks so.
But the reality is very cruel to the people having such idea...

But that idea really helps China unexpectedly

 

[StormBreaker]

When I was a mere teenager in 80's, I thought that it would be great to have a joint fighter program with Turkey, with perhaps Iran as third partner (I was obviously more naive back then).

Each partner could take the lead in either airframe, or engine, or avionics. I thought that it could be done within a decade (yes, naive again), to get a fighter that would be dependable & cutting edge.

It would be great if Pakistan could partner with Turkey on a complete jet, minus the engine perhaps? Going the FGFA route independently could become cost-prohibitive. Just look at recent GDP growth numbers.

A joint FGFA NGF platform co developed by PAF and TuAF has more potential and probability of happening (God knows what talks are going inside) than one can imagine.

Reason : Turkey has been rejected F-35 and TF-X is going to be a dual engine air superiority fighter in class between heavy and medium. It is intended to replace F-16s.

PAF on the other hand plans AZM as possible replacement of F-16s but in limited numbers to around 120-150 (my guess due to costs and heavy maintenance requirements).

So both Air forces have a grey area where number boosting, single engine advanced fighter is required and this is where a program can be initiated to go 5+/6th Gen and timeline should be around 2035-2040.

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @aliyusuf

 

[aliyusuf]

A joint FGFA NGF platform co developed by PAF and TuAF has more potential and probability of happening (God knows what talks are going inside) than one can imagine.

Reason : Turkey has been rejected F-35 and TF-X is going to be a dual engine air superiority fighter in class between heavy and medium. It is intended to replace F-16s.

PAF on the other hand plans AZM as possible replacement of F-16s but in limited numbers to around 120-150 (my guess due to costs and heavy maintenance requirements).

So both Air forces have a grey area where number boosting, single engine advanced fighter is required and this is where a program can be initiated to go 5+/6th Gen and timeline should be around 2035-2040.

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @aliyusuf

Collaboration should be encouraged with whomever is willing to collaborate with us. As long as Pakistan's interests get served. That should be the primary consideration. Be it China, Turkey or any other country. But in the immediate future I am seeing this collaboration being heavily dependent on Chinese help to start off the initial work. Turkey will be useful in sharing their expertise in subsystems like GaN based AESA radar TRMs, EW suites and targeting pods etc. Pakistan could be useful in working as a conduit of know-how between the other two and as eventually providing the trained workforce to keep prices down comparatively.

But AZM will be giving off results i.e. the first prototype gets developed ... sometime between 2030 to 2035. Then expect another 7 to 8 years for the design to be perfected and finalized. After that small batch production versions could be initiated. Somewhere between 2037 to 2043.

Provided, Pakistan's economy picks up in the next couple years.

 

[Path-Finder]

I didn't see any news about this and it's already more than 6 months old. PAF visit to PCO S.A Polish optics maker.
https://pcosa.com.pl/en/delegation-from-pakistan-4/

On 23rd of July premises of PCO S.A. were visited by Mujahid Awnar Khan Chief of the Hedquarters of the Airforce – Commander of the Pakistan Air Force.
He was accompanied by Safqat Ali Khan – ambassador of the Islamic Republic of Pakistan in Warsaw, and Deffence Attache of the embassy.

Guests watched a multimedia presentation of the Company. They were also acvkonwledged with the most modern night vision products and cameras for the combat platforms. Next the delegation visited production facilities of the Company and tests department conducting tests of the equipment.

Interestingly COAS visited them as well and Former ACM visited them too!

 

[PakShaheen79]

Interestingly COAS visited them as well and Former ACM visited them too!

Don't know why, but it seems they are already working on something asked by PAF. So many high end visits can't be just to get know the products offered by a company.

 

[khanasifm]

outer casing being reviewed by chief it’s looks like

https://pcosa.com.pl/en/night-vision-thermal-and-day-cameras/