Pak lodges strong protest with Afghan govt on torture of Pakistanis

[Sedqal]

Why we need to pashtunize kpk, read this,

“I recently carried out a sample survey for my research thesis while selecting 200 Schools each from government and private sectors in different KP districts. Only 3 per cent students of grade 7 and 8 knew about our literary, political and social reformers, 90 per cent failed to write correct alphabetic letters oftheir respective mother tongues and only 5 per cent knew as to who were Rahman Baba and Khushhal Khan Khattak .This I think is a great loss to our diverse cultural treasure, heritage and history, if our young generation doesn’t know about ourgreat national heroes how they can preserve it,” maintained Irfan Ali Yousafzai who is doing doctorate from a private University in Peshawar on ‘Cultural representation in the school curriculum’.[/QUOTE]
@Sher Malang



It is a single subject[/QUOTE]

I can't believe it, so all the hoopla was about introducing Pushto as a single subject! That should have been included decades ago!

 

[haviZsultan]

Oh I'm all for Pashtun Nationalism !

They can glorify their history & their folklore as much as they want to...heck because their leaders were Muslims & many of our people fought alongside them - We'd chip in with a couplet or two as well !

What I don't like is putting any of our ethnicities before 'Pakistan'; yup develop your culture, your language, your history & transmit it to your children so that they may know what to call themselves but don't let it come at the expense of your identity as a 'Pakistani' ! Let it grow in addition...not in preference to your 'identity' as a Pakistani !

And this applies across the board to any & all ethnic or linguistic groups in Pakistan !

P.S Don't trash talk about Luffy, he may have different views but he is still one of us - Our own flesh & blood !

There would be no need for Pathan, Sindhi, Baloch, Punjabi, Muhajir nationalism if we stopped creating walls between ourselves and just respected each other. There is a worm in us that is simply divisive and intolerant of each other. I saw this in my community, planned to escape it... but it seems no where is safe.

What a way to assuage my anger & my fears ? This lack of narrative by our side, whether its with respect to Afghanistan or India, is what would undo us ?

This is exactly my worry which is why I so aggressively fight back against Luffy. I realized this with the help of afghanis_hehe on the other forum. He started arguing back, he got locked out. When I started arguing back I got locked out too. Thats when I realized that this is what these sher malangs and their lovers here at home are so afraid of. They fear being countered, their narrative being debunked and as a result have to resort to scandalous character assassination or obfuscation campaigns to gain credibility. It doesn't work but only when there's someone to call them out, otherwise it MAY work.

I would say there are 2 reasons that most Pashtuns do not challenge the narrative of Luffy:
1) Sympathy- each community is led to believe it is "oppressed", each group has been led to believe it has somehow been wrong. This naturally gives fascists a place to operate. I say this because I have seen people stop me when I argued with MQM terrorists and racists and also when I did the same with traitors like Luffy.

This is a huge issue in our problem and we are teaching our kids only hate. For example @A.Rafay is my brother and I am genuinely interested in learning his language or yours for that matter just I have been making efforts and may master Pashto completely very soon. (Just the de and da an issue right now)... we have to teach our kids that these ethnic identities don't mean a thing and shouldn't be a cause of hate while we should also tell them that each ethnic group is to be respected and has made huge sacrifices.

When I came over to the Pashtun cause initially it was for love of these great people... but later I knew this was bigger than that. It was to establish a statement of ethnic unity, to fight against a centuries old tradition of holding ethnic identity to highly. Only a person who loves Pakistan can understand the beauty of someone with no knowledge of Pashtuns previously calling himself a Pashtun and learning the language.

Personally I would like the support of people to depant ethno-fascists. The only way that can be done is people from that ethnic group having a keen eye on their history and sound knowledge of their culture so that they can analyze history themselves and catch Luffy right where he tries to rape history. So I would want Pashtuns to be strong culturally and linguistically-but just not become too emotional or attached

2) Knowledge of history and culture- Having a better grasp on history gives Luffy and gang a natural advantage which in turn gives these people the ability to best others in debate.

I usually don't comment on the first point because its like a outsider commenting but I have revealed what I feel here. I am aware that I am in many ways a wannabe Pashtun with very few links in reality, a fact serpentine, spineless people like Luffy are very keen to remind me of. But still it is a truth and each ethnic group glorifies its own ethno-fascists. Look at my extended family. Voting for criminal Altaf the monkey for years. What sickens me however is their justification or purposeful obfuscation of Altaf's criminal speech which called partition a blunder.

Speak man...defend ourselves ! You haven't a bullet to put between his eyes; that is if an Uzbek's eyes have any space in between them !

(e) Hows Bhabi ?

If Hyperion is a tribal... you do not ask about a Pashtuns, especially a tribal Pashtuns womenfolk...

But ways are changing. I hope @Hyperion is not getting pissed though while I also feel this may divert my attention f4m 2 beeping spots a.k.a b-i-g-o-t-s on my radar.

I would answer your other questions but I will leave them to Hyperion. My personal opinion is that Luffy is right about the fact that:
1) ANP made Pashto compulsory
2) the name was changed to Pakhtunkhwa

Which is good even though my fellow nationalists would abuse it. The issue is not exactly the "ethnic identity existing", its actually the ethnic identity:
1) being considered more important than the Pakistani identity-infact not being inconsequential as it has become in many developed nations.
2) Ethnic identity being directed on anti-pakistani lines. Do note it always starts with we were oppressed, the Punjabis stole our rights. This is why every time an Urdu-speaker starts spouting this rubbish you would have noticed I shut him up because it is actually a symptom of the ethno-fascist mind.

By the way by changing NWFP's name to Pakhtunkhwa another Nationalist party could have won over Pashtuns. But it is a flaw in our thinking. We believe any reference to "ethnicity" even though in Pakistan we are always aware of ethnicity being a big thing, is wrong. We have to accept that ethnicity itself is not an issue.

Its the way we direct it, how we have made it a very important aspect and use it on anti-pakistani lines.

 

[haviZsultan]

Right now if I cannot criticize ANP without saying that their name change of NWFP to Pakhtunkhwa was in line with Pashtun wishes and they have taken some steps to promote Pashtun culture, something I have to accept are good things as a Pashtun.

However their history is before us and we know as a fact they stood for a united India which has nothing whatsoever to do even with Pashtunistan. Could we have closed this window? Barricaded it? Yes, and we should have.

But the issue here is that we Nationalists begin to see culture or ethnicity itself as the problem, an issue I took note of amongst the Nationalists-though I had no issue abandoning ethnic identity. The issue is this does not work-its an impossible solution to a great problem.

ANP's history and its links to Bacha Khan who was an opponent of the Muslim League as I have stated naturally puts them at odds with Muslim League stalwarts like Abdur Rab Nishtar, Allah Nawaz Khan, Nasrullah Khan and others. They will never mention them as Pashtun heroes on account of their Muslim League history. So who will they promote? People who do not have a very positive impression of Pakistan.

So I have suggested to my Nationalist peoples that it is in our best interests to be aware of ethnic identity as its presence cannot be denied.

 

[Armstrong]

@haviZsultan : I agree with much of what you say & I used to vociferously comment away whenever our narrative was stifled out ! I agree that what is taught in our textbooks is, at times, far removed from the truth but at the same time 'critical thinking' entails that you dig deeper to find out 'what really happened' instead of taking the opposing narrative as gospel; as most Pakistanis have begun to do so - If we're wrong...the other must be right ! We don't pause & ask ourselves 'What if the old adage about history also holds true for them ? That 'history' is always written with a slight bias at best & outright revisionism at the very worst. Yes what they taught you or what they kept saying may not be the complete truth perhaps even a lie but you don't sober up or overcome that by taking the other's word as 'gold' & then continue parroting someonelse's rhetoric ! You dig deeper & you get your hands dirty to find out what really happened. And for that you read & listen to those who were there in the midst of things when history was being written; you don't take the word of someone who makes money off sensationalism & controversy by writing the juiciest articles on an age old question or of someone who read a few books & asked a few people & wrote a book about it with him trying to come across as someone who epitomizes the zenith of intellectual pursuit & historical excavation in that particular genre.

I would regularly post on PDF, often seething with anger, when Narrative 'a' is demonized to no-end & Narrative 'b' is exalted to a position it cannot deserve simply because one is louder than the other. But of late I just don't bother anymore because its kinda tiring waking up to the same BS every single day ! If the people would spend half as much as time in their local libraries going through some of the most thorough books written on issues, people or events instead of drawing their knowledge from superfluous beat-up articles written by someone with no-name & no desire to even listen to his own hollow words all the time masquerading as the bastion of free thought which transcends the limitations imposed by our narrative, then so be it ! I'd rather just make money off the Forex in the meantime !


@Hyperion : Hes my friend & we've got an association going back a few months ! And I know him well enough to know that hes a chill dude who just got engaged to his fiance & shared with us; so shes a party of the PDF family now too !

 

[haviZsultan]

You know Luffy I think that was a wrong move & they should not have done that - the Pashtunization of KPK ! It would have been better if instead of making Pashto compulsory for everyone they should have given the choice of learning any local language to the pupils so that if enough Hindko speakers or enough Farsi speakers or enough Punjabi speakers or enough Pashto speakers are made available to cover the minimum possible overhead costs borne by the Provincial Government, they should be provided with lectures in their language of choosing.

At the same time yes they should promote Pashtun culture & their history by providing proper funding to the Pashtun Academy amongst other institutions that can help paint a more wholesome picture of the Pashtun culture & introduce it more & more to the rest of Pakistan & the world at large. In fact they should have been at the forefront of the struggle to counter the narrative that is spewed by those with ulterior motives who want to project the Pashtuns as a bunch of militant savages who oppress their women & blow themselves up in marketplaces ! But I dunno if they've done anything but play dirty politics with Pashtuns & Pakistanis at large by playing the Pashtun card just like the rest of our ethno-nationalist movements/parties to win more votes instead of taking anything close to concrete steps for the betterment of Pashtuns & Non Pashtuns alike.

The issue is with the current setup... 4 provinces... and a huge rise in ethnic feelings. The districts in Pakistan must become provinces. End of sa-tory. Right now the Hazara people want their own province, Seraiki speakers their own...

Next will be Urmuri speakers (Burki's) of Kaniguram demanding their own province in their small village Kaniguram. The current setup is a root of a lot of evils.

 

[Hyperion]

@Armstrong, try to follow @haviZsultan. He is one of better informed people here. The other is Malang, but he adds his usual venom to the way he perceives history, well you can't blame him, as I said either he does it for the money from the Yanks, or maybe he suffered some trauma as a child.

 

[Armstrong]

The issue is with the current setup... 4 provinces... and a huge rise in ethnic feelings. The districts in Pakistan must become provinces. End of sa-tory. Right now the Hazara people want their own province, Seraiki speakers their own...

Next will be Urmuri speakers (Burki's) of Kaniguram demanding their own province in their small village Kaniguram. The current setup is a root of a lot of evils.

Absolutely my thoughts exactly - The current divisions are already created on Administrative lines so raise them up as Provinces instead with as much powers devolved to them as possible ! Let them raise their own revenue, make their own laws, impose their own taxes, protect & nurture their own dominant cultures & spend their own money at their own discretion on their own people !

 

[A.Rafay]

There would be no need for Pathan, Sindhi, Baloch, Punjabi, Muhajir nationalism if we stopped creating walls between ourselves and just respected each other. There is a worm in us that is simply divisive and intolerant of each other. I saw this in my community, planned to escape it... but it seems no where is safe.



This is exactly my worry which is why I so aggressively fight back against Luffy. I realized this with the help of afghanis_hehe on the other forum. He started arguing back, he got locked out. When I started arguing back I got locked out too. Thats when I realized that this is what these sher malangs and their lovers here at home are so afraid of. They fear being countered, their narrative being debunked and as a result have to resort to scandalous character assassination or obfuscation campaigns to gain credibility. It doesn't work but only when there's someone to call them out, otherwise it MAY work.

I would say there are 2 reasons that most Pashtuns do not challenge the narrative of Luffy:
1) Sympathy- each community is led to believe it is "oppressed", each group has been led to believe it has somehow been wrong. This naturally gives fascists a place to operate. I say this because I have seen people stop me when I argued with MQM terrorists and racists and also when I did the same with traitors like Luffy.

This is a huge issue in our problem and we are teaching our kids only hate. For example @A.Rafay is my brother and I am genuinely interested in learning his language or yours for that matter just I have been making efforts and may master Pashto completely very soon. (Just the de and da an issue right now)... we have to teach our kids that these ethnic identities don't mean a thing and shouldn't be a cause of hate while we should also tell them that each ethnic group is to be respected and has made huge sacrifices.

When I came over to the Pashtun cause initially it was for love of these great people... but later I knew this was bigger than that. It was to establish a statement of ethnic unity, to fight against a centuries old tradition of holding ethnic identity to highly. Only a person who loves Pakistan can understand the beauty of someone with no knowledge of Pashtuns previously calling himself a Pashtun and learning the language.

Personally I would like the support of people to depant ethno-fascists. The only way that can be done is people from that ethnic group having a keen eye on their history and sound knowledge of their culture so that they can analyze history themselves and catch Luffy right where he tries to rape history. So I would want Pashtuns to be strong culturally and linguistically-but just not become too emotional or attached

2) Knowledge of history and culture- Having a better grasp on history gives Luffy and gang a natural advantage which in turn gives these people the ability to best others in debate.

I usually don't comment on the first point because its like a outsider commenting but I have revealed what I feel here. I am aware that I am in many ways a wannabe Pashtun with very few links in reality, a fact serpentine, spineless people like Luffy are very keen to remind me of. But still it is a truth and each ethnic group glorifies its own ethno-fascists. Look at my extended family. Voting for criminal Altaf the monkey for years. What sickens me however is their justification or purposeful obfuscation of Altaf's criminal speech which called partition a blunder.



If Hyperion is a tribal... you do not ask about a Pashtuns, especially a tribal Pashtuns womenfolk...

But ways are changing. I hope @Hyperion is not getting pissed though while I also feel this may divert my attention f4m 2 beeping spots a.k.a b-i-g-o-t-s on my radar.

I would answer your other questions but I will leave them to Hyperion. My personal opinion is that Luffy is right about the fact that:
1) ANP made Pashto compulsory
2) the name was changed to Pakhtunkhwa

Which is good even though my fellow nationalists would abuse it. The issue is not exactly the "ethnic identity existing", its actually the ethnic identity:
1) being considered more important than the Pakistani identity-infact not being inconsequential as it has become in many developed nations.
2) Ethnic identity being directed on anti-pakistani lines. Do note it always starts with we were oppressed, the Punjabis stole our rights. This is why every time an Urdu-speaker starts spouting this rubbish you would have noticed I shut him up because it is actually a symptom of the ethno-fascist mind.

By the way by changing NWFP's name to Pakhtunkhwa another Nationalist party could have won over Pashtuns. But it is a flaw in our thinking. We believe any reference to "ethnicity" even though in Pakistan we are always aware of ethnicity being a big thing, is wrong. We have to accept that ethnicity itself is not an issue.

Its the way we direct it, how we have made it a very important aspect and use it on anti-pakistani lines.

We have to keep our differences aside and come together for betterment and prosperity of our Great Country Pakistan, We have to live in Unity, Urdu is Our national language and everybody should respect, learn and speak it. We need one education System, Our education system is flawed, I studied in Sindhi schools and then in govt. college and degree college, i have also studied abroad half my life, in sindhi text books i was taught about sindhi culture and geography of sindh and taught to respect it but those books never mentioned about punjab balochistan or KPK, so i niether learned them at school nor you try to respect them, thats the worst thing with our education, To educate people about all pakistan we need one education system and provincial schools should teach kids urdu from beginning And teaching their mother tongue and culture and other cultures of pakistan too.

 

[Spring Onion]

Good to know genius, shpeta kalana Pakistan khpal kuna ke owaha, talking to you is like telling my d*** to not erect after watching a 3 star movie!

You are a Pathan nothing else and thank Punjabis and others that named you 'Pathan' after losing your identity and going on full separation from the rest of Pashtuns and joining the land of 'Pure'.

Shpeto kalo na mong the afghanistanayano kunna bach kari da the rosyano aw wass the amreeko na.

da shpeto kalo na mong staso khetay dakay karay dee.

taso dumra naran na yeye chee dwee obasayee.

 

[Sher Malang]

Shpeto kalo na mong the afghanistanayano kunna bach kari da the rosyano aw wass the amreeko na.

da shpeto kalo na mong staso khetay dakay karay dee.

taso dumra naran na yeye chee dwee obasayee.

Haghe ke kho yu feesad shak ham neshta, 47 ra dekhwa taso da angrezano ghulaman patey shawe yaast!

Taso ghonde Punjabi chap Pashtana ghairat mata der sha maloom da.. lag khpal sha o khwa ogora pa de shpeta kaloono ke somra parmakhtag karre da Pashtunkhwa aw Balochistan? taqreeban panzoz na der Al-qaida kasan wazhal shawe di FATA ke karobar kho bikul khatam de, sta Punjabi wrona hara wraz khpal gheen wahi Pashtunkhwa ke, farhang adab aw nor tol Pashtun rasm o rewaj darna hyr shewe di !!

Daal ke khete yawaze staso ghonde punjabi chap Pashtana dakawe shi, UNCHR na har kal sta punjabi hokomat paise akhestaley da Afghanan muhajireen manana oka che da UNCHR paiso sara Pakistan jor sho.

khpal kunna sataley nashe 24/7 drone staso pa sar garzi, bombing, target killing, da waje na da kor bandey wataley nashe aw sta naran mai woleedala che poora company da NATO attack ke mityaaz kare wo aw murdaar sho!!

 

[Dance]

I don't understand why afghans are so obsessed with Punjabis?

 

[sohaib91]

Also more than 70% crimes in KPK are made by Afghan Refugees their,

 

[Spring Onion]

Haghe ke kho yu feesad shak ham neshta, 47 ra dekhwa taso da angrezano ghulaman patey shawe yaast!

staso kuna kho Sikhano hum wahlay day wrora ta pa kuma khula da ghulamay khabaray kaee. Awo the angerzano khabara ma kawa yo angrez wo kana chee sta nomawari badsha warsara duran line lik karay wo.

hope next time before saying so you will look within

Taso ghonde Punjabi chap Pashtana ghairat mata der sha maloom da.. lag khpal sha o khwa ogora pa de shpeta kaloono ke somra parmakhtag karre da Pashtunkhwa aw Balochistan? taqreeban panzoz na der Al-qaida kasan wazhal shawe di FATA ke karobar kho bikul khatam de, sta Punjabi wrona hara wraz khpal gheen wahi Pashtunkhwa ke,

zamong da malk parmakhtag staso kabalyano pa waja zandedalay day. Khpal jang nashae kawalo aur zamong pa oga swara ye. aw sta zaba dera ganda da za tala der sha jawab darkawalay shama kho za maaf me kray dumra narr na ye chee tinga ba ke bia.

aw aye shukar day Pukhtunkhwa dera tarakee karay da. ta da khpal malk fika waka

farhang adab aw nor tol Pashtun rasm o rewaj darna hyr shewe di !!

khpalay zabay ta lag paam waka nu ta taa be pata wala gee chee the farhang adab aw tol pukhu rasmo riwaj sta ghunday kamzoray Afghanistanyano her karay day. Aw da farhang adab aw da pukhto khabaray makawa mong the kabal fariswan culture dair kha ledalay day. Taso kahabray da pukhto kawarr aw khazay mo the farsiwano pa lar rawanay dee . pukhto ye ghurzawalay da.

Daal ke khete yawaze staso ghonde punjabi chap Pashtana dakawe shi, UNCHR na har kal sta punjabi hokomat paise akhestaley da Afghanan muhajireen manana oka che da UNCHR paiso sara Pakistan jor sho.

Za pa pekhawar ke yum aw der kha me the UNCHR paisay takseemawalo hasay ledali dee. Beghairat afghanyan pesay wakhli aur bia wapas ba bala lar Pakistan ta rashee.

khpal kunna sataley nashe 24/7 drone staso pa sar garzi, bombing, target killing, da waje na da kor bandey wataley nashe aw sta naran mai woleedala che poora company da NATO attack ke mityaaz kare wo aw murdaar sho!!

Da daa kabalyano gand day mong ye safa kawaoo taso dumra naran na ye chee jang ba oka.

You beghairata kom ye chee har yo kas darbanday raghalay day ao taso warla lar warkari da. ka dumra narr ye no NATO ta walay sta masharan pa khpo prewatee dee che ma za ma za mong pe mra sho.

 

[Sher Malang]

staso kuna kho Sikhano hum wahlay day wrora ta pa kuma khula da ghulamay khabaray kaee. Awo the angerzano khabara ma kawa yo angrez wo kana chee sta nomawari badsha warsara duran line lik karay wo.

hope next time before saying so you will look within



zamong da malk parmakhtag staso kabalyano pa waja zandedalay day. Khpal jang nashae kawalo aur zamong pa oga swara ye. aw sta zaba dera ganda da za tala der sha jawab darkawalay shama kho za maaf me kray dumra narr na ye chee tinga ba ke bia.

aw aye shukar day Pukhtunkhwa dera tarakee karay da. ta da khpal malk fika waka


khpalay zabay ta lag paam waka nu ta taa be pata wala gee chee the farhang adab aw tol pukhu rasmo riwaj sta ghunday kamzoray Afghanistanyano her karay day. Aw da farhang adab aw da pukhto khabaray makawa mong the kabal fariswan culture dair kha ledalay day. Taso kahabray da pukhto kawarr aw khazay mo the farsiwano pa lar rawanay dee . pukhto ye ghurzawalay da.





Za pa pekhawar ke yum aw der kha me the UNCHR paisay takseemawalo hasay ledali dee. Beghairat afghanyan pesay wakhli aur bia wapas ba bala lar Pakistan ta rashee.



Da daa kabalyano gand day mong ye safa kawaoo taso dumra naran na ye chee jang ba oka.

You beghairata kom ye chee har yo kas darbanday raghalay day ao taso warla lar warkari da. ka dumra narr ye no NATO ta walay sta masharan pa khpo prewatee dee che ma za ma za mong pe mra sho.

dre zal jagra sta neeka kare wo angrezano sara?

sta angrez neeka zakhmi rawana da...

NATO sara mung os etelaf laru aw somra che kawe sho sta punjab pa zid haghoita mrasta kawo, sa kawale shy nar bachai? tit for tat -

wraz pa wraz sta masnoyee mulk da wranedo pa haal ke di figures ta ta sha maloom da

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

I wonder what would be the response of Mr. rahman malik if afghan's say that " the injuries could be because of extreme climate " ..how would those Pakistanies here who denied, justified , applauded for what has been done with our brave soldier captain kalia would respond ?