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Pak Armed Forces Non-Military Projects

Might we change the title of the thread to 'Pak Armed Forces' instead of Pak Army ? It might attract less flack from the haters that way and also represent all the three armed services.
 
@Abu and Gubbi

Abu, well it's guud to see another 'enthusiastic' wasting our bandwidth. As you have rightly pointed out, had Gubbi Sire read through the slides, he wouldnt have asked these questions, but then you know as it has has become our day job to answer ********, i wont mind replying him.
This bandwidth exists to discuss such issues. What was the point of putting up that information if you didnt want any discussion? And as for ******** questions, you got the option of ignoring them. But you took the trouble to answer them, for that I am grateful. You made your 'bones', earned your stars. Good for you. You risked your life for a noble cause, very honorable and noble of you. However, with your condescending behavior and language (this isnt the first time) you will not earn respect where it would matter most.

You might NOT like anyone asking questions, but where I come from, my profession like many others depends on asking questions. Any piece of data/evidence is critically examined, analyzed and questions are asked, no matter how silly they might look. That is what makes the world go round, so to speak. We do not take things at face value. Period. Atleast I've got a healthy interest in topics outside my area of expertise, can the same be said about you? You wouldnt know squat about intracellular signaling pathways, crosstalk, cancer biology, molecular biology etc. Go to any forum discussing these topics (if you understand them or have any interest whatsoever) and ask questions- however silly they might seem. Come to me if anyone, ANYONE, replies in as condescending a manner as yours. So much for respect.
Third, Pakistan dont have any governmental programs like 'U.S. Department of Veterans Affairs' which provide lifetime services to ex-soldiers. So the profits from these milbus is utilized for the welfare of veterans. i have posted a detailed reply regarding this elsewhere, let me see if i can find it.

We cant afford the luxeries like that of the US military, but every country wants that its soldier gets the best equipment to fight with. The sarkari issues web equipment that a Pakistani soldier uses is of old vintage, the steel helmet is heavy and clumsy, the harness yokes are poor, the water bottle and the ammo pouch are more of a burden than being beneficial etc etc.

Moreover, while fighting an insurgency a soldier cant just rely on his rifle, he got to have an extra weapon in case he is captured/the weapon malfunctions (this the indians occupying Kashmir should know more than anybody else). So i being a commander would like that i should have an extra pistol with me when i am at Wana or NWA, i would also like that i should also carry a guud dagger with me. Now i being an officer might afford this and can purchase it out of my pocket, but a soldier might not be able to do this. Being an officer i might also purchase the fiber glass american helmet, a camel back waterbottle, best quality military boots etc, but soldier might not do it.

Now this all cant be made a standard, because one, not the entire Army is fighting insurgency, second changing something costing Rs 1 in an Army of 0.6 million would mean and additional budget of 6 lac!! Which the Nation cant afford. Already i can Pakistani and indian 'enthusiastic' feeling uncomfortable with our military expenditures.

Also, when we are in the field, our armies (Pak and Indian) dont have a very comfortable arrangement for soldiers to rest/sleep/accommodate etc. Pakistani Nation cant afford (like the US military) to provide every officer with a fan or heater in the field.

You know what is the standard issue for a commode in Asian militaries? i am sure no one would be knowing. It's a fringing stainless steel pot, the shape and size of your standard flower pot, fitted inside a wooden board. You lay it down, park your royal a$$ on it, align your a$$hole with the opening of that pot and then try to defecate. Atleast i had to place me undivided attention to make sure only one thing during the process, and that was, keeping my buttocks aligned with the pot to avoid any spill overs, and i hated it!

When i grew up to a rank where i could influence deceision making in the Army, i tried my level best to get the bosses to replace this 'machinery' with a standard water closet/commode, and guess what, when we calculated the cost of replacement, it came down to millions of rupee each year keeping in view the wear and tear and to make the commode platform mobile (so that it can be taken into the field). The end result, we were stuck with the same flower pot!

So what we do, military pumps in money (audited ofcourse) to the formations/units engaged in active fighting and let them purchase (or purchase it itself) items that can let a soldier perform better.

For example, units fighting in Swat, Wana, FATA were issued with knives and daggers. Their steel helmets were replaced with guud quality fiber glass helmets (for the record, you can purchase 10 Pakistani steel helmets in the cost of 1 american helmet), we changed their canteens/mess tins, we bought them better quality water bottles, we converted most of the standard toyota double cabins into bullet proof vehicles by doing local modification, all funded through the income from these adventures.

This led to following pros;

No effect on the budget

The items were issued as a one (may be two) time measure, without becoming a standard issue, thus reducing the burden on Ordinance and Supply Corps, and as the items were mostly purchased locally (from the local city), the Nation didnt has to bear the cost of contractors, transportation, stocking etc. MinDef was in the knowledge so we had nothing to worry about.

Items purchased by the units itself, thus making the units understand that these items are a luxury and if they are going to screw with them, they wont be getting any more of them i.e. they'll back with the old equipment, so they took better care of the items, thus increasing the shelf life of these items. Also the same items were passed onto the other unit that was replacing the previous one during an operation.

Now this is just one example. And only a portion of income was used. The major chunk of the income is utilized by the company itself for the welfare purposes, like free medical for soldiers, cost effective education for their children, assistance to Shaheeds etc. The remainder of the income is kept by the company like any other private civilian enterprise would do. What to you think Microsoft or Pepsi does with its income after they have serviced their debts and paid the employees?

And oh yes, these enterprises DO NOT pay the Army ANYTHING, as they are independent of the military. So these DOES NOT enhance the defence budget nor does it goes into the pockets of generals or adds up to the salaries of soldiers. They just has the term Fauji attached to them, nothing more. Only at occasions (as mentioned above), non essential equipment might be procured through the welfare funds (by cutting down the actual welfare budget).

So in short, these institutes ONLY provide benefits to the Nation and the country, help accommodate retirees (as mentioned in slide no 23, post # 6), assist the national economy through production and taxes (these organizations are the highest tax payers of Pakistan), and stand as a symbol of hard work, dedication and success to organizations like PIA, Pak Rail, WAPDA, Pak Steel etc that if we can make Rs 10 by investing Rs 1, they too could have earned even more had they not been sleeping, nibbling on their funds and embezzling every last penny that they receive.
Thank you for that excellent and detailed reply. I agree that every professional armed force should have something on the lines of US's Dept of Veteran Affairs. They do an excellent job.
My only 'concern' was that a security establishment operating commercial ventures. But your explanation that the Pak civilian govt never set up such an apparatus explains and partially justifies the need for PA to venture into such areas. I am still NOT a big fan of an army operating commercial ventures when it relies heavily on tax money for its daily operations. But you got a point, so I concede that to you.
And the....
Last word; Grow Up!
Humility is a major part of growing up. Where is yours?
 
This bandwidth exists to discuss such issues. What was the point of putting up that information if you didnt want any discussion? And as for ******** questions, you got the option of ignoring them. But you took the trouble to answer them, for that I am grateful. You made your 'bones', earned your stars. Good for you. You risked your life for a noble cause, very honorable and noble of you. However, with your condescending behavior and language (this isnt the first time) you will not earn respect where it would matter most.

You might NOT like anyone asking questions, but where I come from, my profession like many others depends on asking questions. Any piece of data/evidence is critically examined, analyzed and questions are asked, no matter how silly they might look. That is what makes the world go round, so to speak. We do not take things at face value. Period. Atleast I've got a healthy interest in topics outside my area of expertise, can the same be said about you? You wouldnt know squat about intracellular signaling pathways, crosstalk, cancer biology, molecular biology etc. Go to any forum discussing these topics (if you understand them or have any interest whatsoever) and ask questions- however silly they might seem. Come to me if anyone, ANYONE, replies in as condescending a manner as yours. So much for respect.

Thank you for that excellent and detailed reply. I agree that every professional armed force should have something on the lines of US's Dept of Veteran Affairs. They do an excellent job.
My only 'concern' was that a security establishment operating commercial ventures. But your explanation that the Pak civilian govt never set up such an apparatus explains and partially justifies the need for PA to venture into such areas. I am still NOT a big fan of an army operating commercial ventures when it relies heavily on tax money for its daily operations. But you got a point, so I concede that to you.

Humility is a major part of growing up. Where is yours?
Great! Now cry a river for me.

The day you guys would start asking 'pertinent' questions, you would start getting a better response. Is it so difficult to understand?

Lastly, i didnt ignore your post rather saw to it, not because your questions were so genuine, but because we cant let people like you to run amok asking obvious questions (whose answers have now become a writing on the wall, because they have been discussed SO MANY TIMES on PDF) just for the sake of it.
 
Introduction
The Pakistan Armed Forces have established a number of organizations for running industrial and commercial enterprises. These organizations provide employment for ex-servicemen, besides creating job opportunities for others. These organizations include Army Welfare Trust (AWT), Fauji Foundation and Shaheen Foundation.




Army Welfare
Industrial Enterprises
Army Welfare Trust industrial sector enterprises are:

Army Welfare Sugar Mil (Badin)
Annual sugar production average around 45,000 tons.
Army Welfare Cement Plant (Nizampur)
The plant has a capacity of producing 2,000 tons per day.
Askari Cement Factory (Wah)
Total assets of this plant exceed Rs. 7 billion. It is the first cement plant to be awarded ISO-9002 certification. It has a capacity of producing 1 million tons per annum.
Army Welfare Woolen Mills
The plant has an average daily capacity of producing 2,000 kg of yarn.
Army Welfare Pharmaceutical Project
The plant is currently manufacturing basic analgesic drugs. The production of formulated medicines is also planned at a later stage
Mobil Askari Lubricants Limited
A joint venture with Mobil Corporation USA for lubricant blending is located at Hub.



Financial /Services Enterprises
Presently the Trust is running following projects:

Askari Commercial Bank Limited.
Askari Commercial Bank was incorporated on 9 October 1991. The initial public offering of Rs. 120 million was over subscribed 16 times. Presently, it has 28 branches located in the country. It was also declared “the Best Domestic Bank in Pakistan” by Euro money Magazine in 1994 and by Asia Money Magazine in 1996.
Askari Leasing Limited
Its investment portfolio is over Rs. 3.5 billion. It has achieved status of the top leasing company of Pakistan in terms of business and assets holding. “ASKAR”, an auto leasing scheme, has received a highly encouraging response.
Askari General Insurance Company Limited
Askari General Insurance Company is still a developing organization, with bright prospects.
Army Welfare Trust Housing Schemes
Has started housing schemes in Lahore, Peshawar and Islamabad.





Fauji Foundation
Industrial Sector
Fully owned Projects Nos Production
Sugar Mills 3 12,300 Metric Tons / Day
Experimental 1 2,500 cres Seeds Multiplication Farm
Fauji Cereal/Corn 2 200 Metric Tons/Day Complex
Fauji Polypropylene 1 20 Million bags per Project annum.
Foundation Gas 1 350,000 Domestic & Project
85,000 Commercial consumers



Public Limited Companies


Fauji Fertilizer Company Limited – Goth Machhi
The total capacity of the plant is 1.33 million metric ton per year.
Mari Gas Company Limited – Rawalpindi
Supplies gas to Fauji Fertilizer Company, Pak Saudi Fertilizer Company, Engro Chemicals and WAPDA.
Fauji Oil Terminal – Port Qasim Karachi
The terminal has the handling capacity of 9 million tons of heavy furnace oil per annum.
Fauji Cement Company Ltd
The plant has the capacity of 3,000 Metric tons per day.
157 MW Kabirwala Power Plant
The total cost of the plant in US$ 170 million. The plant is designed to generate 150 MW electricity.
Di-Ammonia Phosphate Plant
The plant has been set up at Port Qasim at a cost US$ 370 million.



Social Sector
Fauji Foundation is supporting a large number of welfare projects where free medical care, subsidized quality education and free technical training to over 8 million ex servicemen and their dependants is provided. These are:

Medical
Over 28 million patients have been treated since inception of this project in mid fifties. Present state of its facilities is:
Hospitals 12 (1479 beds)
Health Centre
24
Mobile Dispensaries
41
Static Dispensaries
24
Artificial Limbs Centres 2
Technical Training
Technical Training Centre 66
Technical Training Centre 9
 
http://www.pildat.org/Publications/...owerofmilitary-challengesandthewayforward.pdf

Commercial Concerns of Militaries - A Brief Comparison


Involvement of commercial and business activity is not unique to Pakistan. Several countries of Central and Latin America have developed vast commercial empires. Foremost among these countries are Honduras, Ecuador, and Peru. Involvement of the South American armed forces in commercial and economic activity is essentially due to the legacy of military rule in the region.
The Chinese Peoples Liberation Army (PLA) has established several commercial and industrial enterprises in diverse areas that are a major source of income. Apparently, the PLA has nearly 10,000 companies under its control ranging from industrial units, farmlands, investment companies, electronics, engineering, automobile units, etc.

Estimates of the PLA commercial earnings vary between US $ 20-30 billion. The Chinese Army has been utilised for building roads, laying communication networks. The Chinese Armed Forces have to balance their priorities between competing demands of professionalism, commercial interests and political influence. As commercial interests increase, the communist party's influence on the military weakens. Recent emphasis in China is more on professionalism and the military is gradually disinvesting itself from commercial activities. Vietnam military too has a vast network of commercial and business ventures.

Indonesian military has been deeply involved in business and commercial activity. According to estimates it has 200 commercial enterprises and about 1500 businesses. When Dr. Susilo Yudhayono took office of President in 2004, reform of the military was undertaken. In light of the mounting criticism of Indonesian military's corrupt practices, the Indonesian Parliament passed a law in 2004 banning military commercialism and committing government to take over or divest all military business by 2009. However, due to growing pressure from the military the reform effort has received a set back and it is not certain if the reform effort will succeed.
The Turkish Armed Forces have large holdings in defence manufacturing, automotive plants, aviation, cement, agro products and chemical industries.

The rationale for some armies to indulge in business is because their governments are unable to support their short and long term needs and they use these funds for buying weapons and equipment or meeting administrative expenses. The Indonesian military, for example, heavily depends (up to 70%) on commercial undertakings to supplement the meagre defence budget. For most armies including the Pakistan Army the profits of these business ventures is meant to support welfare and well being of their serving and retired military personnel and their families.
Interest of militaries in business and economic activity decreases as the country's economy improves. For this reason we find that developed countries have hardly any involvement in commercial enterprises.
 
China, Turkey, Indonesia, Nigeria, Bangladesh are some of the other militaries that have non-military programs.
 
An old but very interesting article. Thought people might find it interesting:

Pakistani army's '$20bn' business

1_230145_1_9.jpg


The army is considered by many Pakistanis as one of the country's only functioning
institutions but its influence over the economy is a cause for concern [GALLO/GETTY]

As legislators in Pakistan go to the polls against a backdrop of political protests and religious militancy, a recent book on the Pakistani military has thrown light on the army's role in private enterprise.

The Pakistani military's "welfare foundations" run thousands of businesses worth tens of billions of dollars, ranging from street-corner petrol pumps to sprawling industrial plants, says Ayesha Siddiqa, the author of Military Inc: Inside Pakistan's Military Economy.

And Siddiqa told Al Jazeera that whoever emerges as the eventual winner following Saturday's presidential election, they are unlikely to tame the economic power of the military.

"These politicians continue to negotiate with the military and despite populist politics, and calls for civilian rule, they are still inclined to strengthen the military."

The main street of any Pakistani town bears testament to the economic power of the military, with army-owned bakeries, banks, insurance companies and universities, usually fronted by civilian employees.

Retired military personnel are often involved in the army's business ventures, and according to Siddiqa, this reflects a similar pattern found in the Turkish and Chinese militaries.

"Pakistan, however, displays more of an indirect exploitation through the retired personnel. They act as primary conduits for the covert use of the country's resources," she said.

Double standards

Siddiqa says the military's private wealth could be as high $20bn, a "rough figure", she says, split between $10bn in land and $10 in private military assets.

She also estimates that the military controls one-third of all heavy manufacturing in the country and up to seven per cent of Pakistani private assets.

The author told Al Jazeera that the naming of the new army chief, and a power-sharing deal between Pervez Musharraf and Benazir Bhutto, is another attempt to maintain the army's control in politics.

Bhutto herself had supported a number of the military's business ventures.

A number of projects by the welfare foundations were sanctioned under her government.

"None of the political governments raised any major objections to the military-business complex during the 1990s," Siddiqa said.

Ventures 'needed'

Discussion of the military's role in Pakistani society has provoked strong reactions, with many military officials refusing to speak to Al Jazeera about the issue.

But Talat Hussain, a retired general, told Al Jazeera that discussion of the military's role in private enterprise was considered taboo.

"This area has always been considered a sacred cow in our society".

According to government figures, welfare foundations, or 'pensions funds' for retired personnel, invest in over $10bn in commercial ventures including oil and gas exploration, sugar mills, security and employment services.

Last year, the commercial operations of the Fauji (Soldier) Foundation accrued at least $500 million.

However, Syed Arif Hasan, the managing director of the Fauji Foundation, believes there is nothing wrong with the army's commercial interests.

He said: "It is vital that we invest in the commercial sector. These businesses generate the welfare schemes for hundreds of thousands of retired soldiers and officers."

"There are very little options, and it also benefits the country's economy."

Asked if there was a conflict of interest in the army's penetration into society, he denied Siddiqa's claim that political control is a factor.

"We have no intention to politicise welfare organisations," he said.

According to their website, the Fauji Foundation provides welfare services to around 9.6 million people, seven per cent of Pakistan's population.

Fauji labels itself a 'welfare-cum-industrial' group, and is dependent on industrial operations to maintain their services, as approximately 80 per cent of Fauji's profits are obtained through investment.

No apologies

The military boasts that it can run such organisations better than what they view as "incompetent and corrupt civilians".

In a speech in 2004, to open a new business owned by the Fauji Foundation, Musharraf boasted of "exceptional" military-owned banks, cement and fertiliser plants.

"Why is anyone jealous if the retired military officers... are doing a good job contributing to the economy?" he said.

Siddiqa fears that her book may step on some powerful toes. "Over the past three years a lot of my friends have advised me not to publish this book. They think I have suicidal tendencies."


Pakistani army's '$20bn' business - Pakistan Power and politics - Al Jazeera English
 
you've been on the forum long enough to know that this 'article' has been posted several times already. . .

good chunk of it has either been debunked or ridiculed already; in fact, it doesnt even make much sense to label Ms. Siddiqui as exactly the most 'unbiased' or 'objective' force

i have her book on my shelf (bottom row, near the dust and old cigarette ash) and even highlighted entire sections that are factually incorrect, or based on very old information.

of course it satisfies and alleviates the certain incurable mental complexes and retard agenda of certain nearby countries as well as a few western arm-chair analysts (thickheads) in civilian garb who wouldnt even know the FIRST thing about military or military service....most certainly, these Pakistan-centric 'enthusiastics' conveniently forget that there are SCORES of militaries out there that are involved in commercial ventures (not limited to just def. production) that ALSO enjoy STATE benefits not afforded to "regular" civilians


and i already high-lighted this last week to some clueless hindustanis --who since then have failed to come up with an answer or even a retort
 
The armed forces and Balochis’ uplift


By: S M Hali | February 15, 2012


Despite being the richest in mineral resources and having a 750 kilometre coastline, offering tranquil beaches and abundance of marine life, Balochistan is the most neglected province of Pakistan. Successive governments have not only left the Balochis in gross neglect, but also plundered its riches, leaving the inhabitants in a shabby and decrepit condition.

Besides the federal government, the provincial governments of Balochistan and the feudal lords have been complicit in this criminal abandon. In the decade 2000 onwards, various development projects were launched to reduce the plight of Balochis, but it seems to be a case of too little, too late. Decisions that should have been taken in the seventies and eighties are being taken now, which has done little to alleviate the misery of people. Resultantly, the Balochis have been exploited to fuel insurgency and strife. Most of their grievances are genuine, but taking up arms was not the right action.

In the near past, the armed forces of Pakistan have taken up the cudgels for the uplift of the Balochis. The main areas of concern have been education, health and means of livelihood to wean away the disgruntled elements into lives of normalcy. Both the army and the navy have spearheaded projects to induct Baloch youth into their services, as well as set up educational and medical institutions.

As regards recruitment in the armed forces, there have been adequate vacancies. But a small number of Baloch youth have come forward to join this profession, mainly because of illiteracy and ignorance. Resultantly, their representation in the armed forces has been less as compared to the youth from other provinces. In order to create awareness among them about the military, and subsequently choosing it as their profession, over the past few years, the armed forces have started a massive awareness campaign and concession package all over the province.

Consequently, the army’s campaign met with overwhelming successes. Thousands of Baloch youth appeared for recruitment in various army selection and recruitment centres. About 4,000 Balochi recruits of this massive campaign completed their basic training on October 29, 2010, and joined various units of the Pak Army. The induction of these soldiers in large numbers is a major milestone and historical occasion for their families and the province. Additionally, 10,000 youths - still undergoing basic military training in various institutions - are likely to join the prestigious service in the near future.

Likewise, Pakistan Navy (PN) has launched the “N” Cadet scheme. The Baloch youth are being inducted in different cadet colleges through a sponsorship system in which they will be able to join the navy after completion of their studies. In a fast-track scheme, they are being taken directly into the PN as officers without undergoing the rigours of the Inter Services Selection Board (ISSB). Two years after commissioning, they will have to undergo the selection process by ISSB, and by that time they will be better equipped to pass the tests. Similar schemes are being undertaken for induction into the PN’s other ranks. Different branches of Bahria schools and colleges are being set up in the province, while simultaneously local schools are being sponsored by the navy where books, furniture, sports equipment and development funds are being provided.

On its part, local army units have been assigned by the COAS to arrange educational classes for the children of poor people, who cannot afford the heavy expenses of imparting even basic education. Their boarding, lodging and tuition fee is borne by the Pak Army from its own resources. The army’s contributions in the progress of Balochistan, including Chamalang Education Programme, Sui Education City, and Gwadar Institutes of Technical Education, are remarkable. Measures have been taken to sustain these projects, which are contributing positively towards better education and creation of jobs for common people, particularly in its remote areas.

Moreover, the health sector has received no less attention. Both the army and navy have set up medical centres and hospitals, where the Balochis not only receive free treatment, but also medicines. The navy’s Darman Jah Hospital at Ormara with a 100-bed facility and state-of-the-art medical equipment is a matter of pride for Pakistan. Additionally, serious patients are transferred to major hospitals in Karachi and other metropolitan centres if required. These facilities also provide equal employment opportunities to Baloch boys and girls. Indeed, the contribution of the armed forces in bringing the Baloch youth into the mainstream through their induction process is commendable.

The writer is a political and defence analyst.

Email: sultanm.hali@gmail.com
 
The armed forces and Balochis’ uplift


By: S M Hali | February 15, 2012


Despite being the richest in mineral resources and having a 750 kilometre coastline, offering tranquil beaches and abundance of marine life, Balochistan is the most neglected province of Pakistan. Successive governments have not only left the Balochis in gross neglect, but also plundered its riches, leaving the inhabitants in a shabby and decrepit condition.

Besides the federal government, the provincial governments of Balochistan and the feudal lords have been complicit in this criminal abandon. In the decade 2000 onwards, various development projects were launched to reduce the plight of Balochis, but it seems to be a case of too little, too late. Decisions that should have been taken in the seventies and eighties are being taken now, which has done little to alleviate the misery of people. Resultantly, the Balochis have been exploited to fuel insurgency and strife. Most of their grievances are genuine, but taking up arms was not the right action.

In the near past, the armed forces of Pakistan have taken up the cudgels for the uplift of the Balochis. The main areas of concern have been education, health and means of livelihood to wean away the disgruntled elements into lives of normalcy. Both the army and the navy have spearheaded projects to induct Baloch youth into their services, as well as set up educational and medical institutions.

As regards recruitment in the armed forces, there have been adequate vacancies.

This article is spreading the same myths that have resulted in the lack of development in Balochistan.

1. Army recruitment:

Army is highly professional job. At grunt level it can be hell if you are not motivated to take cr@p from seniors and officers. Therefore it should never be used as affirmative action institute. Even in Punjab army jawans only come from specific regions and it has been going on for centuries.

If Balochis do not join army, then don't force them. There should be plenty of other opportunities in other areas.


2. Business and development

Balochistan lacks human capital, therefore they have to import experts from other areas and particularly from Punjab and Karachi. Unfortunately people from these areas do not find Balochistan as welcoming place.

So Baloch are destined to be in impoverished state for a time to come. Sadly.

Pakistani system has given Blochis much better deal than what they are getting from our "brotherly" neighbor Iran. I'll not go into detail because it fills my heart with tears and anger as how Iranian hang Balochis with cranes in open public as a punishment.

bottom line: It is upto Balochis to create pro-development environment even at the cost of initially losing some opportunities to people from other provinces.


peace
 

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