PAF Should Go For The F 35---A Coupe De Grace

[melb4aust]

The US thinks strategically first and foremost, a lost order with India isn't much of a big deal to them. There will be strings i.e. use of the aircraft, Chinese involvement etc.

And there will be no aircraft at all. The aircraft itself is not ready and members have started dreaming through their wish lists. The air force whose chief admittedly said couple of years back, that they cannot handle Gripen's technology let alone how will they absorb to technology as sensitive as of F-35's.

Many of you members have time to speculate whatever, but I wont be wasting my time over unrealistic dreams or scenarios.

 

[Blue Marlin]

The US thinks strategically first and foremost, a lost order with India isn't much of a big deal to them. There will be strings i.e. use of the aircraft, Chinese involvement etc.

about 6 years ago i would agree with you. but now? no. thd blk52 have a lot of strings. you cant even take them out of the country without US approval.
but a little bit of high tech deals is good. as india turns away from russia and to the west as they call it and the west wants the influence in pakistan then that sort of leaves india in the middle and out of a good defence partner(russia)

 

[AZADPAKISTAN2009]

Why gripes when we already having JF 17s ?

Well I proposed

• JF-17 Thunders - 150 Units (Chinese AESA, HUD Helmets are few years away)
  
• F16 C/D - 150 Units, we presently do not have AESA for F16

• Sukhoi for Coastal Defence : 50 Units , this is all and all muscle plane (Awesome radar coverage), would help retire 1970's Mirage planes (NAVY)

• Gripens to replace our F-7PG : 50 Units would be ideal to work closely with Saab Erie Eye and the data share between planes the concept is demonstrated in Saab Video

Why Gripens , what is the case for Gripens ? (Next Generation - NG)

Technologically these would be major upgrade to the F-7PG and give us western AESA radar and avionics to compare.

a) We have Saab Erie Eye system, integration would be easy, and comes with AESA radar (Western) .
b) The new units have large display Avionics
c) Cobra Helmets are also available in Gripens

Newer Avionics package

 

[HAIDER]

I'd prefer the F-35 over the SU-35, but with the closeness to China this may not be possible. However I read an article from an American military analyst who said that the Russian offer could prompt the US to offer far more advanced weapons i.e. to keep Pakistan within its sphere.

Russia need money, since oil price hit rock bottom. They will soon sell everything to everyone. Not just Pakistan.

 

[MastanKhan]

Strange. It's just like having F16s in 80s which we eventually did yet topic starter heavily criticised its procurement till date.

Hi,

If the procurement would have gone to the M2K when it became available---it would have been a paradigm shift---.

You need to understand that the issue was strategic and not against the potency of the F16----. If that is what your approach is towards that debate---then you have a sorry state of understanding of the issue discussed.

 

[Peaceful Civilian]

Russia need money, since oil price hit rock bottom. They will soon sell everything to everyone. Not just Pakistan.

India has multi billion projects with Russia. but What we have to offer for Russia which is enough to deny india concerns?. Are you living in delusion as other Pakistani, ì.e Russia will give more advance weaponry than India in Stock? Keep dreaming. Good for health.
Are you perceiving their weaponary as sanction free?
Then we are doomed in war times.
Get a life dude!

 

[MastanKhan]

And there will be no aircraft at all. The aircraft itself is not ready and members have started dreaming through their wish lists. The air force whose chief admittedly said couple of years back, that they cannot handle Gripen's technology let alone how will they absorb to technology as sensitive as of F-35's.

Many of you members have time to speculate whatever, but I wont be wasting my time over unrealistic dreams or scenarios.

Hi,

Well---the Air marshal himself claimed to look into the 5th gen aircraft from east and from west-----just a few days ago---.

As for the Grippen----I look back at that statement---and now I believe that was misleading. That statement was made to pave the way for the JF 17----. The Blk52 is as much technically advanced or more so than the grippen at that time.

What everything leads me to believe is that every procurement was sabotaged because the air force wanted to build the JF 17 and anything that came in its way would be negated---like making claims of no funds---it does not meet our criteria---it is technically too advanced.

Basically---the JF17 with BVR capability is as advanced as the Grippen that they were looking at that time. With the naval strike package included---the JF17 is more advanced than that Grippen----. The new grippen NG----with aesa----the JF 17 with aesa will be tactically stronger because again it has that naval strike package.

So---basically in itself---there is no other new single engine aircraft that could come closer to the total overall package
of the JF 17---without aesa and with aesa.

So---in the end----we are 5---7 years behind in time and a 50 to a 100 aircraft short of target at this time.

 

[Last Samuri]

Mastan.

What you want PAF to get is GREAT AND FINE
What PAF needs now and in near future to effect war on india is ALSO FINE.

but after rubbing eyes AND sitting and thinking sensibly & realistically

HAVING ACCOUNTED FOR

1. Cost of purchase
2. Life time and annual Operational cost
3. Sanction and spares issues
4. Usa previous record with Pakistan
5. Russia treatment of india and cost escalation issues eg Gorskhov carrier example spares for MKI
6. Timescales and delivery OF f35
7. Huge cost of rafale ie $200 million each


I ASK AGAIN ARE PAF NOT DOING ALL THEY REALISTCALLY CAN

 

[saadee]

Bhai patani ki tayari to puri hai but afsos
Pakistan military band enthralls Moscow

Web check kaar lay. Kissi sight paar yeh mention nahi kiya Kay Pakistan nay offer daali hai. Russians claim kaar rahay hain.

Bhai patani ki tayari to puri hai but afsos
Pakistan military band enthralls Moscow

Aik band Kay janay paar su35 key deal finalize ho ja ay gee aqal Kay andhay. Russia khud chahta hai Pakistan say achay relations. Kiss nay kaha tha Russia say bhagawat karoo?

 

[MastanKhan]

Mastan.
I ASK AGAIN ARE PAF NOT DOING ALL THEY REALISTCALLY CAN

Hi,

All they are full of is are excuses.

 

[VelocuR]

Pakistan need to experiment new Su-35, let's go for it.

I think, if Mi-35 or some projects with Russia are successful, yes it is possible Su-35 is coming to Pakistan.

Huge Beast

 

[wiseone2]

Hi,

After much thought and deliberation---I have come to the conclusion that PAF should change gears in mid stream and go for a 2 Sqdrn strength of the F 35 initially.

They should drop the idea for the SU35 or the J11D and go for the JH7B with the upgraded engine and aesa radar.

But the key over here is the F35----. With the procurement of this aircraft---it can bring some balance to the fire fight and have some strength at its disposal to maintain and manage an aggressive and a defensive power stance---.

This is an unconventional approach to the problem at hand---. Go for the 5th gen aircraft first and then go back to the 4--- 4.5 gen aircraft---.

It will also give it enough time to develop the JF 17 blk 3 as well.

There are a couple of things that have changed-----. @Zarvan brought my attention to a thread started by Usama---I believe---regarding the F15 Silent eagle----with a new configuration of 16 BVR missiles on the wings and underbody with conformal fuel tanks designed by Boeing believe.

The F 15 would be guided by the F22 and the F 35 towards the target---the same can be done with the JF 17's. If it can be designed to carry 6 BVR missiles---then you have taken care of some of the problems facing the air defense of the country.

By going for the F 35---you are going to take the initiative away from the enemy. If it was me----I would rather have 2 sqdrn's of F35's than 4 sqdrn's of J11d's or SU35's.

You guys are being upset at why this change in game plan----why d I keep bringing different scenarios-----. I guess you people might come across some news in the near or distant future.

So---til then--- I am not going to say anything else---. Just wanted to let you guys know---if India was a litte more aggressive last year---the deal for the J10B's was done----.

To those who are roaming around the air force bases----please look for 2 of them------.

do you expect the American taxpayers to foot the bill ?

 

[MastanKhan]

do you expect the American taxpayers to foot the bill ?

They don't foot any bill on any new item that we chose.

 

[wiseone2]

They don't foot any bill on any new item that we chose.

your f-16 fleet is courtesy of their taxpayers

 

[MastanKhan]

your f-16 fleet is courtesy of their taxpayers

They are all paid in cash my boy-----not from their tax payers----how did you get to that.