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PAF & Rafale Story Will Not Go Away !

I'm aware. And that is a negative on the individual who may have inspected and studied the Rafale. Nobody from PAF has been allowed to attend a course like that.
:lol: do you REALLY think senior level engineers who has mastered everything from the engines to the weapon systems and avionics of F16s, JFTs, saudi F15s & numerous Chinese 4th generation fighters need to take "courses" of any sort on the rafales? keep gobbling up the churan the frenchies have fed you. will love to see the look on your face when an indian rafale pilot is standing in front of us like this:
ENO5_P1U4AAvS0n.jpeg.jpg
 
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:lol: do you REALLY think senior level engineers who has mastered everything from the engines to the weapon systems and avionics of F16s, JFTs, saudi F15s & numerous Chinese 4th generation fighters need to take "courses" of any sort on the rafales? keep gobbling up the churan the frenchies have fed you. will love to see the look on your face when an indian rafale pilot is standing in front of us like this:
View attachment 662490
A Rafale pilot may very well be standing like this without any PAF pilot flying it or an engineer taking it apart.

Those events are not mutually dependent
 
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:lol: do you REALLY think senior level engineers who has mastered everything from the engines to the weapon systems and avionics of F16s, JFTs, saudi F15s & numerous Chinese 4th generation fighters need to take "courses" of any sort on the rafales? keep gobbling up the churan the frenchies have fed you. will love to see the look on your face when an indian rafale pilot is standing in front of us like this:
View attachment 662490
Yes they do. I am an aerospace engineer. Knowing tactics against an aircraft is a pilot's perspective. But learning about an aircraft hands-on is not possible without having full access and under taking an accelerated course in understanding the full use of the aircraft's operations and capabilities. And please don't talk to me in that manner, seen my old man fly up against anything that would intrude Pak airspace for good 20 years, heard enough from him and in my years of work to not underestimate anyone for anything especially the ones against you. Ending it there.

Cheers !!!
 
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Rafale’s Impact on IAF’s Air Power Capabilities
September 10, 2020





Air Cdre Kaiser Tufail (Retd)

Quite clearly, the inadequacy of IAF’s Su-30MKI and MiG-29 twin-engine fighters in the air superiority role led to the decision to acquire the Rafale, ostensibly a more modern and capable multi-role fighter. While both Russian fighters are highly maneuverable in a visual dogfight, as evidenced in several IAF exercises with RAF Typhoons and USAF F-15s and F-16s, they seem to have shortcomings in network-centric, Beyond Visual Range (BVR) combat. This was noticed during the 27 February 2019 skirmish with PAF F-16s, when a pair of Su-30s failed to establish data link and were of no mutual support to each other. The capabilities of the much-touted N011M ‘Bars’ airborne intercept radar are also suspect as the patrolling Su-30s were unable to launch even a single radar-guided R-77 BVR missiles against two dozen PAF fighters milling in the area on 27 February. While a definitive conclusion about the shortcomings of the Su-30 fire-control radar and missiles cannot be made on the basis of a single engagement, it is clear that they are not at par with the PAF F-16/AMRAAM combo. The IAF was aware of these limitations of the Russian fighters, which is why it had initiated measures for the acquisition of Western multi-role combat aircraft instead of more Su-30s, as far back as 2012.

IAF’s choice fell on the French Rafale, which is, indeed, a formidable multi-role fighter with long range and endurance, along with a sizeable payload in the class of the Su-30, areas that single-engine fighters like the F-16A/B and JF-17 cannot compete in. With a powerful radar and the long-range, radar-guided Meteor BVR missile, it comes at a cost of $120 million apiece. Dollar for dollar, PAF can acquire four JF-17 Blk-III for the cost of one Rafale, thus more than offsetting the latter’s payload capabilities, at least. The range of the Rafale’s Meteor missile claimed by the manufacturer (MBDA) to be 100+ km led the Indian Prime Minister to ruefully state that, “if we had the Rafale, results would have been different [on 27 February].”

Mr. Modi has apparently not yet been briefed by his Air Staff about the JF-17’s upcoming PL-15 BVR missile guided by the new AESA radar, which beats the Rafale’s ramjet-powered Meteor by several tens of kilometers. It is manifest that long range BVR combat will take precedence over close combat in any future conflict, and enemy aircraft will be shot out of the skies while remaining well inside their own territory.

While we are at it, it may be worthwhile to have a cursory line comparison of the Rafale, F-16A and JF-17 in one-on-one visual air combat.

All three aircraft have a ‘clean’ configuration Thrust-to-Weight Ratio of 1:1 and can climb and accelerate equally well. In a turning fight, Aspect Ratio and Wing Loading are critical parameters. The JF-17 and F-16A enjoy better Aspect Ratios of 3.7 each, compared to the Rafale which stands at 2.6. A better Aspect Ratio (square of wing span to wing area) implies better aerodynamic efficiency due to less induced drag during turning. As for Wing Loading, or the weight of the aircraft per unit area, the lesser the better. The Rafale has a slight edge, having 68 lbs/sq ft compared to the JF-17 and F-16A, both of which have Wing Loadings of 77 lbs/sq ft. A lightly loaded wing helps in a tighter turn, though in case of the Rafale, this advantage is overcome by greater induced drag due its lower Aspect Ratio. In sum, all three fighters are at par, more or less, in a turning fight.

Induction of the Rafale in IAF has created considerable media interest, and the impression has been created that with immediate effect, IAF will rule the Indian skies. It must, however, be remembered that it will be at least two years before the Rafale achieves anything close to Full Operational Capability. PAF, on the other hand, has been flying F-16s for 37 years, including hot scenarios during the Afghan War, in local counter-insurgency operations, and the latest Operation ‘Swift Retort,’ downing half a dozen enemy fighters in these operations. The JF-17 has been fully operational for over a decade, and is expected to replace the legacy fighters over the next five years. These combat-proven PAF fighters are fully integrated with the air defence system, and are mutually data-linked, alongside all AEW and ground sensors. Such capabilities are not achieved overnight, and it will be several years before the Rafales can be considered a threat in any real sense.

Any immediate impact of the Rafale on IAF’s air power capabilities is, thus, simply over-hyped. This inference, however, must not be dealt with lightly, as there is a distinct possibility of the Indian Prime Minister using the Rafale for a false-flag operation in a surreptitious manner, to prove his point that, “with the Rafale, the results would have been different,” from those of 27 February 2019.

Air Cdre Kaiser Tufail (Retired) is a former fighter pilot and a writer on military affairs.

http://pakistanpolitico.com/rafales...IMUQOEhbm0jGZl2xs8U7qulMYFNDq0hnUDlDLkundlfR8
 
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Did Pakistani pilots train on Qatar’s Rafale fighter jets which presents a major security breach for the Indian Air Force? Even though France has denied the reports, but Pakistan and Qatar share healthy defence relations and it is quite possible that Pakistan did get access to the French Rafales, according to experts.

Given the state of ongoing tension between Qatar and its neighbours, these Pakistani pilots will also possibly have the opportunity to size up the Rafale against the F-16 of the UAE’s air force. Tellingly, this F-16 versus Rafale combo is exactly the combat scenario on the India-Pakistan front as well. So, while the EW systems won’t be compromised, the Rafale’s capabilities will become known to the Pakistan Air Force.

The French ambassador to India has now dismissed the report that Pakistan pilots flew the Rafale as “fake news”. He has, however, not provided any further clarifications as to what exactly is fake about the report. After all, why would a disinterested reporter, clearly working off an official Qatari and Dassault Aviation briefing in February, well before the current India-Pakistan tensions, simply drag ‘Pakistani pilots’ into his story?

The truth is easy to corroborate, all the ambassador needs to do now is show us the CCTV footage of the pilots involved in training, passports and the training logbooks. Yet, these reports are not new. We have a report from as early as 2016 stating that Qatar would send Pakistani pilots to train in Paris. Merely stating “this is fake news” is not going to fly as supplementary details have to be provided.

https://eurasiantimes.com/did-pakistani-pilots-really-train-on-qatars-rafale-fighter-jets/
We probably know the next step also, which India might take.
 
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Rafale’s Impact on IAF’s Air Power Capabilities
September 10, 2020





Air Cdre Kaiser Tufail (Retd)

Quite clearly, the inadequacy of IAF’s Su-30MKI and MiG-29 twin-engine fighters in the air superiority role led to the decision to acquire the Rafale, ostensibly a more modern and capable multi-role fighter. While both Russian fighters are highly maneuverable in a visual dogfight, as evidenced in several IAF exercises with RAF Typhoons and USAF F-15s and F-16s, they seem to have shortcomings in network-centric, Beyond Visual Range (BVR) combat. This was noticed during the 27 February 2019 skirmish with PAF F-16s, when a pair of Su-30s failed to establish data link and were of no mutual support to each other. The capabilities of the much-touted N011M ‘Bars’ airborne intercept radar are also suspect as the patrolling Su-30s were unable to launch even a single radar-guided R-77 BVR missiles against two dozen PAF fighters milling in the area on 27 February. While a definitive conclusion about the shortcomings of the Su-30 fire-control radar and missiles cannot be made on the basis of a single engagement, it is clear that they are not at par with the PAF F-16/AMRAAM combo. The IAF was aware of these limitations of the Russian fighters, which is why it had initiated measures for the acquisition of Western multi-role combat aircraft instead of more Su-30s, as far back as 2012.

IAF’s choice fell on the French Rafale, which is, indeed, a formidable multi-role fighter with long range and endurance, along with a sizeable payload in the class of the Su-30, areas that single-engine fighters like the F-16A/B and JF-17 cannot compete in. With a powerful radar and the long-range, radar-guided Meteor BVR missile, it comes at a cost of $120 million apiece. Dollar for dollar, PAF can acquire four JF-17 Blk-III for the cost of one Rafale, thus more than offsetting the latter’s payload capabilities, at least. The range of the Rafale’s Meteor missile claimed by the manufacturer (MBDA) to be 100+ km led the Indian Prime Minister to ruefully state that, “if we had the Rafale, results would have been different [on 27 February].”

Mr. Modi has apparently not yet been briefed by his Air Staff about the JF-17’s upcoming PL-15 BVR missile guided by the new AESA radar, which beats the Rafale’s ramjet-powered Meteor by several tens of kilometers. It is manifest that long range BVR combat will take precedence over close combat in any future conflict, and enemy aircraft will be shot out of the skies while remaining well inside their own territory.

While we are at it, it may be worthwhile to have a cursory line comparison of the Rafale, F-16A and JF-17 in one-on-one visual air combat.

All three aircraft have a ‘clean’ configuration Thrust-to-Weight Ratio of 1:1 and can climb and accelerate equally well. In a turning fight, Aspect Ratio and Wing Loading are critical parameters. The JF-17 and F-16A enjoy better Aspect Ratios of 3.7 each, compared to the Rafale which stands at 2.6. A better Aspect Ratio (square of wing span to wing area) implies better aerodynamic efficiency due to less induced drag during turning. As for Wing Loading, or the weight of the aircraft per unit area, the lesser the better. The Rafale has a slight edge, having 68 lbs/sq ft compared to the JF-17 and F-16A, both of which have Wing Loadings of 77 lbs/sq ft. A lightly loaded wing helps in a tighter turn, though in case of the Rafale, this advantage is overcome by greater induced drag due its lower Aspect Ratio. In sum, all three fighters are at par, more or less, in a turning fight.

Induction of the Rafale in IAF has created considerable media interest, and the impression has been created that with immediate effect, IAF will rule the Indian skies. It must, however, be remembered that it will be at least two years before the Rafale achieves anything close to Full Operational Capability. PAF, on the other hand, has been flying F-16s for 37 years, including hot scenarios during the Afghan War, in local counter-insurgency operations, and the latest Operation ‘Swift Retort,’ downing half a dozen enemy fighters in these operations. The JF-17 has been fully operational for over a decade, and is expected to replace the legacy fighters over the next five years. These combat-proven PAF fighters are fully integrated with the air defence system, and are mutually data-linked, alongside all AEW and ground sensors. Such capabilities are not achieved overnight, and it will be several years before the Rafales can be considered a threat in any real sense.

Any immediate impact of the Rafale on IAF’s air power capabilities is, thus, simply over-hyped. This inference, however, must not be dealt with lightly, as there is a distinct possibility of the Indian Prime Minister using the Rafale for a false-flag operation in a surreptitious manner, to prove his point that, “with the Rafale, the results would have been different,” from those of 27 February 2019.

Air Cdre Kaiser Tufail (Retired) is a former fighter pilot and a writer on military affairs.

http://pakistanpolitico.com/rafales...IMUQOEhbm0jGZl2xs8U7qulMYFNDq0hnUDlDLkundlfR8


I asked Kaiser a question today, it's very general as even my knowledge is limited about SPECTRA etc,


Salaam,
I liked your article about the Rafale Jet -- but what's your opinion of the SPECTRA system, that's being touted so much from our neighbor's across the border and it's system can disrupt our radars making the Rafale undetectable?



Kaiser
sent
44 minutes ago

Thank you XXXXXX. ECM equipment and its capabilities are highly classified, so one cannot say for sure what all SPECTRA can do. What is certainly cannot do is to make the Rafale undetectable. Jammers carried by fighter aircrfat have very low power and can, at best, do deception jamming. For noise jamming to completely blanl out radar transmissions, dedicated aircraft with powerful jammers are equired.
 
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so how does your foot taste? :lol: cuz both F35 and F22 have been battle proven against the SU35 AND vice versa over the skies of syria, SU35 was able to successfully hold both the F35 and F22 at bay but neither were able to lock onto each other. J10s and J16s play cat and mouse games taiwanese F16s& korean F15s all the time, its a normal occurrence. this is as battle proven as a plane can get without firing shots or getting fired at. but the rafale hasn't faced any such challenge.

tell ya son, TIE FIGHTAAAS!!!
When the Greek F-16s got locked a couple of weeks back by the Turkish F-16s over the East Med, a couple of French AF Rafaels lurking nearby - supposed to be giving a cover to their Greek brothers - simply fled....
 
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