PAF J-10C News, Updates and Discussion

[帅的一匹]

The fact that even @Foinikas is being mistaken for Indian shows that their strategy of false flagging is very successful.

No, he is not Indian.

 

[siegecrossbow]

No, he is not Indian.

That’s why I said he is being “mistaken for Indian”, which is very baffling since he says very unIndian things.

 

[tphuang]

Hi,

Not inducted in 2014---but a confirmation that the Paf was headed that way and a deal was agreed with the chinese to the fact where the aircraft design was headed and what would pakistans need be in the coming years with what kind of package.

I would recommend listening to what the Retd Air Marshall stated about the shortcomings of the aircraft J-10.

In the longer run what that meant was that if you do this this and this modification to the aircraft---you will end up with a world class fighter aircraft that you could be proud of and which would fit our needs as well.

Chinese understand & appreciate pakistan's combat experience very well---. They have a great ability to listen and make the needed changes and the results are in front of us. It is a team thing.

I'm sure they did agree to something, but the reality is that they couldn't export this thing until J-10C was using WS-10 series engine. Right now is basically the earliest they could export it to PAF. WS-10 production is finally solid in China. PLAAF itself has moved on to J-20 procurement for the most part.

As for your other point, 2014 would've been too late to make any changes to J-10C. The design would've been frozen by then. Why is J-10C such an important aircraft for China? The reason is because they were testing a whole new avionics architecture that would eventually be adapted onto J-20. While China would take PAF input. I doubt they would modify it for the purpose of making it fit Pakistani needs.

Given where things are heading, I think it's possible for China to export J-20 to Pakistan in the next 10 years. 5 years ago, I didn't think they'd export it to anyone. But keep in mind that if China does export something like J-20 to Pakistan, Pakistan would have to be 100% aligned with China. None of this we try to be on good terms with US, so that we can get F-16V.

 

[jaybird]

Hi,

I am one of the senior most members on this forum.

I used to be on the think Tank but I resigned my commission many years ago due to difference of opinion with those who stated that pakistan did not have funds and will get nothing from china ever and J10 does not bring anything to the table---.

There will be no Type 054's---pakistan is broke---there will be no chinese submarines---and look now---none of them has any shame to come forward and apologize---hey @araz---how about an apology.

& mods---don't delete the post.

Hey Mastankhan, you used to be one of my favorite PDF member here. But you got to let go of holding grudges with other members here. You posts became bitter and no longer the same fun and intelligent Mastankhan we used to see.

 

[ziaulislam]

Lets put things in perspective.

Rafale, made by France.

J10 , made by China. The world factory, industrial juggernaut, semi conductor power house, army of top engineers and scientists, the only nation on the planet operating its own space station as we speak.

Not being biased or anything, but if I have to bet, I know where my money would be.

But in 1970s -1990s french fighters like mirage2000 were wotld class fighters..

Well china waspoorer then pakistan in 1980s. So that is not a way to compare things

Laughable!

A company which cannot make GaN based T/R modules and corresponding AESA radars is a shit company in today's technological market as it is a perfect indication that their R&D runs under average in the market. Hence it is very safe to say their EW suites are also far behind in capability as well.

As for China, J-20 and J-16 are reportedly equipped AESA radars with more than 2000 T/R modules each. Can anyone nominate a French made fighter jet which can house such big AESA radars in sizeable nose with proper cooling? Or any French made EW jet can be comparable to J-16D?

The Frenches don't have any platforms comparable to the Chinese. They don't have substantially advanced technologies and lack required R&D capability.

Visually obvious.

Software and hardware are two different things
Yes GaN has higher effiency and TR modules mean power but that doesnt translate it better software alog

Havong said that R&D of chinese is several times more and i would wxpect it to equal of not better

 

[Thorough Pro]

weapon acquisition rumors work like viagra for you and then one is never enough you got to have one from the west. At one time you gave us Eurofighters, the SU35, them Mig35. Relax, cool down, hang a wet towel on it. If something is coming let it come, we will all see it, no point in jumping up and down like a monkey, it won't speed up anything.

One is from Europe then off course we have USA. Then one country on our really north is also there. Lot of things are in play just wait and watch. Lot of systems are in and more will come. Like I said INSHALLAH in next one decade or two you won't have time to relax you would be hearing about one weapon system after another for all three forces.

 

[Riz]

I'm sure they did agree to something, but the reality is that they couldn't export this thing until J-10C was using WS-10 series engine. Right now is basically the earliest they could export it to PAF. WS-10 production is finally solid in China. PLAAF itself has moved on to J-20 procurement for the most part.

As for your other point, 2014 would've been too late to make any changes to J-10C. The design would've been frozen by then. Why is J-10C such an important aircraft for China? The reason is because they were testing a whole new avionics architecture that would eventually be adapted onto J-20. While China would take PAF input. I doubt they would modify it for the purpose of making it fit Pakistani needs.

Given where things are heading, I think it's possible for China to export J-20 to Pakistan in the next 10 years. 5 years ago, I didn't think they'd export it to anyone. But keep in mind that if China does export something like J-20 to Pakistan, Pakistan would have to be 100% aligned with China. None of this we try to be on good terms with US, so that we can get F-16V.

The day US offers india F-35s , China will ok J-20 sale to Pakistan, China is not offering J-20 to Pakistan because this deal will start unnecessary arm race in south asia which china dont want right now

 

[syed_yusuf]

I think you forgot to qualify that statement to single engines aircraft only. J-10 fuel capacity is primarily due to the wing design, though the non-delta wing F-18C has over 4,900kg of internal fuel capacity as well.

Yes u are right I mean to say for a single engine fighter

I think no other fighter except su35 or j16 may have more fuel per engine than j10

This is one area where j10cp excel hands down

 

[lcloo]

Just came across these beauty posts of the J-10C that PAF has acquired! See below:

View attachment 816401
View attachment 816402
View attachment 816403
View attachment 816404
View attachment 816406

Rupprecht is Deino himself.

 

[Zarvan]

weapon acquisition rumors work like viagra for you and then one is never enough you got to have one from the west. At one time you gave us Eurofighters, the SU35, them Mig35. Relax, cool down, hang a wet towel on it. If something is coming let it come, we will all see it, no point in jumping up and down like a monkey, it won't speed up anything.

You can ask any mod here. Twice we tried to reach a deal with Russia on SU 35 and Russia not agreeing to put AESA broke the deal. I am relaxed it's you who is denial not me. Deals are taking place negotiations happening. Lot of stuff is coming INSHALLAH

 

[Beast]

The day US offers india F-35s , China will ok J-20 sale to Pakistan, China is not offering J-20 to Pakistan because this deal will start unnecessary arm race in south asia which china dont want right now

US do not trust the Indians. F-35 sales will never materialized. Maybe when USAF 6th gen fighter enter service and they will sell outdated products to Indians.

 

[ozranger]

But in 1970s -1990s french fighters like mirage2000 were wotld class fighters..

Well china waspoorer then pakistan in 1980s. So that is not a way to compare things

Software and hardware are two different things
Yes GaN has higher effiency and TR modules mean power but that doesnt translate it better software alog

Havong said that R&D of chinese is several times more and i would wxpect it to equal of not better

Hahaha without advanced hardware you can't even develop advanced software. A good example is on electronic warfare, that AESA radar can offload a lot of EW features from externally carried pods if it is having substantially big amount of T/R modules with substantially strong power output. This kind of EW features are implemented in software as you won't upgrade the AESA antenna very often. I don't believe a radar with 838 T/R modules can have many enough spare T/R modules performing EW activities in run time. So the French team's capability and their achievement cannot be overestimated as they are having much less exposure to more powerful hardware.

It is obviously in a BVR scenario Rafale detects enemy aircraft in significantly shorter distance and is more vulnerable to enemies EW counter measures.

I have hard numbers from open sources to prove my claim and you don't have any to prove yours. End of discussion.

 

[lcloo]

Well yes, the J-20 has similar lights.
Looks like J-19CP has similar lights. But why?
Screenshot of J-20 with بتیاں۔
View attachment 816409

View attachment 816410


Edit: Actually these strip lights seem to be standard feature in J-10C . I could find only one picture of the lights being used, and it's faint.
View attachment 816413


But the question remains, what benefits these light strips , front and back, bring?

Those are formation light, used at night time for formation flights where two to four jets are flying close to each other in the dark.

 

[The Terminator]

Hi,

The russians did not realize how capable chinese engineers were. They just miscalculated and by the time they realized their folly---china had gone too far ahead to be stopped.



Hi,

I do not know from where you have gotten the idea of " QUICK BUCKS"---.

Someone needs to open your eyes and tell you that the west does not give a diddly sh-it about making bucks and arming pakistan.

So---get this word---:"making bucks" out of your vocabulary.



Hi,

No sir it is not---. There are pakistani genes in it that we would rather not acknowledge.

Oh the bu!t hurts. Quite contrary to that you should open your eyes and remove those western lenses you are wearing.

Whole western human rights and war against terrorism rant has proven to be a hoax. They force their own democracies and values upon economically week countries. Decimate those who try to stand on their own against the petrodollar hegemony but unfortunately had a lot week defense forces. Israel, the most illegitimate state on this Earth is their most favorite bastard kid. Your presidents and PMs bend over in front of oil rich Arabs just to please them, because they have been the lifeline of your economic hegemony. West forgets to talk about human rights when it comes to ever expanding illegal state of Israel or the brute totalitarian Arab regimes.

Lol the west especially the western European breed of people and all their descendants are the most morally corrupt, hypocrite and greedy people this planet has ever seen. That's why they plundered the whole world and fought one another in the colonial era and both the world wars were fought primarily by the Europeans. Afghanistan or Iraq had nothing to do with it. The are savagely killing each other and the world around them for centuries. Have committed worst genocides of the history. Betrayal/Deception is embedded into their DNA. Who invented the crusade wars and what really did those crusades achieved? At least as far as Muslim history is concerned, those people are constantly fighting Muslims for 1400 years in the quest of gaining more power and money baby.

Don't try to lecture us about the west.

In short for Pakistan, they were reluctant to give us anything, then came the JF-17 thunder with SD-10 missiles. Only after that we got BVR capable F-16s. We Couldn't get a breakthrough in gunship helicopters so that matter lingers on for decades. Same pattern could be followed in the future. Is it an attitude of a friend/ally? Absolutely Not. Is this purely a business? Yes. The business would continue as usual and Pakistan wouldn't get any capability boosting platforms from the west especially the US, but business as usual why not! That's the opportunity to make quick bucks and retain somewhat leverage upon Pakistani Govt.

F-16 used to be our Frontline fighter, darling of the Pakistan, but not anymore. With the induction of JF-17 B3 and J-10C, the F-16 is there to just complement them and fill the numbers. PAF has quite cleverly changed the tip of their spear.

 

[Chak Bamu]

You fellows are in for a big surprise !

Give it up already, Do you think this place is for your inanities? Mods know better & if they are not saying anything, then please stay quiet. By insisting on a mere personal hunch, you are making a fool of yourself. Stop derailing the thread.

Guys any news on dragons' arrival? I want to see them land with PAF markings & Pakistan's flag on rudder.