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Our idol Mao Zedong - Europeans and the Communist Cultural Revolution

But Mao didn't understand economy.

He was bad at science too. He ordered the peasants to use wood as a fuel to smelt steel in their backyard to increase steel production, while in the Han dynasty the Chinese were already using coal.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backyard_furnace

He also imported the practice of pseudo-science from the Soviet Union, such as close-planting of crops.

In addition to the decline in food production due to the diversion of effort away from agriculture there was losses in food production because of the erroneous policies promoted by the State. One of these idiocies was close planting. If two plants are set too close to each other there is not enough nutrients in the soil to feed both and both die. The State promoted close planting of grain to increase productivity. The initial growth of a plant derives from the nutrient stored in the seed itself. With close planting the initial germination produces spectacular results, but when the growth of the plant has to depend upon nutrients drawn from the soil the close planting produces failures. During the Great Leap Forward there developed a competition for creating the most striking demonstrations of close planting. The record was probably the case which produced a famous photograph of children standing on top of a wheat field that could hold their weight. Jasper Becker, in his history of the Great Leap Forward era Hungry Ghosts tells that an interviewee told him that the picture was faked. There was a bench hidden in the wheat below the children's feet that supported them.

Jasper Becker in Hungry Ghosts traces the foolishness of close planting to the fraudulent science of the Soviet Union. T.D. Lysenko was a quack who got the support of Joseph Stalin and ruled over Soviet genetics for twenty five years. Among the many erroneous notions promoted by Lysenko and which had to be accepted in Marxist countries was his "law of the life of species" which said that plants of the same species do not compete with each other but instead help each other to survive.

This was linked to the Marxist notion of classes in which members of the same class do not compete but instead help each other survive. So Marxist ideology seemed to support the notion that the denser grain was planted the better it was for the grain. But in reality this close planting led to withering of the plants after the initial germination phase. Lysenko was responsible for many other foolish notions most based upon the precept that environment not genetics determine plant characteristics. Lysenko argued that if you grew plants a little farther north each year they would adapt to the climate and eventually you would be able to grow oranges in the arctic. All of the Lysenko nonsense had to accepted in the Soviet Union and promoted in propaganda as scientific truth. The Marxists in China apparently believed it was the truth. The reality was that this nonsense resulted in less production of food under conditions of bare survival.

Some tried to communicate to Mao the failures of the Great Leap Forward but were denounced as traitors. Marshal Peng Dehuai who commanded the Chinese troops in the Korean War was one of those denounced and branded as a counter-revolutionary by Mao.

Famine ensued and was particularly severe in some areas. The people in these areas were forbidden to leave their area and so were doomed to starvation. Altogether about thirty million people died in the famine. The famine was caused by the shortfall in food production but this was a result of the bad policies and centralization of power in the central government. It was made worse by the refusal to admit the problem. During the time peasants were starving in the country side the government was shipping to grain to the Soviet Union to repay loans. Some grain also rotted in warehouses in the cities where it was taken from the communes.

This famine was kept secret from the outside world until China began opening up to the outside world and demographers began analyzing the the population statistics.

When Mao finally accepted the fact that the Great Leap Forward had failed he left the task of achieving an economic recovery to Liu Shaoqi, Deng Xiaoping and Zhou Enlai. Harrison Salisbury believes there is evidence that Mao made an explicit agreement with the three that he would give them free rein for five years. The three did bring about the recovery but in 1966 Mao sought to return to absolute power again. The power struggle took the form of the Great Proletarian Cultural Revolution (1966-1976). It was a social and economic disaster for China but it was brilliant guerilla warfare on the part of Mao.

http://www.applet-magic.com/greatleap.htm
 
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I am sorry if the fact is not on your side. For many of us, YOU, @Nilgiri, and @gambit are the real troll .. and real jokers :laugh:

I don't even know who you are buddy (like gambit and gary might have talked to you a whole bunch...but I literally only ever said cpl lines and only when gary tagged me I think...and I was just wondering why he spends too much time with you lot hah)... but thanks anyway ;) ...glad to know I make ppl laugh.

@Nilgiri What did I say about the third type of troll, now maybe you understand :)

Oh i understood from observing cpl threads last year lol...(before you left for an extended break again lol). Brick wall echo troll I call it.
 
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Zhou Enlai was a much better man than Mao, I think.

He was lot more cool headed and pragmatic for sure. He would have been a great supreme leader (and say Mao could have been the founding father that lived out rest of his life having accomplished the liberation and founding of the state etc).

But all is hypotheticals in the end.
 
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He was lot more cool headed and pragmatic for sure. He would have been a great supreme leader (and say Mao could have been the founding father that lived out rest of his life having accomplished the liberation and founding of the state etc).

But all is hypotheticals in the end.

Mao Zedong was a preacher. He was a Marxist Theorist. He was great in creating jargon, indoctrination, and propaganda. He knew how to move the people, and how to make them believe on him. He was also keen on military strategy. His book "On Guerilla Warfare" was the proof of his knowledge of warfare during the war against Japan in World War 2.

But he was too idealistic. And didn't understand about macro economy at all. For his idealistic idea, named true Communism, he was willing to sacrifice his people welfare. And he didn't even aware that his action was a disaster that will cost his people greatly.
 
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I don't even know who you are buddy (like gambit and gary might have talked to you a whole bunch...but I literally only ever said cpl lines and only when gary tagged me I think...and I was just wondering why he spends too much time with you lot hah)... but thanks anyway ;) ...glad to know I make ppl laugh.


I dont either know you until you came and defend jhungary's circling around BS with blind support. Starting from then I thought I knew the quality of you. :-)

He spent his and my time in order to save his face, while I spent my time for the purpose to debunk and bust the faulty claim of his. :smart:

@Nilgiri What did I say about the third type of troll, now maybe you understand :)


2 persons with same level of thinking and character will certainly should understand each other's thought .. and same delusion too :-)
 
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lol @Nilgiri, look at the man response to you, I think there is a phase to some effect saying this

"If you think everybody is an arse, probably you are an arse"

If you know what I mean about this guy. LOL:omghaha: You didn't even have a go with him like me and @gambit does, yet, he bash you with the same stroke as much as me.

He is so god damn good, you don't even need to say a god damn word and he knows you are wrong......LOL:omghaha:

Told you this guy is a gem. :yay:
 
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Hi Slav,
It's always the same story with Gary. He can insult anyone he wants but he cries to the mods when reciprocated.
He will be getting the same treatment even if he will tries to provoke you.I will throw warning at him and that too of +1 point.

Regards
 
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@Jlaw I have just given you warning this time.Next time, it would be a ban.

Regards

You should perhaps think why would anyone be able to start a thread to sh?t on China in PDF. Mao is the father to modern China compared with Jinnah to Pakistan. Will you allow such a stupid thread to attack Jinnah? Are you banning Chinese defenders of Mao? Shame on PDF! Shame on you!
 
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You should perhaps think why would anyone be able to start a thread to sh?t on China in PDF. Mao is the father to modern China compared with Jinnah to Pakistan. Will you allow such a stupid thread to attack Jinnah? Are you banning Chinese defenders of Mao? Shame on PDF! Shame on you!

You feel DW documentary was doing that? Did you even watch it?
 
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