Osama Dead. Obama Confirms.

[jeypore]

US statements indicated 2 adult men aside from Laden, two women, and some children.

Where did the rest go?

Bin Laden's neighbors noticed unusual things - Yahoo! News

Lets not speculate where did the rest go because today US is saying they have one of bin laden wifes, but here is something more interesting for you AGNO, regarding Pakistan laws and regulations, ofcourse from the article above:

As in other Pakistani towns, hotels in Abbottabad are supposed to report the presence of foreigners to the police, as are estate agents. Abbottabad police chief Mohammed Naeem said the police followed the procedures but "human error cannot be avoided."

Reporters were allowed to get as far as the walls of the compound for the first time, but the doors were sealed shut and police were in no mood to open them

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

A property supposedly 8 times larger than any other in the neighborhood, the construction of the compound, the fact that trash was not collected from this property and thatt hey burnt their trash, the fact that unlike other homes in the neighborhood this large property had no phone or internet connection-

So now we should suspect every home larger than its neighbors in Pakistan? And how long has it been since you were in Pakistan to not realize how many people in the cities still burn stuff at home? The construction is not anything out of ordinary in Pakistan - high walls and security. Absurd reasoning. Try and figure out how many millions of houses in Pakistan probably fit this profile.

Anyway AM, after your misguided effort, the truth will come out -- See Osama could not be the only ones there, there may well be an entire support system -- and of course WHEN it becomes clear that some Pakistani authorities did indeed know, and were indeed on the payroll and members of a so called religious political party were involved --- well, one wonder where they think they will run to, unless of course they can blackmail even higher ups in the establishment and force the state to protect them from "justice", as the US types, say

Yet more nonsensical speculation. Let me know when you have the evidence to support your claims.

 

[muse]

AM, please remember this is Defense.pk , it's not WAB or some other trash forum - there is no need to defend what is unworthy of defense --- Look if they did not know, the implication is that we don't need the Fauj and the ISI, at least not in their "unreconstructed" form, right??

And if they did know -- well, then they will have to be "reconstructed", right??

I'm a bit, OK, a lot, confused as to why you are doing what you are doing

 

[prototype]

So now we should suspect every home larger than its neighbors in Pakistan? And how long has it been since you were in Pakistan to not realize how many people in the cities still burn stuff at home? The construction is not anything out of ordinary in Pakistan - high walls and security. Absurd reasoning. Try and figure out how many millions of houses in Pakistan probably fit this profile.

Now yes for sure that was not absurd,what absurd was that such a million $ mansion does not have an internet connection and telephone line to communicate with outside world,and a large privacy wall on the roof,not to mention the large fortified walls around the complex,enough to grab attention.

 

[muse]

So now we should suspect every home larger than its neighbors in Pakistan?

Why so hostile? If you have confidence in your argument, there is no need for such statements --- Large compounds a dime a dozen in Pakistan, you say, we really must know of two very different Pakistans -- anyway, local authorities make it their business to know what's what and who's who in their locality and that ISI and military police did not investigate who property owners are and who lives so close to the PMA -- well, really it's beyond belief

 

[SMC]

I don't see how this house was so different that one should feel suspicious. Frequently you'll come across houses with high ceilings, barbed wires. Garbage burning is common practice in Pakistan.

 

[F-16_Falcon]

Be honest for once Mr Imran khan spit it out to the nation that our army operates a state within a state ... why blame gop they dont have any control over army

I have many questions need to be answered.


1 Why our govt cannot control army.
2 why americans were allowed inside our territory. why we cannot simply kick them out.
3 why we take money from america, what if we do not take.
4 do we need their money.
5 why we should do what ever america ask us to do.
6 why army do not go for all out offense against all terrorists all over the country.
7 why china does not help us.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Bin Laden's neighbors noticed unusual things - Yahoo! News

The neighbors did not mention anything in the report that would have indicated terrorists, let along Bin Laden. Lots of women and kids does not automatically translate to terrorist and OBL.

Lets not speculate where did the rest go because today US is saying they have one of bin laden wifes, but here is something more interesting for you AGNO, regarding Pakistan laws and regulations, ofcourse from the article above:

How is that interesting? Did the police know foreigners were there and what procedure was followed? A house search or simple registration by the head of household?

 

[waraich66]

I find it funny your making fun of the CIA.... how about making fun of PAK and the ISI? lol damn fools

It is reality , you accept it or not , ISI proved their capability in USSR defeat but you know that Bush himself admit CIA failure in Iraq .

 

[Meengla]

I think Agno is correct that OBL hiding in Abbottabad was not extra ordinary.

 

[prototype]

I have many questions need to be answered.


1 Why our govt cannot control army.
2 why americans were allowed inside our territory. why we cannot simply kick them out.
3 why we take money from america, what if we do not take.
4 do we need their money.
5 why we should do what ever america ask us to do.
6 why army do not go for all out offense against all terrorists all over the country.
7 why china does not help us.

Well brother tell me what kind of help u expect from china in such case,the biggest help they can do was backing Pakistan still as a trustworthy ally,which they did.

And about Pakistani army and intelligence flushing out all terrorists from the country,it does not make sense that Pakistan was unaware all this days about presence of Osama in ur country that to a place which is a stone throw away from a military academy,so for sure their are not many takers for this explanation,and if yes it is true,then u have to agree that ISI is a failure.

 

[waraich66]

I have many questions need to be answered.


1 Why our govt cannot control army.
2 why americans were allowed inside our territory. why we cannot simply kick them out.
3 why we take money from america, what if we do not take.
4 do we need their money.
5 why we should do what ever america ask us to do.
6 why army do not go for all out offense against all terrorists all over the country.
7 why china does not help us.

US is super power , Pakistan is nuke Power but have limited resources to fight this war against terrorism .We need US support to defeat our enemy .

 

[Developereo]

The facts point otherwise.

Which facts would those be?

The established facts are that the area was cordoned off, power was cut off, and US helis flew for several hours over Pakistani airspace. All this cannot happen without Pakistani cooperation. Maybe in the movies, but not in real life.

The only claim that Pakistan did not know about the operation is from Obama's statement which, as I indicated, was part of the deal.

There are two points that can be speculated on. One is Pakistan knew he was there (this would probably be known to a limited number of people within the military and intelligence) it could be the higher ups had no idea because agents within the military and intelligence agency made sure they didn't. Or that Pakistan's military and intelligence is incompetent when it comes to finding the most wanted man in a 1 million dollar mansion. Both are not positive.

The first option is the most likely. There is no question that there are elements within the security establishment who are sympathetic to OBL. It does not indicate that the rot goes to the top or is system-wide.

Some of the people still trying to spin this in Pakistan's favor are just trying to save face. The circumstance surrounding OBL is nothing but alarming and it is clear damage has been done.

No, the usual anti-Pakistan trolls are spinning it their way. Nobody's denying that there was likely some complicity within the security establishment, but some people are extrapolating it into their own agenda.

However it is interesting to note how this will play out in Pakistan/U.S. relations now. As the U.S. now has the upper hand in negotiating their involvement in the tribal areas. The fact that OBL was in Pakistan hurt the leveraging Pakistan had over the U.S. This also raises questions on if other elements of AQ or the Taliban are operating out of Pakistan as well. It would be viable for Pakistan (had they not known or even if they do ) at this point to go after such elements now and bring them to justice themselves.

That's your wishful thinking. The US is likely to push its luck but it will be business as usual in a short time. Nothing's going to change.

 

[waraich66]

It may be his own desire to come out of caves and die in combat , remember he was kidney patient.

Is Osama bin Laden Dying ... Again?
By Massimo Calabresi / Washington Monday, June 30, 2008
Click here to find out more!

Which is closer to dying: Osama bin Laden or the CIA's effort to catch him? Nothing has characterized the fruitlessness of the hunt for the al-Qaeda leader so much as the recurrent — and mostly inaccurate — reports that he is seriously ailing, or even at death's door. In 2002, Pakistani President Pervez Musharraf said bin Laden had kidney disease, and that he had required a dialysis machine when he lived in Afghanistan. That same year, the FBI's top counterterrorism official, Dale Watson, said, "I personally think he is probably not with us anymore." Since then, of course, bin Laden has appeared on multiple videos looking healthier than ever.

Now the CIA has produced a report saying that bin Laden has long-term kidney disease and may have only months to live, two U.S. officials familiar with the report told TIME. The agency ostensibly managed to get the names of some of the medications bin Laden is taking. One U.S. official familiar with the report, which came out between six and nine months ago, says it concluded, "Based on his current pharmaceutical intake, [we] would expect that he has no more than six to 18 months to live and impending kidney failure." (See pictures of Osama Bin Laden.)

That prognosis, along with some on-the-ground intelligence and a well-aimed Hellfire missile, will get you a dead terrorist leader. Close watchers of the al-Qaeda terror network find such reports inherently unreliable. "It's trying to make a diagnosis from thousands of miles away with only fragments of the medical chart," says Paul Pillar, former top analyst and deputy director of the CIA's counterterrorism center, who now teaches at Georgetown University. Says Frances Fragos Townsend, who stepped down last November as chief of President George W. Bush's Homeland Security Council, "I've read all the same conflicting reports [on bin Laden's health] that people have talked to you about. I never found one set of reporting more persuasive than another."

The CIA, for its part, is disavowing the claims attributed to the report. "I have found no one here familiar with this alleged report or the analytic line it supposedly conveys," says Paul Gimigliano, a CIA spokesman. "The fact that anonymous sources attribute views to the CIA is not, by itself, reason to believe the agency actually holds those views," he says. (See pictures of a Bin Laden family album.)

If bin Laden really is dying, the news would doubtless be greeted with some ambivalence. On the one hand, his demise is what the U.S. government has been fervently trying to hasten — since before 9/11. But death by kidney disease is not exactly what it had in mind. "Wouldn't that be a tragic situation if, with all this effort, bin Laden died without it happening at the hands of coalition forces?" says one current senior counterterrorism official. Given the reliability of past long-distance diagnoses, however, and the continuing threat al-Qaeda poses around the world, that may be the least of America's worries.

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/nation/article/0,8599,1819280,00.html#ixzz1LM6HG3ce

 

[Meengla]

Already cooling down starting....

U.S.-Pakistani Tensions Rise After Bin Laden Raid - NYTimes.com

ormal denials that the military or the ISI knew of Bin Laden’s location. Instead, he acknowledged a major intelligence lapse by the Pakistani police and security forces.

“To me, it’s a big embarrassment that the bastard was in this compound near the academy,” said the Pakistani officer, who spoke on condition of anonymity. “Clearly, the U.S. had better intelligence than we did about what was inside that compound.”

The general said Pakistan and the United States had cooperated in other counterterrorism operations in the Abbottabad area in recent weeks, notably a C.I.A. tip that led to Pakistan’s recent arrest of Umar Patek, one of the main Indonesian suspects in the 2002 Bali bombing.

The Pakistani government statement went further, saying that the ISI had “been sharing information with C.I.A. and other friendly intelligence agencies” about the Bin Laden compound since 2009.

Several American officials said they were puzzled about the statement, pointing out that the C.I.A. did not know about the compound until last August.

The raid has fueled anti-Pakistan sentiment in Congress, yet it is unclear — perhaps even unlikely — that there would be enough support to cut aid to Pakistan.

Speaker John A. Boehner, who just returned from a congressional visit to Pakistan and Afghanistan, said that any discussion about cutting aid or decreasing engagement with Pakistan in the aftermath of the Bin Laden strike was premature and that he would strongly oppose any such move.

“We both benefit from having a strong bilateral relationship, and I think we need to use this moment to strengthen the ties between our two countries,” Mr. Boehner told reporters. “This is not a time to back away from Pakistan.”

Senator Harry Reid, the Nevada Democrat and majority leader, also expressed reluctance about limiting aid to Pakistan, saying the country has been an anti-terror partner of the United States. “They’ve lost thousands and thousands of their soldiers fighting terrorists,” he said. “Now, this doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have more oversight, and I’m willing to do that.”