New book on PAF

[fatman17]

Just got it in the mail !!!
View attachment 4263
its a beauty !!!

 

[Myth_buster_1]

Just got it in the mail !!!
View attachment 4263
its a beauty !!!

oh lucky you mannn... so is this book finally available in pakistan?

 

[Manticore]

is it only available online? can it be found on ferozesons or anyother big book store?

 

[Skywalker]

Any Idea what is the cost

 

[hj786]

Just got it in the mail !!!
View attachment 4263
its a beauty !!!

Nice! Does it say much about PAF evaluating and considering the Panavia Tornado and Ukrainian Su-27 in the 90s? I'd like to know about which versions of Tornado the PAF was considering and how many.

 

[Patriot]

Where did you buy it from Fatman?

 

[PAFAce]

Nice! Does it say much about PAF evaluating and considering the Panavia Tornado and Ukrainian Su-27 in the 90s? I'd like to know about which versions of Tornado the PAF was considering and how many.

Interesting, I didn't know we evaluated the Tornado. If we did, we most likely evaluated the Air Defense upgrade version (Panavia Tornado ADV). The one before was primarily for moving earth. And yeah, we definitely evaluated the Su-27 at some point, but I'm not sure if it was Ukrainian or Russian.

I agree, it would be terrific if the book could highlight these.

 

[hj786]

Interesting, I didn't know we evaluated the Tornado. If we did, we most likely evaluated the Air Defense upgrade version (Panavia Tornado ADV). The one before was primarily for moving earth. And yeah, we definitely evaluated the Su-27 at some point, but I'm not sure if it was Ukrainian or Russian.

I agree, it would be terrific if the book could highlight these.

According to http://www.southasiaanalysis.org/papers2/paper166.htm a book called "The Story of the PAF (1988-98) - A Battle Against The Odds," written by a joint team of retired PAF officials led by Air Marshal Rasheed Sheikh, states "Between late 1990 and 1993, it (the PAF) evaluated and rejected the British Tornado, took a close look at the Mirage 2000E, and received a misleading offer from Poland for the supply of MiG-29s and Su-27s." I guess I was wrong, I'm sure I read somewhere about Ukrainian Su-27s.

The problem with the Tornado ADV is that its an interceptor designed to shoot down Russian bombers with active radar homing missiles. Although fitted with AIM-9, it is not exactly ideal at close-combat and lets put it this way; PAF's adversary is rather close. The Tornado IDS/ECR on the other hand can carry awesome loads of strike weapons from damaged runways and land on them again (airbrakes like "barn doors"), not to mention all the European electronic warfare gear (I read an old Jane's book from the early 80s which contained a Panavia advert highlighting the advanced ECM and the slogan "Some Air Forces will have an unfair advantage," probably what persuaded the Saudis to buy it).

 

[fatman17]

is it only available online? can it be found on ferozesons or anyother big book store?

i got it directly from key publishing - on-line for BP 25/- air-mail. I believe you can order it at Oxford U Press book stores but u have to pay in advance!

 

[fatman17]

Nice! Does it say much about PAF evaluating and considering the Panavia Tornado and Ukrainian Su-27 in the 90s? I'd like to know about which versions of Tornado the PAF was considering and how many.

so far just finished seeing the over 600 beautiful pictures of PAF a/c.
will comment when I get to reading the various chapters (200 pages).

will share interesting data as i go along.....

 

[Salahadin]

i got it directly from key publishing - on-line for BP 25/- air-mail. I believe you can order it at Oxford U Press book stores but u have to pay in advance!

What's the isbn #

 

[fatman17]

What's the isbn #

just go to key publishing.com.uk site and buy from there!
ISBN 0-946219-04-04

 

[blain2]

Nice! Does it say much about PAF evaluating and considering the Panavia Tornado and Ukrainian Su-27 in the 90s? I'd like to know about which versions of Tornado the PAF was considering and how many.

Eval of Tornado is mentioned in the new book. However the Su-27 and Mig-29 evaluation is covered in Book #2 in fair detail. Both of these aircraft were evaluated in detail by the PAF in Russia (PAF did not like the Mig-29 but wanted Su-27 upgraded before purchasing but geo-political considerations got in the way). I suspect Tornado was most probably declined on the basis of its dedicated role and lack of MR capability.

All three books are great. I like the first two even better than the third one for all of the information. However from a pictorial perspective, the third one has the most.

The third one also mentions PAF participation in other Multilateral exercises besides Anatolian Eagle (KSA, UAE - Tactical Leadership Forum) along with USAF, RSAF, UAEAF, and RAF with PAF F-16s and Mirage IIIs flying in exercises with UAEAF Blk-60s, Mirage 2000-9s, RAF Typhoons, Tornados etc.

Get it if you can. Its well worth it to make it part of your collection.

 

[PAFAce]

According to "The Story of the PAF (1988-98) - A Battle Against The Odds," written by a joint team of retired PAF officials led by Air Marshal Rasheed Sheikh, states "Between late 1990 and 1993, it (the PAF) evaluated and rejected the British Tornado, took a close look at the Mirage 2000E, and received a misleading offer from Poland for the supply of MiG-29s and Su-27s." I guess I was wrong, I'm sure I read somewhere about Ukrainian Su-27s.

You're right, the second official PAF history book mentions the evaluation of the Su-27, Mirage-2000s, Swede Grippen etc. (but I don't remember it mentioning the Tornado) to fulfill the high-end role for the PAF. It was quite informative the second one.

Eval of Tornado is mentioned in the new book. However the Su-27 and Mig-29 evaluation is covered in Book #2 in fair detail. Both of these aircraft were evaluated in detail by the PAF in Russia (PAF did not like the Mig-29 but wanted Su-27 upgraded before purchasing but geo-political considerations got in the way). I suspect Tornado was most probably declined on the basis of its dedicated role and lack of MR capability.

Really, sir? I thought that Tornado ADV was dubbed the original "MRCA". I know this because Canada was part of the project initially, along with Britain, Holland, Germany and Italy (or was it France?). Then The Canadians opted out for the F-18, the Dutch opted for the F-16 and only the Brits and the Germans were left, with the design of the aircraft done entirely by the Brits. I imagine that if so many countries were involved in the design of Tornado ADV, then surely, it must have has MR capabilities?

 

[TOPGUN]

I wonder if i buy the new book how long will it take to reach the US and how safe is it doesnt seem like its a safe site!