N-deal with Pak could hit ties, India cautions China

[schneider]

Yes it is a civilian nuclear deal, and yes currently there are only two reactors used for generating electricity (with the third expected to start by next year) - that is why Pakistan is looking to construct more NPP's to generate electricity - how do you propose Pakistan have more than '2 reactors used for power generation' without such sales?

Secondly, the two reactors under IAEA safeguards were put there willingly, since Pakistan has a separate military nuclear program.

Because Pakistan is producing both Enriched Uranium and Plutonium and that also with a very good speed. That's why your weapon arsenal is increasing. And its not possible with just 2 Nuclear reactors.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Because Pakistan is producing both Enriched Uranium and Plutonium and that also with a very good speed. That's why your weapon arsenal is increasing. And its not possible with just 2 Nuclear reactors.

Highly Enriched Uranium, which is what the majority of Pakistan's warheads use, does not need a 'reactor' to produce - it requires expertise over the enrichment process itself, using centrifuges, which is what Iran is trying to master currently. NPP's that run on Lightwater (such as the CHASNUPP I, II and proposed III and IV NPP's), do not produce 'Plutonium' or 'HEU' as a byproduct, they use Lightly Enriched Uranium as a fuel.

It is the Heavy Water NPP's such as KANUPP (and the un-safeguarded Khushab I, II and III reactors) and most of India's NPP's that produce Plutonium as a byproduct that can be used for weapons.

So your observations above are completely uninformed and incorrect.

 

[toxic_pus]

The material was 'stolen' from its original purpose (civilian use) to construct a nuclear bomb. That was not the intended purpose of the CIRUS (correction, it was not CANDU that supplied the fuel) reactor constructed by the Canadians in India.

There was no nuclear bomb in 1974. It was a nuclear devise. There was nothing in the agreement between India and Canada that prohibited using NED (Nuclear Explosive Devise) for PNEs (Peaceful Nuclear Explosions). In fact, USSR and France went a step ahead and congratulated India for that successful PNE.

But you already know all of it, being a participant in this thread.

 

[schneider]

Highly Enriched Uranium, which is what the majority of Pakistan's warheads use, does not need a 'reactor' to produce - it requires expertise over the enrichment process itself, using centrifuges, which is what Iran is trying to master currently. NPP's that run on Lightwater (such as the CHASNUPP I, II and proposed III and IV NPP's), do not produce 'Plutonium' or 'HEU' as a byproduct, they use Lightly Enriched Uranium as a fuel.

It is the Heavy Water NPP's such as KANUPP (and the un-safeguarded Khushab I, II and III reactors) and most of India's NPP's that produce Plutonium as a byproduct that can be used for weapons.

So your observations above are completely uninformed and incorrect.

My Expertize says that Pakistan is trying to obtain fissile U -239 thats Plutonium and Tritium from its stockpiles of HEU. Because your upcoming reactors are based on Plutonium. They are not under IAEA safeguards. If you need a Link I can provide you, but its commonsense to know it.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

My Expertize says that Pakistan is trying to obtain fissile U -239 thats Plutonium and Tritium from its stockpiles of HEU. Because your upcoming reactors are based on Plutonium. They are not under IAEA safeguards. If you need a Link I can provide you, but its commonsense to know it.

Please start providing some credible sources with your claims, since your claims make no sense and contradict known facts.

Pakistan's Plutonium sources are the Khushab I reactor, with Khushab II & III being constructed to expand the amount of Plutonium fuel for its weapons program.

All four reactors at Chashma will be Light Water Reactors, which means they do not produce Plutonium as a byproduct. The fuel used to supply them will be Low Enriched Uranium, enriched by Pakistan, using the same process that is used to make High Enriched Uranium for nuclear weapons. But the enrichment process is separate from the reactors, and Pakistan has already mastered it to enrich uranium to the levels needed for nuclear weapons. Therefore the proposed Chinese reactors will have no impact on the enriched Uranium weapons program.

 

[schneider]

Please start providing some credible sources with your claims, since your claims make no sense and contradict known facts.

Pakistan's Plutonium sources are the Khushab I reactor, with Khushab II & III being constructed to expand the amount of Plutonium fuel for its weapons program.

All four reactors at Chashma will be Light Water Reactors, which means they do not produce Plutonium as a byproduct. The fuel used to supply them will be Low Enriched Uranium, enriched by Pakistan, using the same process that is used to make High Enriched Uranium for nuclear weapons. But the enrichment process is separate from the reactors, and Pakistan has already mastered it to enrich uranium to the levels needed for nuclear weapons. Therefore the proposed Chinese reactors will have no impact on the enriched Uranium weapons program.

And HEU is being used to produce Plutonium for weapons.

 

[schneider]

Pakistan's Plutonium sources are the Khushab I reactor, with Khushab II & III being constructed to expand the amount of Plutonium fuel for its weapons program.

.

And which country is Building that??? I guess its China, with whom you guys are luking for a CIVILIAN NUCLEAR DEAL and at the back yard, Plutonium based Reactors are being Build to weaponise the missiles.

 

[mjnaushad]

And which country is Building that??? I guess its China, with whom you guys are luking for a CIVILIAN NUCLEAR DEAL and at the back yard, Plutonium based Reactors are being Build to weaponise the missiles.

 

[schneider]

So you accept that China is helping you building Bombs.

 

[karan.1970]

Pakistani statements to the IAEA and on other occasions clearly point out that discrimination and arbitrary exemptions were a primary cause of opposition. Nuclear imbalance was a legitimate concern as well, given the potential increased access to spent Plutonium India would have access to by virtue of more heavy water NPP's.

So on both counts the concerns were legitimate.

I never commented on the ligitimacy of the concerns (since thats a different discussion), but only on TK's incorrect comment around absence of Pakistani opposition to Indo-US deal.

All that verbiage is nothing but a restating of my point that the exemption was discriminatory, arbitrary and a violation of the NSG's own rules, and therefore makes objections to other nations making 'subjective decisions' hollow and meaningless.

Not really. There is difference between discretion and discrimination. All subjective decisions automatically do not become discriminatory (except for ones who those decisions go against). For example, constitution ammendments are not against the rules if passed by the majority as defined by the constitution. IN the same manner, NSG's exception for India was approved by the rules defined in NSG's constitution. Really does not matter if Pakistan thinks those decisions are discriminatory/arbitrary or not since neither India nor Pakistan is a part of NSG.

 

[mjnaushad]

So you accept that China is helping you building Bombs.

No...............................

 

[idune]

Indian are moaning and crying on top of their lung because deal they made with uncle had string attached – these new reactors (they are planning) cannot be used for weapon program. On top of it, uncle forced indian to declare which of the existing N-plant used for civilian use and which one for military use. Indian ambition is screwed by over jealous indian ego (without substance) and by politicians.

Now indians are crying and moaning to push for the same agenda uncle imposed on them. They realized without imposing their own screw up, Pakistan will be in better position in the long run. Indian effort to overcome their own shortcoming by trying to screw someone else is NOT ONLY pathetic BUT ALSO entertaining.

 

[alibaz]

And which country is Building that??? I guess its China, with whom you guys are luking for a CIVILIAN NUCLEAR DEAL and at the back yard, Plutonium based Reactors are being Build to weaponise the missiles.

then I think China should be charged for nuclear proliferation. Why don't you do that

 

[TaimiKhan]

then I think China should be charged for nuclear proliferation. Why don't you do that

All they can do is, be on such forums and show their true potential of being keyboard warrior.

 

[Agnostic_Indian]

All they can do is, be on such forums and show their true potential of being keyboard warrior.

isn't every body doing the same from both sides.