Musharraf ***** slapping on OBL question.

[lem34]

I think he was doing well until he got heavily involved in politics and with the Chaudharys.

Just look at his economic policies, although Shaukat Aziz might have a bit of a hand in that.

He messed up with the constitutional framework of the country though and that was the thing that agitated the political parties, who in turn got support from the masses through the free media.

No mate we needed someone who had the masses with him. Can you imagine if he had exterminated lets say 1000 to 2000 in Pakistan all the corrupt parasites and their families. The people would have been with him, he shouldnt have entertained any of those political leaders.

 

[Irfan Baloch]

As if it matterrs to us.

Well in any case this episode was an embarisment for us. no two arguments about it. Now if US or India are hell bound on saying that he was under Govt and Army protection then what Pakistan says doesnt matter right??

So i would say, screw it... we are saying that it is a security failure sure. but it is by no way any more or less of any failure of any security intelligence agency. So it is up to you lot -who have constant constipation or loose motion/ Diarrhea over the fact that OBL was killed in Abbottabad and think and know that we were hiding him- to do what you want to do in this regard.

So enlighten me Mr. Rabbit. What should India do in this regard or US should?

You are quite convinced right. Why not ask the right questions to your govt and for that matter ask US what they want to do in this regard????

As far as I know US plans to pack up and leave latest by 2014...

What say you??

the trove of documents taken away didnt say much
time and again they stay they havent found any link any proof to establish that OBL was under state protection. but on the paralleled

we get bloggers, think tank email speculations from Americans presented as "proof" that OBL was under Army/ISI protection. when that doesnt work then some sacked major or a general who had beein out of service for decades is recruited in to write a "revealing" article or give an interview (Kamran Shafi , Gen Zia uddin). the words of these guys that are out of the service for decades are used as a proof forgetting that they have very valid personal grudges against the army because they got the boot from the force

then some American tough talker comes in with the most hilarious speculation saying

maybe some middle to lower rang ISI offcials were involved in keeping OBL hidden for six years

despite the fact that no lower to middle ranked officer stays in one station for more than one or 2 years max and is constantly rotated without any say or knowledge about who is going to replace him or who is he going to replace. keep the whole process a secret and dont let it leak.


bottom line is.

ISI was as much incompetent as CIA, NSA and FBI were while they rivaled each other to look better than the other agency, failing to share clues and leads while the hijackers trained under their noses and then banged the planes one after the other on 9/11

 

[Jango]

No mate we needed someone who had the masses with him. Can you imagine if he had exterminated lets say 1000 to 2000 in Pakistan all the corrupt parasites and their families. The people would have been with him, he shouldnt have entertained any of those political leaders.

He was somebody who could have taken a strong stick in his hand and given it up to the corrupt, but alas, he got involved in that as well.

Well, lets look to the present and future now!

 

[lem34]

He was somebody who could have taken a strong stick in his hand and given it up to the corrupt, but alas, he got involved in that as well.

Well, lets look to the present and future now!

Imran assisted by ISI. It has to be like that

 

[darkinsky]

a frenchie rather likes to think from butt than from brain, thats why they lost in WW2 and got occupied by germans

 

[VelocuR]

Those terrorist not living in India for years ..... Musaraff forget one basic thing ... how can worlds biggest terrorist hide within Army backyard for years without anyone's knowledge ?????

No, he has been moving alot and met different wives in different places and times. Again, we haven't seen his body and didn't bought to International Court for justice (like Saddam, Gaddafi, Mubarak, Serbia criminal, etc). There is no proof of his body we desperately waiting for many years....Aside fake propagandas and photoshopped pictures/videos, we haven't witnessed any real OBL, that's matter most.

Don't need to blame ISI, let we move on.

 

[MastanKhan]

Mush will always be a disappointment to me. When he came to power the stage was set. He could have gone down in history as our Attaturk. People were fed up of PNL twice and PPP. He should have used popularity and his support for war on terror (keep Americans quite) by launching an extermination of all the parasites and their familys.

Today there should have been no bilawal nor nawaz sharif etc He was not ruthless enough

Hi,

Here is a problem---you dump the failure on one person---you can't do that---. There was a team with Musharraf and that team failed----.

His first choice was Shahbaz---condemn him---his second choice was Imran Khan---condemn him---they both failed to take charge when they were offered the position---. Ataturk was not the only person doing his thing----there was a team with a vision surrounding him that made it happem.

For that team---turkey was first----. Pakistanis when they learn that pakistan comes first----and not afghanistan---and let afghans fight their own wars---then pakistan will have an Ataturk---.

Drone strikes are extremely effective against the terrorists---. That is why they are screaming murder against it---. For that reason they have to hide in the populated areas and move around at times with women and children---.

When you pakistanisi had the oppurtunity---you should have killed these people escaping into pakistan---right then and there---now you are paying the price for your 'islamic brotherhood'.

Now as for your last comment---you were right---Musharraf could not stab anyone---face to face---forget behind the back----he could not provide justice----that is what let him down----if the only good deed he had done was to provide justice---people would have died for him.

After OBL, Clinton even ordered an air strike in Sudan and then one in AFG. Do you not know this?

Hi,

To the indian colleague---the strike that was made on obl camp in afg---the tomahawk cruise missiles flew over pakistan---3 or 4 of them fell in pakistan---a couple of them had very minor damage----from there we constructed our babur cruise missile.

 

[alibaz]

I love the response.

 

[Mav3rick]

No mate we needed someone who had the masses with him. Can you imagine if he had exterminated lets say 1000 to 2000 in Pakistan all the corrupt parasites and their families. The people would have been with him, he shouldnt have entertained any of those political leaders.

Your assumption is incorrect. It was the same population that thronged to receive Benazir/Nawaz. Musharraf might have been able to get rid of Nawaz in 1999 but there wasn't anything else he could do. Pakistanis have supported Benzair/Nawaz/Zardari etc. and will continue to do so. We are more loyal to political parties then to Pakistan! This is a country where even Zardari enjoys loyalty of my fellow Pakistanis, this is a country where even today people state that they will vote for PPPP.

We deserve these leaders because we continue to vote them into power. We deserve this fate my friend.

 

[Mav3rick]

Hi,

Here is a problem---you dump the failure on one person---you can't do that---. There was a team with Musharraf and that team failed----.

His first choice was Shahbaz---condemn him---his second choice was Imran Khan---condemn him---they both failed to take charge when they were offered the position---. Ataturk was not the only person doing his thing----there was a team with a vision surrounding him that made it happem.

For that team---turkey was first----. Pakistanis when they learn that pakistan comes first----and not afghanistan---and let afghans fight their own wars---then pakistan will have an Ataturk---.

Correct.

Drone strikes are extremely effective against the terrorists---. That is why they are screaming murder against it---. For that reason they have to hide in the populated areas and move around at times with women and children---.

Drone strikes will be effective only if they are being operated by Pakistani Military otherwise everyone considers them to be an attack on our sovereignty. Besides non-Pakistanis cannot care for collateral as our own can (I'm very optimistic ).

When you pakistanisi had the oppurtunity---you should have killed these people escaping into pakistan---right then and there---now you are paying the price for your 'islamic brotherhood'.

You mean we should have killed refugees seeking shelter, apparently?

Now as for your last comment---you were right---Musharraf could not stab anyone---face to face---forget behind the back----he could not provide justice----that is what let him down----if the only good deed he had done was to provide justice---people would have died for him.

As you said yourself, Musharraf was not alone and honestly he could not do everything himself. With passage of time, because of my beloved fellow countrymen, Musharraf became increasingly dependent on political parties which eventually led to his downfall. If only he hadn't taken off his uniform!

Hi,

To the indian colleague---the strike that was made on obl camp in afg---the tomahawk cruise missiles flew over pakistan---3 or 4 of them fell in pakistan---a couple of them had very minor damage----from there we constructed our babur cruise missile.

With the help of China , I love reverse engineering.

 

[Free Soul]

You mean we should have killed refugees seeking shelter, apparently?

In my opinion Mastan wasn’t talking about refugees there, and you know that too.

Mastan was pointing out the fact that those terrorists were never a US problem, they were more of a problem for us. So we should have made sure that if someone a warlord, former mercenary, Taliban was planning to get in to Pakistan, then for the sake of our country we should have made double the effort to neutralize the threat of them sabotaging Pakistan. Which Pakistan did best to its ability. Problem is the people themselves see the Taliban and Al-Qaeda and suchlike morons butchering, literally Butchering people and their family in front of them and still hold sympathy for them, i can only feel sorry for them....

Though in my opinion the thought of making sure no one crosses border too is a very naive and simplistic (like we should have killed the terrorists and extremists that were crossing the border to Pakistan after Tora Bora and such post 9/11)

It’s damn easy for few thousand persons to cross a porous border that comprises of mountains the HinduKush range. The border its self is what roughly 1200 KMs ? right. Even if a military places a single column of soldiers all along the border to guard it takes roughly 800,000 men to do that.

I am just putting this forward so that civies get an idea what defending means.

Ta

Free Soul

 

[Awesome]

Invalid comparison.

You know someone is hiding and trying to find him vs you do not something but to discover it.

However it is possible that OBL managed to hide but too many indications are there to believe he was hidden by someone.

Actually, there isn't even one.

 

[Jango]

Your assumption is incorrect. It was the same population that thronged to receive Benazir/Nawaz. Musharraf might have been able to get rid of Nawaz in 1999 but there wasn't anything else he could do. Pakistanis have supported Benzair/Nawaz/Zardari etc. and will continue to do so. We are more loyal to political parties then to Pakistan! This is a country where even Zardari enjoys loyalty of my fellow Pakistanis, this is a country where even today people state that they will vote for PPPP.

We deserve these leaders because we continue to vote them into power. We deserve this fate my friend.

Correction here, Pakistanis are not loyal to these goons, some select people are.

And for reasons everybody knows, being in the same vilage, baradri sstem, waderas and CHaudhary thing.

 

[Free Soul]

Correction here, Pakistanis are not loyal to these goons, some select people are.

And for reasons everybody knows, being in the same vilage, baradri sstem, waderas and CHaudhary thing.

Both you and Mav3rick are stating the obvious truth.

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Clever thinking.