Musharraf Lies onace again

[Awesome]

On balance, Gen Musharraf has much to answer for, and properly, in a court of law, for his many wrongs. To allow him to go unpunished only encourages the next person to get away with more egregiously horrible acts, and that cannot be good for Pakistan.

I think he doesn't. Legally speaking that is. That's why they are trying him only for these cases.

Of the three cases against him, none of them have any substance, even the one about deposing the constitution.

As President he had the right to declare emergency in the country and he did and that suspends the constitution.

Then he can fire the judges.

I agree on the bit about, that he should answer these in courts, but disagree that he should go punished.

His were political mistakes, not legal ones. Legally he had all that authority so he just used it.

 

[Awesome]

oh really..... this is the mentality that got Balochistan into this mess today...

hope SC hangs mushrraf for his crimes of killing Nawab Akbar Khan Bughti.

Then please hang every soldier who has killed Taliban too as there was no difference between them and Bugti who had an army against Pakistan. He died fighting the PA, if he had surrendered to them, there would have been no issue.

Read your constitution - it clearly states no military operation may be brought in a court of law for purview.

If Balochistan has an issue with the killing of Bugti - I don't care... Pakistan ke khilaaf jo bhi army khara karega, kill him. No need to entertain any cry babies on that.

 

[W.11]

What do Pakistanis think of Musharraf beeing in power if he wins the elections?
Isnt it better then now or will it be worse?

he cant win he knows that, there are two parties who have kidnapped pakistan through politics and these are equal to mafias, his effort will be to dent these mafias as much as possible

 

[Argus Panoptes]

I think he doesn't. Legally speaking that is. That's why they are trying him only for these cases.

Of the three cases against him, none of them have any substance, even the one about deposing the constitution.

As President he had the right to declare emergency in the country and he did and that suspends the constitution.

Then he can fire the judges.

I agree on the bit about, that he should answer these in courts, but disagree that he should go punished.

His were political mistakes, not legal ones. Legally he had all that authority so he just used it.

Sir, just how did Gen Musharraf declare himself President in 1999? Was that legal? What followed was equally illegal, and needs to be brought to justice in a court of law.

 

[blain2]

can i tell you a secret?
"everyone learns from past experiences", shhhhhh dont tell anyone

Yes but unlike the PPP and PML-N leadership, someone with average IQ does not repeat the same mistakes.

Sir, just how did Gen Musharraf declare himself President in 1999? Was that legal? What followed was equally illegal, and needs to be brought to justice in a court of law.

It became legal because the Supreme Court of Pakistan approved the takeover. Legally in a court of law, Musharraf has coverage.

Perhaps in the future the SCP will not endorse military takeovers. That is how you ensure such things do not happen in the future.

 

[Argus Panoptes]

Yes but unlike the PPP and PML-N leadership, someone with average IQ does not repeat the same mistakes.



It became legal because the Supreme Court of Pakistan approved the takeover. Legally in a court of law, Musharraf has coverage.

Perhaps in the future the SCP will not endorse military takeovers. That is how you ensure such things wont happen in the future.

You make a good point, but it is somewhat hard to argue points of law with a gun pointed at one's head, no?

Consent or approval under duress or after the fact is not legal.

 

[Leader]

Then please hang every soldier who has killed Taliban too as there was no difference between them and Bugti who had an army against Pakistan. He died fighting the PA, if he had surrendered to them, there would have been no issue.

Read your constitution - it clearly states no military operation may be brought in a court of law for purview.

If Balochistan has an issue with the killing of Bugti - I don't care... Pakistan ke khilaaf jo bhi army khara karega, kill him. No need to entertain any cry babies on that.

dont act stupid...

Akbar Bughti was one of the founding father of Pakistan...you killed him for demanding the rights of its people...and justify it... ??? unbelievable !!

P.S. so the military action was sanctioned by the parliament ? ya bas asay hi ja ker jis ko dil karay mar do ?? acha constitution para hai tum nay... baaten jungle mein rehnay walo jese kertay ho.... wah !!

 

[blain2]

Nope... In last day, I remember a Agreement did happen between Government and Lal Masjid Claric, that that Lal Masjid Claric will leave this place, but in the night army still did operation. And in the end 100s of ladies were missing, who are known to be killed.

Army Jawans died in Swat operation due to increase support of Radio Mullah, who gather people while using Lal Masjid Incident.

You are either absolutely misinformed or telling a half-truth!

Name me one family of a missing woman or girl that has opened up a case against the government for their missing womenfolk. An outright and disgusting lie that continues to weave its way through the minds of some.

Army operation only happened when armed people did not come out of the compound despite multiple deadlines.

Lets be absolutely clear, in the Islamic Republic of Pakistan, NO group or entity is allowed to carry arms without appropriate licenses. NO group or entity is allowed to take up arms against the Government of Pakistan. Get clarity of thought on this issue. Otherwise Pakistan will become an anarchist state with conditions much worse than today. Anarchy spreads when every Tom, Dick or Harry thinks he is the Khalifa. Even in a minimally Islamic state, this cannot be allowed.

The Saudis, Egyptians and Algerians would have torn down the Lal Masjid compound without regard for anyone. Give thanks that the GoP does not act in such a way. In reality, its probably a weakness of ours which is why everyone flouts the laws here.

 

[Leader]

Yes but unlike the PPP and PML-N leadership, someone with average IQ does not repeat the same mistakes.



It became legal because the Supreme Court of Pakistan approved the takeover. Legally in a court of law, Musharraf has coverage.

Perhaps in the future the SCP will not endorse military takeovers. That is how you ensure such things do not happen in the future.

court didnt approve the take over, the take over itself is illegal. however, law of necessity and desire for stabilization of the State, law grants time to hand over power back to its real owners, the representatives.... this is de facto

further the problem is when mushy got 3 years, he not only elected a parliament but also got himself as president through LFO. hence continued its reign...

 

[blain2]

dont act stupid...

Akbar Bughti was one of the founding father of Pakistan...you killed him for demanding the rights of its people...and justify it... ??? unbelievable !!

P.S. so the military action was sanctioned by the parliament ? ya bas asay hi ja ker jis ko dil karay mar do ?? acha constitution para hai tum nay... baaten jungle mein rehnay walo jese kertay ho.... wah !!

Akbar Bugti, a founding father? Nawab Mehrab went along with the Pakistan movement. His son, Akbar Bugti was a 20 year old elitist chap who took the best that Pakistan had to offer, yet still took up arms against the government for his very own sub-tribe all the while other Bugtis were rotting after being kicked out of their own native lands. Now when the Government intervened on their behalf, Bugti sahib resorted to the gun. Bugti sahib's story should not be linked with the overall dissatisfaction issue. That is something that all past governments are responsible for and is a collective failure.

Contrary to common perception, in matters of national security, not all issues have to be brought to the entire parliament. This does not happen in any Country with a parliamentary system.

Last I checked, our officers are not in the business of carrying out suicide bombings. We lost 4 senior officers, including a CO, in the bomb blast that took place inside of the cave. The reality is that Bugti sahib and team were cornered and the officers went in to negotiate surrender and Bugti and team decided to commit suicide taking along the officers and all of the people inside of the cave.

 

[Jango]

dont act stupid...

Akbar Bughti was one of the founding father of Pakistan...you killed him for demanding the rights of its people...and justify it... ??? unbelievable !!

P.S. so the military action was sanctioned by the parliament ? ya bas asay hi ja ker jis ko dil karay mar do ?? acha constitution para hai tum nay... baaten jungle mein rehnay walo jese kertay ho.... wah !!

You have a whole army of armed men residing in Dera Bugti and you then ask for rights...? Seems absurd to say the least. Why don't we label Taliban exactly in the same bracket as well then? They are also demanding rights, they are also wielding weapons...?

 

[khanboy007]

Musharaf didnt kill Bugti, Bugti was a terrorist who blew Gas pipelines and Power Transmission lines on Daily basis, His men even tried to blow up the train tracks! Army went to catch him, he was hiding in a cave! then he attacked other soldiers with Rocket launcher in the cave and the cave collapsed he died along with soldiers! it was a suicide!

EXACTLY, bugti was a PR!CK

now here is what happened (I presume that im right, as an experienced gamer,and games that are highly close to the real world physics nowadays this is what i can conclude),

when you project a rocket out of a rocket launcher it (rocket) rotates around in a specific radius, since the rocket launcher was heavily used earlier (for destruction) the radius increased as it expanded and the projected rocket MUST have had an edge struck in the cave, hence the force acted on the rocket by the cave resulted in change in direction, hence the direction changed and struck the cave and as a result the entrance collapsed..... thats how the cave could have collapsed

im pretty sure that's what's happened

here is an example
check out at 7:26 once the rocket is fired (it kinda rotates in a radius) or if you have GTA IV you can experiment it

 

[Argus Panoptes]

You have a whole army of armed men residing in Dera Bugti and you then ask for rights...? Seems absurd to say the least. Why don't we label Taliban exactly in the same bracket as well then? They are also demanding rights, they are also wielding weapons...?

Demanding rights is not illegal. Taking up arms against the state surely is a crime. However, the tendency to take up arms in pursuit of rights usually arises only if political venues are denied persistently and unfairly.

 

[Leader]

Akbar Bugti, a founding father? Nawab Mehrab went along with the Pakistan movement. His son, Akbar Bugti was a 20 year old elitist chap who took the best that Pakistan had to offer, yet still took up arms against the government for his very own sub-tribe all the while other Bugtis were rotting after being kicked out of their own native lands. Now when the Government intervened on their behalf, Bugti sahib resorted to the gun. Bugti sahib's story should not be linked with the overall dissatisfaction issue. That is something that all past governments are responsible for and is a collective failure.

Contrary to common perception, in matters of national security, not all issues have to be brought to the entire parliament. This does not happen in any Country with a parliamentary system.

Last I checked, our officers are not in the business of carrying out suicide bombings. We lost 4 senior officers, including a CO, in the bomb blast that took place inside of the cave. The reality is that Bugti sahib and team were cornered and the officers went in to negotiate surrender and Bugti and team decided to commit suicide taking along the officers and all of the people inside of the cave.

come on.....when you start a made up story, the first person you try to fool is yourself, and the second person who doesnot know history, unfortunately for you I know how things unfolded....

I am not in mood to go counter, but like to see an inquiry into the matter and get the culprits jailed or hanged..so that Balochistan may feel part of pakistan..

You have a whole army of armed men residing in Dera Bugti and you then ask for rights...? Seems absurd to say the least. Why don't we label Taliban exactly in the same bracket as well then? They are also demanding rights, they are also wielding weapons...?

I am not saying that its right, but this is not the way to go about, especially when we exploit their rights..., try that on LeJ/SSP and in Karachi Mafias and in Interior Sindh... fooj ki wahan phat jati hai action kartay?

whatever is going on in Balochistan is because of what the army did...

 

[Contrarian]

The Saudis, Egyptians and Algerians would have torn down the Lal Masjid compound without regard for anyone. Give thanks that the GoP does not act in such a way. In reality, its probably a weakness of ours which is why everyone flouts the laws here.

In hindsight it was a mistake not to do so. Had Musharraf literally torn down the walls and demolished the site, no one else would dared to keep arms and ammo in a masjid.

It was a lot like the Golden temple operation for India. Everyone condemns that India Army went in with guns and whatnot to kill the terrorists, but no Sikh is willing to say that keeping Anti-aircraft rifles and what not in the golden temple was desecrating the temple and what led the Army to enter the place.

Be that as it may, after the heavy handed episode, no one has done so again - no mandir, masjid, or gurudwara.