Morocco’s Message: Beware Iran’s African Inroads

[Falcon29]

They are the same people who martyred 11 Imams.

They're the worst of human beings on earth beside zionists and we can't expect anything more than them.

A group of people who martyred their own prophe's house and nowadays kill tens of people in suicide attacks to go to heaven what can more except from them?!!

The British successfully established wahhabism in 18th century and then they looted Jannat Al Baghi and Karbala and fought against Ottomans and Egyptians on behalf of British and then they sold first qibla of Muslims to British scums.

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What a ridiculous post, you could not even name these 11 Imam's off top of your head without using google. It's just political grudge you have between ancient Arabia and ancient Persia. You don't anything about the Imam's, and many of them died natural deaths. The 'martrying' is from your own fabrications in your fabricated ahadeeth books which also claim Prophet's wife Aisha(who he was given assurance by God that she will be one of his wives in Jannah) poisoned. This is all of result Safavid conquest of Iran and the hatred towards Islam and attempted falsification of Islamic sources.

 

[SalarHaqq]

Can you prove that? Maybe the mods and administators can check their IP or something?

But it's true that Shias don't really have roots in the Maghreb. Northern Africa has been traditionally sunni and with the exception of the Iran-Iraq War,generally uninterested in Iranian matters,unless I'm mistaken.

To begin with, I'd subscribe to the point made by Mohsen: Islamic Iran obviously is not dependent on Shia communities to establish alliances. Its message furthermore reverberates with Muslims and even non-Muslims worldwide.

This said, Shia Islam did pretty much have a presence in north Africa during certain periods of history.

Look up the Ismaili Fatimid califate in Egypt. Ismailism is considered a branch of Shia Islam.

Then consider the 8th century Idrisid kingdom of Morocco. Some historians believe its rulers were Shia Muslims, probably from the Zaydi branch. Others assert they were Sunni, but acknowledge that Idris I, founder of the dynasty had strong Shia sympathies.

On another note, in Algeria they had a ruling dynasty of Iranian descent - although neither Shia nor Sunni but Ibadi, namely the Rustamids, who were in power from 707 to 909.

 

[Falcon29]

@Foinikas ...you asked me if I have a proof..well Arab_fighter just confessed he is Israeli...BATMAN account was and is still manned by someone who said he is Jewish...so now we have to wait for falcon29 to come out of the closet...lol..

I have no ax to grind against them ..their colony is an enemy of my native land and I will treat them as enemy...nothing personal or racist.

Hiding behind false flags accounts is the most dishonest tactic they use but I guess they justify it in their minds.

How funny is it to accuse others of false flagging when numerous Iranian members here use vpn's and actually put up false flags.... Like our 'Greek' friend in the thread, who is nothing more or less than an Iranian.

 

[Foinikas]

To begin with, I'd subscribe to the point made by Mohsen: Islamic Iran does not need Shia communities to establish alliances.

That said, Shia Islam was pretty much present in northern Africa during certain periods of history as well.

Look up the Ismaili Fatimid califate in Egypt. Ismailism is considered a branch of Shia Islam.

Then consider the 8th Idrisid kingdom of Morocco. Some historians believe its rulers were Shia Muslims, probably from the Zaydi branch. Others assert they were Sunni, but acknowledge that Idris I, founder of the dynasty had Shia sympathies.

On another noten, in Algeria they had a ruling dynasty of Iranian descent - although neither Shia nor Sunni but Ibadi, namely the Rustamids, who were in power from 707 to 909.

No I agreed with him eventually. It's just that in my mind I have more traditionally Shia places for Iran's sphere of influence,you know like Lebanon,Iraq,Syria,North Yemen and Bahrain.

 

[Falcon29]

To begin with, I'd subscribe to the point made by Mohsen: Islamic Iran does not need Shia communities to establish alliances.

That said, Shia Islam was pretty much present in northern Africa during certain periods of history as well.

Look up the Ismaili Fatimid califate in Egypt. Ismailism is considered a branch of Shia Islam.

Then consider the 8th Idrisid kingdom of Morocco. Some historians believe its rulers were Shia Muslims, probably from the Zaydi branch. Others assert they were Sunni, but acknowledge that Idris I, founder of the dynasty had Shia sympathies.

On another noten, in Algeria they had a ruling dynasty of Iranian descent - although neither Shia nor Sunni but Ibadi, namely the Rustamids, who were in power from 707 to 909.

Historical Shia's had no affiliation to Iran or modern day sect of Twelver Shiasm. Historical Shia's were no different to Sunni Muslims.

Fatamid dynasty was led by Shia elite but most inhabitants were Sunni. That's why these dynasties easily switched places often.

 

[SalarHaqq]

Historical Shia's had no affiliation to Iran or modern day sect of Twelver Shiasm. Historical Shia's were no different to Sunni Muslims.

Twelver Shia Islam precedes modern times and is not native to Iran.

 

[Falcon29]

Twelver Shia Islam precedes modern times and is not native to Iran.

Modern day Twelver Shiasm began with the Safavid dynasty in Iran. Other historical Shia sects belief in different Imam's, and different numbers of them. And use different sources for their rulings/beliefs. Modern day Twelver Shiasm is mostly unique to Iran, and Iran was able to influence few Iraqi's/Pakistani's and Lebanese with such beliefs.

 

[Foinikas]

Do you have no shame to false flag as native Greek, talk down every nationality, then turn around and start making pro-Iran posts? Why are you false flagging? We all know you are an Iranian national.

I'm not talking down every nationality,what the heck are you saying? I'm trying to keep a neutral stance between you Arabs and Persians. And If I talk about Morocco,Algerians will get angry. If I talk about Algeria,Moroccans will get angry. If I support the Arabs,Persians will get angry,if I don't support the Arabs,they will get angry. Yala khalas,shoo bidak? :S Ana mushfahem!

Like our 'Greek' friend in the thread, who is nothing more or less than an Iranian.

You hear that @aryobarzan @Bahram Esfandiari @SalarHaqq ? Apparently I'm Persian now.
First I was "indian" when I came to this forum,then "israeli" and now I'm "Iranian".
What do I have to do to prove I'm greek? Truth is I've been told many times that I look like a Turk,Arab,Armenian,Israeli and one or two times Kurd,Persian.

 

[SalarHaqq]

Modern day Twelver Shiasm began with the Safavid dynasty in Iran.

It's much older. Very early on during their rule, the Safavids promoted Lebanese and Iraqi Twelver Shia ulema to positions of religious authority to help construct their state. Therefore Twelver Shia Muslims were present in Lebanon (part of the Ottoman empire) and Iraq.

Iran pit itself against Taliban and no one else. Don't come here to try to fool people, who supported Northern Alliance in Afghanistan in the 90's against the Taliban which led to massacre of 7,000 Taliban prisoners at hand of Hazara's?

1) A Sunni Uzbek commander, Abdul Malik Pahlawan, was accused of ordering the execution of Taliban captives.

2) Not even the Taliban themselves claim to have lost 7000 men in that incident.

3) Iran never directed Pahlawan to execute Taliban prisoners. This event - if accurately described by the Taliban, is unrelated to Iran.

4) Both sides in the 1990's Afghan civil war committed massacres. The Taliban then took it out on civilians in Mazare Sharif, which is even worse. Yet, neither Iran nor the Taliban are interested in dwelling on the events of the 1990's, as both sides have made clear by their declarations and actions.

Which is why Taliban responded by attacking your diplomats.

There's no proof for Taliban involvement in this attack. The Taliban did not claim it, and the sole survivor of the killings has accused another group of being behind it.

Even now, your media is inciting against Taliban, referring to them as a US plot to harm Iran's interests and revolution.

Not really. Most Iranian media are not adopting this kind of a line but noting normalized relations between the two sides.

 

[LeGenD]

This thread is bordering sectarianism now. This should stop.

Secondly, who is who is not to be questioned openly. Difference of opinion exist in all countries. Thanks.

 

[Falcon29]

It's much older than that. Very early on during their rule, the Safavids promoted Lebanese and Iraqi Twelver Shia ulema to positions of religious authority to help construct their state.

No it isn't, Twelver Sect began with Safavid dynasty in Iran. Core beliefs and non-core beliefs of Twelver sect differ from original and historical Shia sects. Ismaili and Zaydi Shia sects differ in core and non-core beliefs and use their own unique ahadeeth collections. You can argue Safavid dyansty in Iran tried to declare official Twelver sect and unite numerous Shia sects under this umbrella(this did not eliminate different schools of thought within Shia Islam), but that still makes it modern day sect and school of thought.

This thread is bordering sectarianism now. This should stop.

Secondly, who is who is not to be questioned openly. Difference of opinion exist in all countries. Thanks.

It is normal conversation brother, not heated or anything. No need to be overly critical on the forum. Some extent of discussion on sensitive subjects should be allowed if it is healthy discussion. As far country flags go, I thought we are supposed to put our real flags up but it doesn't bother me anyways. We know whom are whom.

 

[Foinikas]

We know whom are whom.

Are you sure? I think you are a bit confused.

 

[SalarHaqq]

You hear that @aryobarzan @Bahram Esfandiari @SalarHaqq ? Apparently I'm Persian now.
First I was "indian" when I came to this forum,then "israeli" and now I'm "Iranian".
What do I have to do to prove I'm greek? Truth is I've been told many times that I look like a Turk,Arab,Armenian,Israeli and one or two times Kurd,Persian.

It's a bizarre habit of the user. He has a record of attributing nationalities, religious denominations and user identities to others. He for instance suggested that Sineva is Iranian when in fact he's from New Zealand. Same with mazeto, an Indian user. Also, he kept claiming I am the same person as Aspen, a Pakistani forum member, and that I live in Florida when I'm actually in western Europe. Etc.

 

[Foinikas]

This is a bizarre habit of the user. He has a record of attributing nationalities, religious denominations and user identities to others. He for instance suggested that Sineva is Iranian when in fact he's from New Zealand. Same with mazeto, a non-Muslim (if I remember correctly) Indian user. Also, he kept claiming I am the same as Aspen, a Pakistani forum member. Examples abound.

You are Pakistani though,right? Or...Arab from Belgium? Sorry,I don't know.

 

[Falcon29]

This is a bizarre habit of the user. He has a record of attributing nationalities, religious denominations and user identities to others. He for instance suggested that Sineva is Iranian when in fact he's from New Zealand. Same with mazeto, a non-Muslim (if I remember correctly) Indian user. Also, he kept claiming I am the same as Aspen, a Pakistani forum member. Examples abound.

Sineva's not Iranian? Since when?

He nationality is Iranian, he is born or raised wherever.

There are no Indian Hindu's posting pro-Iranian regime talking points all over the forum. Get real and stop being dense.