Mistrust still thwarts efforts to make peace between India and Pakistan

[nForce]

predictable doesn't mean trustworthy... I mean't predictable and trustworthy - both.

Okay, may be I need to explain myself here. The moves of India and Pakistan are more or less predictable to each other. However, we don't trust each other. Example ? The nations were created out of mistrust.

 

[Donatello]

predictable doesn't mean trustworthy... I mean't predictable and trustworthy - both.
We absolutely trust the notion that Pakistani military will not give up it's asymmetric designs on India. That is a trusted narrative, actions to establish this narrative is the predictable part, sometime there are some un-predictable jolts like kargil. But more or less we can trust that we will always face a hostile force on our western border.

When Indian Military, politicians, Bollywood and media can have fetish about Pakistan and what happens there. Always treat Pakistan as the enemy to the dumb Indian populace, then sure, we don't trust India as well.

 

[MilSpec]

Okay, may be I need to explain myself here. The moves of India and Pakistan are more or less predictable to each other. However, we don't trust each other. Example ? The nations were created out of mistrust.

Mistrust?
Dear, I think you are smudging your history. There was no Mistrust, there either. Demands were made to INC leadership, we declined, they went their own way (forgetting the fourteen points for their own minorities... offcourse)
This I thought was quite clear cut.

 

[nForce]

When Indian Military, politicians, Bollywood and media can have fetish about Pakistan and what happens there. Always treat Pakistan as the enemy to the dumb Indian populace, then sure, we don't trust India as well.

Let me assure you mistrust has far deeper roots than Bollywood. Terrorism for example ?

 

[MilSpec]

When Indian Military, politicians, Bollywood and media can have fetish about Pakistan and what happens there. Always treat Pakistan as the enemy to the dumb Indian populace, then sure, we don't trust India as well.

Indian Military has to be concerned: It has to face a volatile force on it's borders which is the 7th largest standing force on th planet...
Bollywood: Not sure what percentage of movies are even concerned with pakistan,
Politicians: Most don't care other foreign policy and minority vote bank people.

As far as your trust is concerned, Indian Boogeyman Syndrome is bread and butter for most of you. Say for least your entire defense policy is aimed at deterrence value against "India", and national policy about not "being India"

 

[nForce]

Mistrust?
Dear, I think you are smudging your history. There was no Mistrust, there either. Demands were made to INC leadership, we declined, they went their own way (forgetting the fourteen points for their own minorities... offcourse)
This I thought was quite clear cut.

The fourteen points came into being out of mistrust. I will not go into the roles of Muslim elites, but mistrust among general public started growing from that stage. And now the situation is when Pakistan tries to buy military hardware, India tries to block it, when there is flood in Pakistan, they accuse India.

 

[MilSpec]

The fourteen points came into being out of mistrust.

I am very sorry but I absolutely disagree with you....

 

[nForce]

I am very sorry but I absolutely disagree with you....

What is your take on the matter ?

 

[livingdead]

I dont think its mistrust, its just the the core issue(kashmir) is impossible to solve in a way acceptable to all the 3 parties.

 

[nForce]

I dont think its mistrust, its just the the core issue(kashmir) is impossible to solve in a way acceptable to all the 3 parties.

Pakistani army regulars infiltrate into Kashmir while our PM was busy waving olive branch in Lahore and you are saying we have a lot of trust ?

There is a severe trust deficit and the issues creating that trust deficit have to be addressed first.

 

[livingdead]

Pakistani army regulars infiltrate into Kashmir while our PM was busy waving olive branch in Lahore and you are saying we have a lot of trust ?

There is a severe trust deficit and the issues creating that trust deficit have to be addressed first.

agra smmit happened within few years of kargil, and we laid red carpet for the architect of the war...obviously GoI trusted musharaf to deliver because there was many secret talks after that.
we dont trust them 100 percent but that is not msjor issue, the nature of problem makes it difficult.

 

[Donatello]

Indian Military has to be concerned: It has to face a volatile force on it's borders which is the 7th largest standing force on th planet...
Bollywood: Not sure what percentage of movies are even concerned with pakistan,
Politicians: Most don't care other foreign policy and minority vote bank people.

As far as your trust is concerned, Indian Boogeyman Syndrome is bread and butter for most of you. Say for least your entire defense policy is aimed at deterrence value against "India", and national policy about not "being India"

Nope it isn't....because the the same Indian Army that faces a nuclear power, Pakistan Army has to deal with it as well.....a force that is larger than it's own.

It is natural that we will be paranoid about anything Indians say or do. No one gives a fcuk about Afghanistan or Iran. But India we do. Try telling Israelis to trust Egyptians/Syrians or Jordanians and Iraqis. So our paranoia is built in because of conventional mismatch. However, the Nukes on both sides make sure that we have a safety net to fall on when shyt really hits the fan.

 

[nForce]

agra smmit happened within few years of kargil, and we laid red carpet for the architect of the war...obviously GoI trusted musharaf to deliver because there was many secret talks after that.
we dont trust them 100 percent but that is not msjor issue, the nature of problem makes it difficult.

We have never been sincere with any of these Peace-Summits, otherwise things would have been resolved decades back.

Status quo suits India perfectly well, and the Pakistani army needs a common enemy, a bogeyman in Hindu India. So, no deal.

 

[Donatello]

Let me assure you mistrust has far deeper roots than Bollywood. Terrorism for example ?

Yes, like Indians using their so called 'proxies' in Afghanistan consulates to launch attacks in Pakistan?
Yea, i am sure you will deny that. Except, with the recent Afghan peace talks almost entirely in Pakistan's hand, Pakistan's increasing reach on ground in Afghanistan, means the attacks have shown a downward trend in Pakistan.....packing up Indians in Afghanistan and prompting verbal diarrhea from the likes of your Doval and Parrikar.

So you can play your victim card all you want, but if you haven't noticed, that 2001-12 blood period is over. The world really doesn't care much for Indian dramas.

So either the things will remain as they are because of the past or move forward.

We have never been sincere with any of these Peace-Summits, otherwise things would have been resolved decades back.

Status quo suits India perfectly well, and the Pakistani army needs a common enemy, a bogeyman in Hindu India. So, no deal.

And India needs a Pakistan....to justify its failings to its own people.

Funny how things really work both ways, yet the internet saffron warrior chooses to be ignorant, naive and clueless.

 

[dray]

Fauji Sahib.. I don't think you will find many takers for your shop-owner argument either.
If you want to portray the hindu-Muslim divide, then probably we will need better examples.

It's not about Hindu Muslim divide, and certainly not about 'caste'! India shares good relations with many Muslim countries.