Minister asks Pakistani women to dress properly in Saudi Arabia

[abdulbarijan]

Could you please just answer the questions , they're all i have left because my arguement is based on double standards and iv pretty much exposed it all myself.

-I don't need to because, I never even contested any of those points ... e.g. I never said women shouldn't be allowed to drive. I never said that there won't be any repercussions for dressing provocatively, I never stated that all women who wear the burqa wear it by choice etc.

-The points I made were specifically about how being a hijabi does not equal being oppressed, that there are certain pro's to being one and the double standards of how we interpret oppression while we define empowerment as choice ( you yourself did), but we turn a blind eye to the societal expectations and their negative effects on women in the west. The lack of their choices in terms of determining a role for themselves as begotten by such societal expectations and economic terms i.e. cost of living and peer pressure. The hardships they have to face as a result of again, societal expectations, the standards of beauty and the begotten ills because if it (depression, eating disorders etc.). You like to pretend that you have a case, by always trying to change the discussion usually by asking unrelated questions which you frame in a certain way, but you simply forgot to give any evidence for your own claims. Your yourself seem to forget that your own narrative is exactly what I use to make my point. You seem to forget that intellectual consistency is a thing, but if you debate me I'll just keep reminding you of your double standards while you make futile attempts to drag the argument on points which were never originally argued.

Because I am Saudi as well. This is why I think i pretty much do have say for what i want in my homeland.

Well your a false flagger too then lol! ... I assumed you were a Pakistani which is why I argued the said point.

 

[Manama]

Well your a false flagger too then lol! ... I assumed you were a Pakistani which is why I argued the said point.

lol nah im Saudi from my mother's side and Pakistani from my father's. Currently residing here tho

 

[TheLahoriGuy]

-I don't need to because, I never even contested any of those points ... e.g. I never said women shouldn't be allowed to drive. I never said that there won't be any repercussions for dressing provocatively, I never stated that all women who wear the burqa wear it by choice etc.

-The points I made were specifically about how being a hijabi does not equal being oppressed, that there are certain pro's to being one and the double standards of how we interpret oppression while we define empowerment as choice ( you yourself did), but we turn a blind eye to the societal expectations and their negative effects on women in the west. The lack of their choices in terms of determining a role for themselves as begotten by such societal expectations and economic terms i.e. cost of living and peer pressure. The hardships they have to face as a result of again, societal expectations, the standards of beauty and the begotten ills because if it (depression, eating disorders etc.). You like to pretend that you have a case, by always trying to change the discussion usually by asking unrelated questions which you frame in a certain way, but you simply forgot to give any evidence for your own claims. Your yourself seem to forget that your own narrative is exactly what I use to make my point. You seem to forget that intellectual consistency is a thing, but if you debate me I'll just keep reminding you of your double standards while you make futile attempts to drag the argument on points which were never originally argued.

Well your a false flagger too then lol! ... I assumed you were a Pakistani which is why I argued the said point.

And there you have it a saudi who herself doesnt agree with all that youve argued for, i think her opinion is valued alot more than ours.Also can you try to actually answer anything iv asked rather than gloating or putting down my arguement. What evidence do you need ? I mean seriously do you also want evidence that the earth in round ? Does something not come off as common sense to you. Youve literally turned a blind eye to everyhing. Is a society that forces women to wear something or act a certain way better than one where each individual is expected to work for their bread ? Is the societal expectation of being slim much greater a burden than being born and labeled as a baby maker with no right to opt out of. Is the depression of not being beautiful greater than the depression that comes from having your life dictated to you. Could you for once without bringing anything else up answer these questions ?

 

[abdulbarijan]

lol nah im Saudi from my mother's side and Pakistani from my father's. Currently residing here tho

Alrighty!

And there you have it a saudi who herself doesnt agree with all that youve argued for, i think her opinion is valued alot more than ours.Also can you try to actually answer anything iv asked rather than gloating or putting down my arguement. What evidence do you need ? I mean seriously do you also want evidence that the earth in round ? Does something not come off as common sense to you. Youve literally turned a blind eye to everyhing. Is a society that forces women to wear something or act a certain way better than one where each individual is expected to work for their bread ? Is the societal expectation of being slim much greater a burden than being born and labeled as a baby maker with no right to opt out of. Is the depression of not being beautiful greater than the depression that comes from having your life dictated to you. Could you for once without bringing anything else up answer these questions ?

-Again, thank you for literally demonstrating that you don't actually contest points, your only aim is to argue for the sake of argument by putting forth carefully framed questions. I've already answered your questions in my previous posts and the ones you raised in your previous response. (i.e. if you bothered to read the first paragraph of my last post). I won't entertain your further attempts to obfuscate the discussion simply because you can't or rather, don't want to stick to the topic.

-Coming to the relevant point about evidence, when I talk about evidence, I'm talking about the evidence for the claims YOU put forth e.g. there is a causal relationship between wearing a veil and loss of self identity/concept, self esteem and that the veil somehow transforms a woman from a human being in to a sculpture. Where is your evidence for any of those claims? Are you seriously going to use the "earth is round" argument in this one ?

BTW, if you actually care, a qualitative study in 2014 by Beckmann, actually touches on these issues. The main findings of that research being;

• -The hijab was empowering for the sample researched.
• -The hijab was a conscious choice for the sample researched.
• -The hijab contributed positively to their body image (for the sample researched).

So yeah, have a nice day!

 

[TheLahoriGuy]

Alrighty!

-Again, thank you for literally demonstrating that you don't actually contest points, your only aim is to argue for the sake of argument by putting forth carefully framed questions. I've already answered your questions in my previous posts and the ones you raised in your previous response. (i.e. if you bothered to read the first paragraph of my last post). I won't entertain your further attempts to obfuscate the discussion simply because you can't or rather, don't want to stick to the topic.

-Coming to the relevant point about evidence, when I talk about evidence, I'm talking about the evidence for the claims YOU put forth e.g. there is a causal relationship between wearing a veil and loss of self identity/concept, self esteem and that the veil somehow transforms a woman from a human being in to a sculpture. Where is your evidence for any of those claims? Are you seriously going to use the "earth is round" argument in this one ?

BTW, if you actually care, a qualitative study in 2014 by Beckmann, actually touches on these issues. The main findings of that research being;

• -The hijab was empowering for the sample researched.
• -The hijab was a conscious choice for the sample researched.
• -The hijab contributed positively to their body image (for the sample researched).

So yeah, have a nice day!

Dude iv been barking ever since not about how I hate the hijab or how it oppresses women but how it is being USED to oppress women. About how it is being FORCED on women and what that leads to. And you've literally been firing 360 at the Indian PM or how women in the west are also supposedly are also oppressed.

I simply don't care . My original and only comment was that women under a thick black veil under the blazing sun are NOT empowered and its extremely stupid to think otherwise.

 

[abdulbarijan]

Dude iv been barking ever since not about how I hate the hijab or how it oppresses women but how it is being USED to oppress women. About how it is being FORCED on women and what that leads to. And you've literally been firing 360 at the Indian PM or how women in the west are also supposedly are also oppressed.
I simply don't care . My original and only comment was that women under a thick black veil under the blazing sun are NOT empowered and its extremely stupid to think otherwise.

Is that so? I recall that the post you quoted to start this debate was literally about the double standards of oppression (east vs the west in terms of the steward example) ... in fact I remember, you actually touched upon that comment in your original reply .. just to freshen up your memory ..

Also the difference between this woman and one 30,000 feet in the air is that one is employment of ones choosing and the others a lifestyle imposed by other with no element of choice.

The late ex-Indian PM post was a reply to your assertion that the burqa ban is nothing but a security measure, to which I asked a very legitimate question i.e.
'If other articles of clothing have also got a history of being used in terrorism, you wouldn't mind if some government decides to go about and banning those as well? ' the examples of which I gave with the bra bomber that killed the ex Indian PM, and the underwear bomber.

Lastly, you seem to be fine when your asking the questions, but as soon as your world view is challenged you practically have a meltdown, where you contradict every standard you yourself set up ...
case and point : Empowerment = choice, but certain western countries banning the burqa (taking the choice away from practicing muslims) is not oppressive

 

[HAIDER]

Yes .. hijab

 

[Zibago]

Because I am Saudi as well. This is why I think i pretty much do have say for what i want in my homeland.

So you are a Pakistani Hindkowan who cant understand Urdu and you also are a Saudi national hmm :-//
@I.R.A

Is that so? I recall that the post you quoted to start this debate was literally about the double standards of oppression (east vs the west in terms of the steward example) ... in fact I remember, you actually touched upon that comment in your original reply .. just to freshen up your memory ..

The late ex-Indian PM post was a reply to your assertion that the burqa ban is nothing but a security measure, to which I asked a very legitimate question i.e.
'If other articles of clothing have also got a history of being used in terrorism, you wouldn't mind if some government decides to go about and banning those as well? ' the examples of which I gave with the bra bomber that killed the ex Indian PM, and the underwear bomber.

Lastly, you seem to be fine when your asking the questions, but as soon as your world view is challenged you practically have a meltdown, where you contradict every standard you yourself set up ...
case and point : Empowerment = choice, but certain western countries banning the burqa (taking the choice away from practicing muslims) is not oppressive

The right to wear hijab is as important as right not to wear it and anyone who imposes his view is against free choice

lol nah im Saudi from my mother's side and Pakistani from my father's. Currently residing here tho

I am Merlin the magnificient nice to meet you
@Divergent1 @Well.wisher @The Sandman @Hell hound @Musafir117
Fir maniya jogiya tera kamal i

 

[war&peace]

Did KSA complain the same about Trump Can's daughter and wife?

 

[tarrar]

In short, Halal for themselves & Haram for others.

 

[Manama]

So you are a Pakistani Hindkowan who cant understand Urdu and you also are a Saudi national hmm :-//
@I.R.A


The right to wear hijab is as important as right not to wear it and anyone who imposes his view is against free choice


I am Merlin the magnificient nice to meet you
@Divergent1 @Well.wisher @The Sandman @Hell hound @Musafir117
Fir maniya jogiya tera kamal i

I can understand urdu, i just can't understand it when people speak it with autism. I have yet to see someone more of a creep than you. gtfo kid

 

[TheLahoriGuy]

Is that so? I recall that the post you quoted to start this debate was literally about the double standards of oppression (east vs the west in terms of the steward example) ... in fact I remember, you actually touched upon that comment in your original reply .. just to freshen up your memory ..

The late ex-Indian PM post was a reply to your assertion that the burqa ban is nothing but a security measure, to which I asked a very legitimate question i.e.
'If other articles of clothing have also got a history of being used in terrorism, you wouldn't mind if some government decides to go about and banning those as well? ' the examples of which I gave with the bra bomber that killed the ex Indian PM, and the underwear bomber.

Lastly, you seem to be fine when your asking the questions, but as soon as your world view is challenged you practically have a meltdown, where you contradict every standard you yourself set up ...
case and point : Empowerment = choice, but certain western countries banning the burqa (taking the choice away from practicing muslims) is not oppressive

Is it really that hard to understand ? NO WESTERN COUNTRY HAS BANNED THE BURQA. The ban exists on niqab only. And not just niqab but ANY sort of facial covering. Where as in conservative Muslim countries women are forced to wear a burqa and this where the oppression lies. Stop targeting me and address the issue.

 

[Manama]

Is it really that hard to understand ? NO WESTERN COUNTRY HAS BANNED THE BURQA. The ban exists on niqab only. And not just niqab but ANY sort of facial covering. Where as in conservative Muslim countries women are forced to wear a burqa and this where the oppression lies. Stop targeting me and address the issue.

^^^^^^^^

 

[Zibago]

I can understand urdu, i just can't understand it when people speak it with autism. I have yet to see someone more of a creep than you. gtfo kid

Dukhti rag par pair rakha kiya ?

 

[Manama]

Dukhti rag par pair rakha kiya ?

same old facebook trash, comeon you can do better, be original