Majority Muslims want Sharia law in their countries: Study

[Roybot]

[MENTION=35695]
@Roybot ahh thick report! Have you read it?

Blegh! Who has the time, skimmed through it once.

 

[Dubious]

what about YA'JUD MA'JUD ?

@BDforever please don't make me laugh...Ask all these controversial questions on weekend

Blegh! Who has the time, skimmed through it once.

@Roybot and what did you conclude?

Appi, YES I KNOW!

But people are using the system for their own gain and misusing it!!!!

This is most probably gonna happen in Pakistan too!

@Pboy it happens everywhere....it happens in every system! That is why I said differentiate WHAT SHARIAH IS and WHAT PEOPLE FOLLOW UNDER ITS NAME!

 

[Pboy]

@BDforever please don't make me laugh...Ask all these controversial questions on weekend

@Roybot and what did you conclude?


@Pboy it happens everywhere....it happens in every system! That is why I said differentiate WHAT SHARIAH IS and WHAT PEOPLE FOLLOW UNDER ITS NAME!

Appi, You fail to see my point.

My point is that there is no such honest person who will protect rights of every people regardless of religion and other things and implement Sharia perfectly.

Thats why I dont want to scrap democracy for a system which will most likely end up as the one in Iran and Saudi Arabia.

 

[Dubious]

Appi, You fail to see my point.

My point is that there is no such honest person who will protect rights of every people regardless of religion and other things and implement Sharia perfectly.

Thats why I dont want to scrap democracy for a system which will most likely end up as the one in Iran and Saudi Arabia.

@Pboy that is why the system should be broken down so different sectors are responsible for different stuff...Giving full power to someone is rubbish, even Khalifah had wazirs, generals and a whole staff...it wasn't 1 man rule!

 

[livingdead]

@hinduguy another site gives this:



Roughly the same conditions with minor adjustments as to the value of the property...and yes, I forgot the witness part

I am sorry but even with these conditions, the punishment sounds too barbaric to me. ( I will pretend I did not read about musical instrument or wine being worthless )
Also human being tend to commit error in investigation( @Zarvan : I dont want to argue whether it is word of god, already got one infraction, but the implementation is going to be done by very fallible human beings), there is no way to rehabilitate if criminal was found innocent on a later date.

 

[Rajput_Pakistani]

I am sorry but even with these conditions, the punishment sounds too barbaric to me. ( I will pretend I did not read about musical instrument or wine being worthless )
Also human being tend to commit error in investigation( @Zarvan : I dont want to argue whether it is word of god, already got one infraction, but the implementation is going to be done by very fallible human beings), there is no way to rehabilitate if criminal was found innocent on a later date.

Do you believe the courts, police and the people who are running the system in UK, India or any country you belong to?
4 witnesses are no joke and as previously said, when all conditions are met only then the sentence could be carried out.

 

[Pboy]

@Pboy that is why the system should be broken down so different sectors are responsible for different stuff...Giving full power to someone is rubbish, even Khalifah had wazirs, generals and a whole staff...it wasn't 1 man rule!

But do you see it happening?

I mean, people are blindly hailing Iran who is misusing Islam and is using religion as a force and are corrupt.

They fail to see the handful of proofs that people who have their own opinion gets sentenced to life in jail or killed. They fail to see that minorities are treated badly there. They fail to see that there is corruption going on.

People hail Saudi Arabia who is doing the same. KSA do even order US to bomb muslims in other parts of the world!

But no. People have closed their eyes and are blindly supporting KSA and Iran.

US Gov for me are devils but so are the Rulers in Iran and KSA!

 

[Dubious]

I am sorry but even with these conditions, the punishment sounds too barbaric to me. ( I will pretend I did not read about musical instrument or wine being worthless )
Also human being tend to commit error in investigation( @Zarvan : I dont want to argue whether it is word of god, already got one infraction, but the implementation is going to be done by very fallible human beings), there is no way to rehabilitate if criminal was found innocent on a later date.

@hinduguy

Well, that is the punishment, there is also forgiveness and also there are other punishment...

Mind you I have seen many Indians (not Muslims) telling People to be put to death ....based on the fact they blew up someone...

My question, HOW MANY CAN PROVE that so and so ACTUALLY did it due to their intentions and NOT because they were forced by 1 means or another
Their family was kidnapped
The bomb was strapped to them without their approval,
The bomb was under their car without them knowing
The bomb was planted and they were there at the wrong time and wrong place?


Can ANYONE prove that? Yet terrorists are despised even when they plead not guilty!

BASED ON HUMAN LAW!

Why is that fine? Based on assumptions?

Why are they not rehabilitated?

How do we choose whom to rehabilitate and whom not to?

But do you see it happening?

I mean, people are blindly hailing Iran who is misusing Islam and is using religion as a force and are corrupt.

They fail to see the handful of proofs that people who have their own opinion gets sentenced to life in jail or killed. They fail to see that minorities are treated badly there. They fail to see that there is corruption going on.

People hail Saudi Arabia who is doing the same. KSA do even order US to bomb muslims in other parts of the world!

But no. People have closed their eyes and are blindly supporting KSA and Iran.

US Gov for me are devils but so are the Rulers in Iran and KSA!

@Pboy WELL, Like I said do not blame the system BECAUSE of those who abuse it!

 

[Pboy]

@hinduguy

Well, that is the punishment, there is also forgiveness and also there are other punishment...

Mind you I have seen many Indians (not Muslims) telling People to be put to death ....based on the fact they blew up someone...

My question, HOW MANY CAN PROVE that so and so ACTUALLY did it due to their intentions and NOT because they were forced by 1 means or another
Their family was kidnapped
The bomb was strapped to them without their approval,
The bomb was under their car without them knowing
The bomb was planted and they were there at the wrong time and wrong place?


Can ANYONE prove that? Yet terrorists are despised even when they plead not guilty!

BASED ON HUMAN LAW!

Why is that fine? Based on assumptions?

Why are they not rehabilitated?

How do we choose whom to rehabilitate and whom not to?


@Pboy WELL, Like I said do not blame the system BECAUSE of those who abuse it!

I do blame the people and the system.

If you have followed all my posts then I have not blamed the pure form of Sharia which was implemented 1400 years ago, BUT I blame the system today and the people who think that it will be very easy to implement it fairly.

 

[Dubious]

When you ask questions of Shariah or Islam, please ASK THE SAME QUESTIONS to the worldly laws and systems too!

I do blame the people and the system.

If you have followed all my posts then I have not blamed the pure form of Sharia which was implemented 1400 years ago, BUT I blame the system today and the people who think that it will be very easy to implement it fairly.

@Pboy Kid NOTHING in life is easy! We do not know the intentions of people for GOD said HE ALONE knows people's intentions! But all we can do is when we see wrong, voice out! ALLAH said zalim ka saath kabhi nai dayna! WE HAVE FORGOTTEN THIS BIT!

 

[Zarvan]

I am sorry but even with these conditions, the punishment sounds too barbaric to me. ( I will pretend I did not read about musical instrument or wine being worthless )
Also human being tend to commit error in investigation( @Zarvan : I dont want to argue whether it is word of god, already got one infraction, but the implementation is going to be done by very fallible human beings), there is no way to rehabilitate if criminal was found innocent on a later date.

these punishments are barbaric because they are for barbaric people in society so other majority remains safe and far as error ting is concerned human has to try its best and than give punishment otherwise if we go error thing than every criminal should be allowed to remain free and that will increase crimes

 

[Pboy]

When you ask questions of Shariah or Islam, please ASK THE SAME QUESTIONS to the worldly laws and systems too!


@Pboy Kid NOTHING in life is easy! We do not know the intentions of people for GOD said HE ALONE knows people's intentions! But all we can do is when we see wrong, voice out! ALLAH said zalim ka saath kabhi nai dayna! WE HAVE FORGOTTEN THIS BIT!

Of course......

Anyways,

These were just my views... Upto each person to believe and trust what he want.

 

[livingdead]

@hinduguy

Well, that is the punishment, there is also forgiveness and also there are other punishment...

Mind you I have seen many Indians (not Muslims) telling People to be put to death ....based on the fact they blew up someone...

My question, HOW MANY CAN PROVE that so and so ACTUALLY did it due to their intentions and NOT because they were forced by 1 means or another
Their family was kidnapped
The bomb was strapped to them without their approval,
The bomb was under their car without them knowing
The bomb was planted and they were there at the wrong time and wrong place?


Can ANYONE prove that? Yet terrorists are despised even when they plead not guilty!

BASED ON HUMAN LAW!

Why is that fine? Based on assumptions?

Why are they not rehabilitated?

How do we choose whom to rehabilitate and whom not to?

I was expecting the argument about death penalty, and whether it has any use in modern Indian society.
Lot of people are of the view it should be completely done away with(because once dead, you cant bring him back if found innocent) , but majority agree with supreme court, it should be given in rarest of the rare circumstances where the offense is so sickening that people lose faith in humanity (also the person has been found guilty without any doubt).
Death penalty in India requires lot of process and rigour very few are upheld in higher court due to the type of evidence required.

You just saw 2 instances of death penalty, there are hundereds of terrorists who are serving jail term. Some of them rehabilitated later by govt.

People say death penalty acts as deterrence where there is not much evidence to show it.
Its the certainty of punishment rather than quantum of it, which has some deterrence value.
If there is higher rate of conviction (say 80%) with 1 year imprisonment for theft, it will might reduce the opportunistic crime, rather than say 1% conviction rate with hand chopping as punishment. (yes, I made it all up, lol)

If you want to pursue each such stealing incident with such rigour, there will be very few conviction, thus losing the deterrence that you expected.

 

[Dubious]

I was expecting the argument about death penalty, and whether it has any use in modern Indian society.
Lot of people are of the view it should be completely done away with(because once dead, you cant bring him back if found innocent) , but majority agree with supreme court, it should be given in rarest of the rare circumstances where the offense is so sickening that people lose faith in humanity (also the person has been found guilty without any doubt).
Death penalty in India requires lot of process and rigour very few are upheld in higher court due to the type of evidence required.

You just saw 2 instances of death penalty, there are hundereds of terrorists who are serving jail term. Some of them rehabilitated later by govt.

People say death penalty acts as deterrence where there is not much evidence to show it.
Its the certainty of punishment rather than quantum of it, which has some deterrence value.
If there is higher rate of conviction (say 80%) with 1 year imprisonment for theft, it will might reduce the opportunistic crime, rather than say 1% conviction rate with hand chopping as punishment. (yes, I made it all up, lol)

If you want to pursue each such stealing incident with such rigour, there will be very few conviction, thus losing the deterrence that you expected.

@hinduguy death penalty again is a serious matter in Islam...It is also given under conditions...Right now am busy can you ask me this during the weekend...I am not a law student, so I do not have my resources at my fingertips...

However, I will leave you with a few verses of the Quran which shows HOW IMPORTANT A HUMAN LIFE IS...It doesnt state the colour, caste, creed, religion, just says human...

Because of that, We decreed upon the Children of Israel that whoever kills a soul unless for a soul or for corruption [done] in the land - it is as if he had slain mankind entirely. And whoever saves one - it is as if he had saved mankind entirely. And our messengers had certainly come to them with clear proofs. Then indeed many of them, [even] after that, throughout the land, were transgressors.

Quran Surah Al-Ma'idah verse 32

And do not kill the soul which Allah has forbidden, except by right. And whoever is killed unjustly - We have given his heir authority, but let him not exceed limits in [the matter of] taking life. Indeed, he has been supported [by the law].

Surah Al- Isra verse 33

 

[FaujHistorian]

Well its not really practical, it will take me at least a year or two to learn enough arabic to decipher what is really intended in the book. Then four more years to study as you said.
Can I not make an informed opinion without going into such trouble, by reading the arguments posted here?

I guess @BDforever being a nice guy basically politely said 'stfu and leave us alone', when he made that suggestion.

Mullah-too-toos and Aytullah-hoo-hoos have been saying the same thing. Spend 20 years while sleeping with Arabic stuff and you will learn Sharia.

As a result many sincere non-Muslims like yourself don't make an effort.


so I urge you to not become a blind follower of Mullah-too-toos and Aytullah-hoo-hoos and simply accept that Quran is too difficult to understand.

It is not.

Just make sure not to make the same mistakes that so many Pakistanis (and Muslims) make. To pick one verse from Quran without reading the whole chapter or at least reading the section.

Like some fundoos from Pakistan just did while discussing Hijab and women. They are just sex crazed people. Ignore them.


Here I hope you can get started with the following from the chapter 24, "Noor" (Divine Light/guidance), or "Sacred enlightening/guidance"







O believers [of moral values and modesty]!

Do not enter a house other than your own without first announcing your presence and invoking peace upon the folk living in the house. That is better for you, that you may be careful [cautious]. (27)
[------ Focus on respecting privacy]


And don't enter the house if you didn't here back a permission. And if someone from inside specifically says "do not enter", then go back, for it is better for you. Allah knows what you do. (28)

[------ Focus on respecting privacy]

(It is) no sin for you to enter uninhabited [vacant] houses to get protection (from rain/snow etc). Allah knows what you show and what you hide. (29)

[-- Again the focus is on the respect for private property. ]


Tell the believing men to lower their gaze and be modest and protect their private parts [loins]. That is better for them. Lo! Allah is aware of what they do. (30)

[--- Focus on modesty. And Allah directs men first (guidance for women is in the following sentence)]


And tell the believing women to lower their gaze and be modest and protect their private parts [loins], and

to not flash jewelry (expensive clothing, flashy makeup) and

to cover their breasts (like don't flash cleavage) and

do not show your makeup/jewelry/clothes to men except the men of your own family.

And do not stomp your high heal shoes (as it attracts gaze from men who should not be eyeing you

And follow (these simple directions on privacy and modesty) so you are safe and protected (31)


Note: Quran tells women who could be the men of their own family as: own husbands or fathers or husbands' fathers, or their sons or their husbands' sons, or their brothers or their brothers' sons or sisters' sons, or their women, or their slaves, or male attendants who lack vigour, or children who know naught of women's nakedness.




Now tell me, please how many years do we need to understand these simpl simple simple simple directions.

Oh

And won't you find the same directions in any good household, told be "believing" parents of any religion??????


Didn't you hear the same from your Hindu parents?

Didn't they tell the same to your sisters/female cousins?



Remember Islam/Quran doesn't tell anything new. These are the same directions that were given through all other religions and faiths.


Hope this helps.


and keeps you safe from Mullah-too-toos and Aytullah-hoo-hoos. Amen.


peace to you


p.s. check out verses 1-26, and 31-???? to find out what else is being discussed in this chapter. Only then form your opinion. Thanks.