Leon Panetta "Worthy Fights" about Ops Neptune spear

[SQ8]

I don't doubt that we had help inside Pakistan from some source. I doubt a bunch of white guys sneaking found him by themselves.

Since the alliance started, there was a fairly large scale CIA and ISI combined op to take Al Qaeda down in earnest... which is how we got KSM and the others. However, within the ISI there were elements(both extremist and opportunist) who started work against these teams.

The extremist had sympathy for what they thought were Muslim "assets". The opportunists saw a way to prolong the war for its benefits. Neither had official sanction but did have a network within the military having a similar mindset.
So here is the team that is working hand in hand till at some point the ISI team gets its resources culled completely. That apparently has to with another parallel CIA team working on finding out the locations of Pakistan's nuclear program which this CIA team knows nothing about. Everything after that is hazy but what I could piece was that the nuclear intrusion irked those in charge and gave an opportunity for the Al-Qaeda/Asset sympathy to turn the ear of the then head of the ISI(who was shocked white at first finding out where OBL was).. it was probably decided that letting him out of the bag would be an embarrassment and just killing him would also be an issue.. so he was left where he was left..all this while the CIA team/directive that was working with the ISI(not anymore) never stopped and how they got to him they did.

Welcome to the spy game.

Its a map drawn by Mark Owen( the Navy SEAL who had participated in the mission) in his book No Easy Day: The Firsthand Account of the Mission that Killed Osama bin Laden (2012). The map shows that the black hawk which was carrying assaulters crossed over Pak’s eastern border with India before looping around and approaching Abbottabad from the southeast, rather than approaching directly from the west (or west-northwest).(none of this is confirmed by the govt.).

View attachment 212195

Makes no sense, as there is MUCH better surveillance on that side of the border than in the west.

 

[Levina]

Makes no sense, as there is MUCH better surveillance on that side of the border than in the west.

I'm sure the man who drew it ( Mark owen, a navy SEAL who had participated in the mission) has more sense than you and me, he knew what he was drawing. And what if India had figured out a chink in Pak's armour???
The SIGINT and ELINT aircraft with US Air Force would have mapped the blind spots in the AD Radar network of Pakistan and come out with the most optimum entry/exit strategy.
But i do know that crossing into India would have required 'em to go above 5000 feet and uncle sam didnt want the whole world to know about their neptune and its spear. Lol
Its just a hypothesis!
None of it is confirmed..

 

[SQ8]

I'm sure the man who drew it ( Mark owen, a navy SEAL who had participated in the mission) has more sense than you and me, he knew what he was drawing. And what if India had figured out a chink in Pak's armour???
The SIGINT and ELINT aircraft with US Air Force would have mapped the blind spots in the AD Radar network of Pakistan and come out with the most optimum entry/exit strategy.
But i do know that to crossing into India would have required 'em to go above 5000 feet and uncle sam didnt want the whole world to know about their neptune and its spear. Lol
Its just a hypothesis!
None of it is confirmed..

One possible theory is that the approach to Abbotabad that was also offers excellent mountain terrain cover regardless of altitude. So the route was planned to use it as much as possible to avoid Pakistani radar. Considering that the pilots of the 160 SoA are possible one(if not the best) in the US Army.. they could pull that off

 

[Sine Nomine]

Well Clinton always feared that if the choppers would be detected by Pak radars then due to a fear of a surprise attack from India, and after discovering a secret incursion into their airspace, it was possible Pak would 've’ responded with force.
But these 're the reason they went ahead with the mission
1)Vice Admiral McRaven (who had recommended the launch Op Neptune Spear) had said that if he (OSL) wasn’t there, they would know that pretty quickly.
2) A second contingency helped to lower the political risk of the mission because it helped to prevent a failed raid from becoming a crisis of bilateral relations.
3) Admiral Mullen (Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of staff), who had enough experience working with Pak could anticipate Pakistan’s reaction time, which they assumed would be enough to take their SEALs out before Pak retaliated.
4) Gen Kayani was given many hints, Admiral Mullen had repeatedly emphasized to General Kayani that “If we know we can find Number One or Number Two, we are going to get 'em,” and he had also made it clear “we are going to get them unilaterally".

Btw this is an interesting find...

Its a map drawn by Mark Owen( the Navy SEAL who had participated in the mission) in his book No Easy Day: The Firsthand Account of the Mission that Killed Osama bin Laden (2012). The map shows that the black hawk which was carrying assaulters crossed over Pak’s eastern border with India before looping around and approaching Abbottabad from the southeast, rather than approaching directly from the west (or west-northwest).(none of this is confirmed by the govt.).

View attachment 212195

This was a planned Drama,it was better yo catch him alive but every one is saying it would have been better if Omar has turned OBL to US but nobody take cares that it's not there tradition,for instance Afghans even fought Taliban when they provided shelter to a US seal which Taliban were searching for but levina look at outcome of these two wars Afghan destabilized more then ever before Pakistan fighting war and above all you live in ME,Iraq has been turned into a hell after 2003,rest Syria and Yemen,no body knew about Al-qaida even after 9/11 but today every bombing is credited to al-qaida it more seems me myth then reality because you know myth has it''s own advantages.

One possible theory is that the approach to Abbotabad that was also offers excellent mountain terrain cover regardless of altitude. So the route was planned to use it as much as possible to avoid Pakistani radar. Considering that the pilots of the 160 SoA are possible one(if not the best) in the US Army.. they could pull that off

One of my friends who works at PAA told me that after 2005 earthquake US was fully involved in Rescue ops,if it was dram then they planned this at that time, because he adds that US UH-60's used this same route hundred of times during that mission it is possible that they learned it this way. Sir one more question 0ffers excellent mountain terrain cover regardless of altitude sir in that case do you think India Air Force can use this cover to bomb our positions at LOC in any conflict what is our response in that case.

 

[SQ8]

One of my friends who works at PAA told me that after 2005 earthquake US was fully involved in Rescue ops,if it was dram then they planned this at that time, because he adds that US UH-60's used this same route hundred of times during that mission it is possible that they learned it this way. Sir one more question 0ffers excellent mountain terrain cover regardless of altitude sir in that case do you think India Air Force can use this cover to bomb our positions at LOC in any conflict what is our response in that case.

A quick read of this might give you a hint
Aeronaut: Like the Lovers' Secret

 

[wiseone2]

In short words Pakistani brass is US bitch,he tells that kiyani and Pasha were happy on that Ops regardless of humiliation Pakistan has got.

I do not know why any self-respecting Pakistani general would go with the ops

 

[Sine Nomine]

I do not know why any self-respecting Pakistani general would go with the ops

but in that case Leon Panetta is trying to humiliate Pakistani brass.

 

[wiseone2]

but in that case Leon Panetta is trying to humiliate Pakistani brass.

panetta might be out to sell a few books

in any case Pakistani army and ISI humiliated themselves by allowing Bin laden to stay on Pakistani soil for close to a decade

 

[SipahSalar]

Might be the best decision you've made in a generation. We already knew you were hiding him. We already knew you were double-crossing us. What do you think we'd have done if you'd fired at those choppers?

There was going to be no bloodshed. The SEALs were ordered beforehand to surrender if any confrontation arose. And even if we had fired at your choppers, there is not much you could have done. Which is worse? OBL living in Pakistan or firing at an American chopper? America didn't do anything about the former, so latter is out of question.

 

[Levina]

but levina look at outcome of these two wars Afghan destabilized more then ever before Pakistan fighting war and above all you live in ME,Iraq has been turned into a hell after 2003,rest Syria and Yemen,no body knew about Al-qaida even after 9/11 but today every bombing is credited to al-qaida it more seems me myth then reality because you know myth has it''s own advantages.
.

Some 5-6 years back when I had moved to ME, this place was very peaceful...infact I used to wonder why don't I get much to read in the newspapers. But now I wish that they had better news to post other than of wars, orphaned children maimed men and violated women.

 

[Sine Nomine]

Some 5-6 years back when I had moved to ME, this place was very peaceful...infact I used to wonder why don't I get much to read in the newspapers. But now I wish that they had better news to post other than of wars, orphaned children maimed men and violated women.

sadly women,children and old peoples are effected from wars very much that's why Islam put strict rule on not harming them but who cares we Muslims today only raise slogan of religion when we need it for our personal Interest see ISIS mostly composed of ex-Iraqi Army and Baath party officials are using both religion and sectarian shroud to gain interests,sadly women suffer most from war.

in any case Pakistani army and ISI humiliated themselves by allowing Bin laden to stay on Pakistani soil for close to a decade

i doubt that i stayed in that area for long time you can not maintain privacy in that part in any way.

 

[nair]

Well Clinton always feared that if the choppers would be detected by Pak radars then due to a fear of a surprise attack from India, and after discovering a secret incursion into their airspace, it was possible Pak would 've’ responded with force.

View attachment 212195

It doesnt make any sense....... 2 quick reason

1) This mission has to cross 2 set of radar's on LOC/IB, and the chance of flying undetected is next to "0", Even if you manage to cross them the chance of getting caught is so high and in case any of the radar detects the response is going to be massive
2) The risk of starting a nuclear war

Probably they are trying to confuse......

 

[Levina]

It doesnt make any sense....... 2 quick reason

1) This mission has to cross 2 set of radar's on LOC/IB, and the chance of flying undetected is next to "0", Even if you manage to cross them the chance of getting caught is so high and in case any of the radar detects the response is going to be massive
2) The risk of starting a nuclear war

Probably they are trying to confuse......

Lol
Spot on!
Yes they 're!
Probably you missed this post of mine.

I'm sure the man who drew it ( Mark owen, a navy SEAL who had participated in the mission) has more sense than you and me, he knew what he was drawing. And what if India had figured out a chink in Pak's armour???
The SIGINT and ELINT aircraft with US Air Force would have mapped the blind spots in the AD Radar network of Pakistan and come out with the most optimum entry/exit strategy.
But i do know that crossing into India would have required 'em to go above 5000 feet and uncle sam didnt want the whole world to know about their neptune and its spear. Lol
Its just a hypothesis!
None of it is confirmed..

 

[Sine Nomine]

@levina Pakistan was not monitoring that side of border using radars,US knew that so even they used V-22 we would have been unable to know till they told.

 

[MastanKhan]

Hir
" sir, there are 5 goats pasing below, sir there are 10 goats and 2 shepherds pasing below, sir there are 7 taliban passing below, sir there are two unknown helicopters flying by below with no markings"---.

This script is part of a conversation carried out by front line op's stationed at the peak of the mountain pass with their base command.

What Panneta conveniently forgets is about who helped when the first helicopter had left leaving behind 8 operators for 1/2 hour plus on the ground for the rescue aircraft to show up.