LCA :: Affordable air power

[ziaulislam]

i think india should buy rafale lets hope they spend good 20 billion plus on it, its important for their defence.
lets hope the ToT thing just turn out to be like advance bofors artillery.
i am just glad they didnt spend this on fifth generation platform like their own PAKFA or f-35 which would have been cheaper.
they could have easily satisfied their fourth generation need with su 30(super) and combination of mig 29 and LCAs

 

[nik22]

i think india should buy rafale lets hope they spend good 20 billion plus on it, its important for their defence.
lets hope the ToT thing just turn out to be like advance bofors artillery.
i am just glad they didnt spend this on fifth generation platform like their own PAKFA or f-35 which would have been cheaper.
they could have easily satisfied their fourth generation need with su 30(super) and combination of mig 29 and LCAs

Sir, I agree with you. But I also think about that IAF Think Tank and even Sarkari Babu are not fool. Not everyone is corrupt either.
If Rafale deal drags for long then decision should be re-considered. I think IAF should put a timeline on it

 

[surya kiran]

View attachment 25025

View attachment 25026

go to PAC u get answers .Yes HAL is bad its even patethic bcas SU tires are being imported till recent .

Regarding 3Rd Generation i m not comparing with Boeing Its HAL what HAl has been doing other than assembling and making even world class product bad in quality .

View attachment 25029
What a good organization .

edit the image in your post. your personal email id is visible with your name F*** A*** K***.

@Emmie @Aeronaut

 

[Anony]

No serial production Tejas has ever rolled off the assembly line, and won't be till next year at the earliest

Serial Production of Mig 21 started more than 50 years back, so according to you Mig 21 of 1960's is better then Jf-17 or say Mig 21 of today's date.

Serial production JF-17s have full digital FBW

Can you give a reliable link for the same.

Tejas is only some 200 pounds lighter than JF-17. Then again, JF-17 is a much bigger plane than Tejas.

Composite Material also reduces RCS value whereas aluminium body is more than 10 times prone of getting detected.

Moreover, though both the plane weights same, maximum takeoff weight of Tejas is more than 1 ton compared to Jf-17. This is also because of usage of carbon fibre composite.

Careful. You can be sent to the madhouse for making such a comment.

Pilot of Tejas can fire missile just by looking at the target which Jf-17 doesn't offer to its pilot


I would imagine JF-17 has a lower RCS than Tejas. DSI hides engine better than S duct intakes do, which is why F-35 has DSI whereas older F-22 does not.[/quote]

From where you get that information. Both serve the same function. Tejas has way lower RCS than Jf-17 because carbon fibre composite do not reflect radar waves like aluminum/other metal body. It's engine is superior than Jf-17's engine which radiate lesser heat waves in the environment.

 

[Luftwaffe]

Sick of this comparison between Pak and India. It is like people want to feel better by comparing to something inferior.

Guys compare with best in Industry and let both countries make some world class products to boast of.

Hi, your country mate is the one doing comparison i'm letting him know both are certified according to intl. standards but might be short in some areas.

 

[he-man]

Hi, your country mate is the one doing comparison i'm letting him know both are certified according to intl. standards but might be short in some areas.

It was started by someone who said pac>hal

I think we all must back down-i am first to relent.peace

@Luftwaffe

U are a serious poster so I relented

 

[Luftwaffe]

And leaving IAF for the next 6 to 8 years with MKIs only? The first upgraded M2K will be added by this year, while the first LCA MK2 will only be inducted around 2020? Doesn't make much sense, especially when we are talking about one of IAFs most capable and important fighters.

LCA MK2 2020? not a good news. Rest Mirage 2000 upgrades for 40m each is way too expensive, french are atleast cashing 18-20m per aircraft.

It was started by someone who said pac>hal

I think we all must back down-i am first to relent.peace

@Luftwaffe

U are a serious poster so I relented

I'm not into this whoever started hindustani member was PAC is like this or that was it you? I don't go back read such posts though no time...

all I said to both members from two nations that PAC and HAL are according to intl. standards and thriving Organizations to say that PAC is nothing compared is sheer ignorance you've to walk in and spend time there to tell if its good or worst ever until than you can't comment PAC is nothing.

 

[Killswitch]

If the Rafale falls through, increased LCA and Sukhoi 30 MKI produciton cn and will make up the difference. Theres no reason why some of the sub systems and weapons that make the Rafale different cant be incorporated into the LCA and MKI.

 

[he-man]

If the Rafale falls through, increased LCA and Sukhoi 30 MKI produciton cn and will make up the difference. Theres no reason why some of the sub systems and weapons that make the Rafale different cant be incorporated into the LCA and MKI.

The deal will be signed,if no we are in serious trouble

 

[he-man]

LCA MK2 2020? not a good news. Rest Mirage 2000 upgrades for 40m each is way too expensive, french are atleast cashing 18-20m per aircraft.



I'm not into this whoever started hindustani member was PAC is like this or that was it you? I don't go back read such posts though no time...

all I said to both members from two nations that PAC and HAL are according to intl. standards and thriving Organizations to say that PAC is nothing compared is sheer ignorance you've to walk in and spend time there to tell if its good or worst ever until than you can't comment PAC is nothing.

French royally fucked us.no doubt about it.

And for what?
Rdy-2,icms mk4 and mica?
Some strengthning to add a pylon or two more plus better cockpit.

All that cannot be worth 40 per plane by a long shot,no.

No engine change is there

 

[spectribution]

Jf-17 is a potent fighter So is Lca Tejas Every plane have there advantages and disadvantages.the correct Measures will be in War Scenario or in War games


But Jf-17 have proper testing facilities and Have Expert Aircraft Building Experience Of the Chinese Whereas in Lca Hal have to take all workload thus It Makes Induction Process Slow

This is what Richard Aboulafia a reknowed aviation expert had to say about JF 17.

IN FOCUS: China awaits fighter export breakthrough - 7/3/2012 - Flight Global

Don't be gracious to these people. They don't deserve it.

 

[Bratva]

Dude, no offence to you, but before quoting this type of message, you must read about Tejas features compared to Jf-17.

Tejas in its current form is way better than anything PAF have in its inventory,(setting aside few F-16 blk 52).


Radar on Tejas is way better than Klj-7 radar of Jf-17

EW system, and other avionics on Tejas is way better than Jf-17

Tejas has quadruple fly by wire flight control system on all it's axis whereas Jf-17 has fly by wire only on two axis

70% of the surface area of Tejas and 45% by weight is made up of carbon fibre composite compared to aluminium body of Jf-17

RCS value of Tejas is way low than Jf-17

Being in same weight category with Jf-17, it has got higher thrust engine, which gives it better thrust to weight ratio compared to Jf-17

It has achieved Mach 1.1 at sea level (same what Su 30mki achieved) with full load which Jf-17 has not (atleast no reliable source is there to claim)

It has got HUD system for pilots which Jf-17 does not offer

It can do a vertical loop in 20 secs even with restricted flight envelope, something which Jf-17 can't do only (shows it's agility)

And there are many more........... and you will get a reliable source for all these claims.


Note:- Just because IAF rules towards Tejas is very stringent & they don't induct anything that can stay in air, you can't devalue the performance of a beautiful machine.

You should be ashamed of putting misleading facts and figures.

First read JF-17 project director recent interviews in JF-17 info pool thread.

Radar range of LCA and JF-17 is similar and you are so ignorant that you even forget LCA was suffering less radar range due to radome material couple of months back

Since LCA is delta,, it needed higher TWR.

Prove EW and other avionics are way better? and kindly stop reading wikipedia. Go to JF-17 info pool thread to know JF-17 EW contains DFRM and other associated western equipment. Hence another fail from you without researching diligently

Another ignorant comment about JF-17 FBW. Does JF-17 has delta body? No. Does JF-17 has LERX which helps improve AoA? YES. That's why we have a hybrid, analog-digital FBW. Your's being pure delta needed more sophisticated AoA. A fun fact, JF-17 block 1 has achieved 26 degree AoA. How much LCA with such super duper FBW achieved?

What HUD systems JF-17 doesn't offer which LCA offer beside HMD? ( which is being integrated on to Blk-1 plane as we speak

At sea level. JF-17 can fire Anti ship missiles and Hypersonic missiles, what LCA can fire at at sea level?

About RCS values. Do you what Clean LCA RCS is? CLEAN JF-17 has < 2 m RCS as per un named PAF F-16 fighter jet pilot who did DACT with JF-17. So aper your claim how LCA has better rcs value than JF-17?

And stop fooling yourself with youtube videos of LCA an JF-17 vertical loop comparisons. If you want to know JF-17 agility, look up JF-17 DUBAI 2013 air performance. You will get an "IDEA" how much JF-17 is agile than LCA. Thank you.

And yeah tell us what more and back up this time with proper reliable sources. not with mere BS claims.

Only advantage LCA has is better composites used in manufacturing LCA. That's it.

What is the exact Pakistani contribution in JF 17, apart from money?

We developed Tejas on our own, several crictal avionics and FBW of Tejas is developed by India, is same true for JF-17?

I am all ears.

this is the exact contribution of Pakistan. Like wise several critical avionics is developed by Pakistan

Pakistan Aeronautical Complex Kamra - Avionics Systems Co-produced Projects

Ministry of Defence Production-Year Book 2012-13 (online published date 26-03-2014)
Page 49
On-going Specialist Projects

• Development of Universal Pylon for JF-17 aircraft

Page 50

• JF-17 Airframe Co-Production Project: Activities related to JF-17 airframe co-production project continued at a consistent pace during FY 2012-13. TOT work for various co-production activities commenced during the year, while milestones of capability achievement for various activities were achieved. A wide range of surface treatment processes, heat treatment facilities, and auxiliary equipment have been commissioned and qualified for JF-17 production.

Page 51

• Avionics Production Factory (APF):It also produces Radar Warning Receivers and Identification of Friend and Foe system through a joint venture with M/s CEIEC of China (not sure it is specifically related with JF-17 or not)

Page 52

• Serial production of Audio Control Box (ACB) for Block II

• Indigenous tester for Light Warning System (LWS) has been developed for JF-17 aircraft

• APF acquired capability in deployment of different testers for JF-17 avionics i.e Avionics Integrated Maintenance Station (AIMS), Integrated Survivalable Recordable (ISR), Weapon Mission Management Computer (WMMC) and Electro Mechanical Management Computer (EMMC).

• Smart Weapons Avionics Integration capability acquired through standard II transfer of Technology (ToT) contract. (not sure it is specifically related with JF-17 or not)

Page 59

View attachment 24563
Page 69

Following projects completed successfully in 2012-13 by Dte MP (Air):-

• Audio Control Box for JF-17 A/C (Qty-6)

 

[Bratva]

Fake Mr TurkFirst of all Create your own aircraft Before giving lectures to us about Building Aircraft. You guys don,t Fart without Nato help.What are you talking about Jf-17 Is Jv fighter the workloads are shared AS Chinese doing all the thinking Part, Jf-17 Program Still depends upon Third Party Russia for Engines Unlike Lca Tejas Were R&d,workload is done by Single organisation HAL.If You have to compare Jf-17 compare it with Another JV Which is Sukhoi-30 Mki.

Genius do you even read your own statement. As it LCA is not dependent own Third party America for engines

No JF-17 is not JV like SU-30.

The mystery of SU-30 was busted when HAL contacted Sukhoi for maintenance. Read that news once again. What you do is procure domestic materials for the production of SU-30 airframe. The design, the knock down kits coming from Russia is stll all coming from sukhoi and controlled by them.SU-30 design diagrams come from Sukhoi and you build them according to their specs with some of your local materials and some things that you can't build they come in kits. You had zero contribution in SU-30 design phase.

While JF-17, PAF participated in design phase. Did india participated in design phase of SU-30? NO. We design, build, make changes in JF-17 as we like because we are CO-OEM of JF-17, Can India does the same to SU-30? NO.

Geez, I don't know why Indian IQ went down the drain when it comes to SU-30 and JF-17

 

[Bratva]

By the way when did India invade pakistan?, get your facts right my friend....

Siachen? 71 invading East Pakistan? ring any bell

I went to that site.
It mentions nothing

Go to hal and it will give u a list of indigenous stuff in tejas.
Its about 40-50 pc u noob.

Whats pac contribution in jf-17?

Frame?

Or the pakistan flag?

Because you were not serious in looking. And yeah Pakistani contribution is similiar 40-50 percent.

 

[halupridol]

Sick of this comparison between Pak and India. It is like people want to feel better by comparing to something inferior.

Guys compare with best in Industry and let both countries make some world class products to boast of.

whaaat???,,,where is the fun in that??