JF-17 Thunder Multirole Fighter [Thread 7]

[fatman17]

Dont forget the Zulus along with 1000 helfires are mostly being funded by CSF that Pakistan gets from USA for WOT. It replaces the similar type of cobras that PA loves and has decades of experience. So fiscally and technically very responsible decision.

CSF funds are given to the government for balance of payments etc, not for buying war materials.

 

[TheDarkKnight]

CSF funds are given to the government for balance of payments etc, not for buying war materials.

I am quite sure when deal was being negotiated way back around 2013 time frame, us millitary aid was planned to be used. I will try to search through archives. It was either through FMF - or maybe the deal of 900 mil+ was approved and along with that Pak also got CSF of about the same amount?

 

[fatman17]

I am quite sure when deal was being negotiated way back around 2013 time frame, us millitary aid was planned to be used. I will try to search through archives. It was either through FMF - or maybe the deal of 900 mil+ was approved and along with that Pak also got CSF of about the same amount?

Just go to DSCA site for your answer. its a FMS sale.

 

[khanasifm]

Just go to DSCA site for your answer. its a FMS sale.

http://www.dsca.mil/major-arms-sale...helicopters-and-agm-114r-hellfire-ii-missiles

 

[ziaulislam]

I am quite sure when deal was being negotiated way back around 2013 time frame, us millitary aid was planned to be used. I will try to search through archives. It was either through FMF - or maybe the deal of 900 mil+ was approved and along with that Pak also got CSF of about the same amount?

wrong usually we get less than what we spend on military operations, we usually bill the twice amount and get half of the payment, and its shrinking day by day

after mushi era we didnt get anything major from FMF apart from very much needed MAxpro

any indications what will be the final number for thunders

 

[el nino]

It would be wise to stop thunders numbers at 150 planes around 2024.

The investment should be then around upgrading them to block 3 and beyond .

People won't like this ',,,,,,,

but the planes is too small in weight and engine thrust to weight ratio to be more than second tier fighter plane.

the F16 are 30% bigger in size TWR have bigger better jammers and radars and more lethal weapons.

Thunders radars and weapons can be improved but the power will never match the medium weight fighters and heavy weight fighters the thunder will have to face off against.

In contrast the F16 being 30% heavier and thirty percent better Twr can go toe to toe with the flankers and mig29.

Rafale will require different solution

 

[TheDarkKnight]

http://www.dsca.mil/major-arms-sale...helicopters-and-agm-114r-hellfire-ii-missiles

Ok I agree this is foreign millitary sale which Pak can pay out of its own pocket - but FMF can also be a source of funding. I was under the impression that PA was going to use its part of the FMF to procure these zulus - just like PAF tried for the 8 F16s. I searched but couldn't really find anything to support my claim though (some old posts by H Khan on pakdef.org suggest this, but nothing official) Or if you know how we can determine how this deal is being financed?

 

[Frankenstein9321]

Honestly i dont think jf17 is that bad..it may not be medium to big range fighter but it does the job. In dog fight speed doesnt count much. Jf 17 has great BVRs, so it will stand toe to toe with alot of fighters. Plus being smaller gives it edge over RCS...For BVRs battle its ideal. So for me we should go for 400 jf17s. Ofcourse we need other platforms for force multiplier purpose. Maybe Su35 or J16 wild wiesel. We will have 3 different platforms from 3 different countries. Maybe the only country in the world to have fighters from China, Usa and Russia. A very potent force indeed.
But that is just wishful thinking on my behalf. But my father used to say bird in hand is better than 2 in the bushes....so we should concentate on Jf 17...and make ot the most deadly fighter in the sky....

 

[khanasifm]

Sweden JAS-39 and AWACS concept first introduced by Sweden has proven that you do not need USAF style expensive aircraft to achieve air superiority in your airspace. JF is just that but cheaper version for PAF, in fact JF cockpit was based on PAF eval of Gripen . blk 3 is where it get close/same capabilities of Gripen (plus Variety of weapons)

Sweden was the I think (per AFM) first country to introduce data links in aircraft of Darken where they hunt as wolf pack

 

[CriticalThought]

It would be wise to stop thunders numbers at 150 planes around 2024.

The investment should be then around upgrading them to block 3 and beyond .

People won't like this ',,,,,,,

but the planes is too small in weight and engine thrust to weight ratio to be more than second tier fighter plane.

the F16 are 30% bigger in size TWR have bigger better jammers and radars and more lethal weapons.

Thunders radars and weapons can be improved but the power will never match the medium weight fighters and heavy weight fighters the thunder will have to face off against.

In contrast the F16 being 30% heavier and thirty percent better Twr can go toe to toe with the flankers and mig29.

Rafale will require different solution

Block 3 is supposed to get an entirely new engine. Wait and watch.

 

[fatman17]

Ok I agree this is foreign millitary sale which Pak can pay out of its own pocket - but FMF can also be a source of funding. I was under the impression that PA was going to use its part of the FMF to procure these zulus - just like PAF tried for the 8 F16s. I searched but couldn't really find anything to support my claim though (some old posts by H Khan on pakdef.org suggest this, but nothing official) Or if you know how we can determine how this deal is being financed?

True but congress is against FMF which is basically a subsidy, case in point F16 deal.

 

[fatman17]

Ok I agree this is foreign millitary sale which Pak can pay out of its own pocket - but FMF can also be a source of funding. I was under the impression that PA was going to use its part of the FMF to procure these zulus - just like PAF tried for the 8 F16s. I searched but couldn't really find anything to support my claim though (some old posts by H Khan on pakdef.org suggest this, but nothing official) Or if you know how we can determine how this deal is being financed?

Sir this is a deal with 100% Pakistan sovereign funds. case closed. If this was FMF/subsidy it would have met the same fate as last F16 deal. It's payment is spread over 3-4 years therefore we don't pay in lumpsum. The deal is actually split in 2 agreements, 3 and 9 helos and I'm expecting a 3rd agreement for a further 3 helos.

 

[The Fist]

JF-17 integrated with Standoff weapon

 

[his5850]

 

[WarFariX]

IMO Block 3 doesnt deserve a new engine..RD-93 will be enough since composite will be incorporated and AESA is lighter than PESA