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Japan's Abe says TPP would have strategic significance if China joined

Just saying we know the chinese. But no worry, our people are much more pragmatic than anyone may think.

You know I have been the biggest proponents of integration with China. I do not see Chinese integration as a bad thing because the Chinese people and Chinese society, as a whole, is actually progressive-focused, and at the same time I value their pro-trade, pro-research, pro-family, pro-harmony stance on a whole. In fact that has been the case in China's nearly 5000 years of existence as a nation state. I see a union of China and Japan as a good thing, and an eventuality if we consider the trends in forming supranational pacts.

Yes when you mention Vietnamese being pragmatic, we should also understand that we all , Japanese and Vietnamese, must remain also REALISTIC. Both our countries , Japan and Vietnam, cannot escape or ignore China because simply the fact that China is geographically located in our immediate zones. Vietnam more since your country and your people share a land border with China and the Chinese, so there is literally a physical link there. I should also say a cultural one since Vietnam is, by all intents and purposes and i mean no disrepsect when I say this, but the "New China" of Southeast Asia. And you know this to be true. In fact Vietnamese society and Vietnamese people are very similar to Chinese , go to any Vietnamese Town in the United States, go to any Vietnamse market or restaurant, and its almost , practically, similar to the Chinese version. So back to my point: Vietnam-China and Japan-China will inextricably linked together due to our shared geography, shared history, shared culture, shared future.

It therefore serves us no future to ignore this fact, in fact it exerts more energy to contend with each other in terms of a national polity level. Therefore i think the United States is right by encouraging China's eventual integration of TPP. The TPP will serve as a conduit for Sino-American, Sino-Japanese, Sino-Vietnamese etc --- integration on not just an economical aperture, but also on a security, legislative, political, and social platform. The point is --- the PACIFIC-WIDE Union is the goal.

You see, my friend, there are two contending political ideologies in regards to the Pacific Rim right now: One side is arguing for a bipolar pacific where we have the China on one side and the United States-led side competing against one another for influence and power. Then you have another side that sees bipolarism as inhibitive and conflict-prone; and arguing for a Pan-Pacific Union where China, the United States and all other key players involved cooperating on various parameters. We are seeing, my friend, the paradigm of a China-American Led World Order.

So, the point is --- we will work together. We must work together.

@Viet
 
Nihon bro, if I say our relationship to China being very complicated then it is an understatement. I don´t think we seek confrontation. we have times of cooperations and times of confrontations, and times of cold war state, yes, sometimes colder than the winter in siberia. aside of few exeptions, most of the conflicts were resulted by different strategic interests between the 2 countries. I think we know them very well, and vice versa, they know us in and out. one can say, we both vietnamese and chinese have no secrets.

but one thing I never understand them: in many aspects, Korea share many similarities to the chinese as vietnamese to chinese, from cultures to custom to language. but while China always seeks to swallow Vietnam, she never has intention to integrate Korea into her vast Empire. Why?
 
Nihon bro, if I say our relationship to China being very complicated then it is an understatement. I don´t think we seek confrontation. we have times of cooperations and times of confrontations, and times of cold war state, yes, sometimes colder than the winter in siberia. aside of few exeptions, most of the conflicts were resulted by different strategic interests between the 2 countries. I think we know them very well, and vice versa, they know us in and out. one can say, we both vietnamese and chinese have no secrets.

but one thing I never understand them: in many aspects, Korea share many similarities to the chinese as vietnamese to chinese, from cultures to custom to language. but while China always seeks to swallow Vietnam, she never has intention to integrate Korea into her vast Empire. Why?

Swallowing Korea has never been part of China's millennial goals, Korea has always been a borderland and is the perennial interest of not just China, but Japan. Japan , too , has a millenial interest in Korea and I suppose in the past it was realized in military operations and even completely being subsumed into the Japanese Empire. But in yars past we had seen the paradigm of imperialistic subjugation as it was the norms in that time -- Age of European Imperialism --- but in today's world, we are seeing market imperialism or political inter-cooperability. Empire building no longer is done through militaristic means and such antiquated methodology, but is done so on a cultural and market schema. For example, Korea , which was once an Imperial territory of Japan has in itself "conquered" Japan through her soft power -- Korean pop, Korean drama, Korean culture etc. So you see it is unique.

In regards to Vietnam - China , i think China had always had designs on Vietnam because Vietnam was a southern province. It is unique from Korea in that China never had militarily subjugated Korea or had ruled Korea directly , perhaps only through tributary systems. But Joseon and other Korean kingdoms had their autonomy from China. Prior to Dai Viet becoming an independent entity, for years it was part of the Tianxia. So there is a unique , interesting infatuation for Vietnam in regards to the Chinese context.

I think we know them very well, and vice versa, they know us in and out. one can say, we both vietnamese and chinese have no secrets.

Yes, i think that is a very accurate analysis, buddy. Either way, Vietnam cannot "ignore" China, she is literally bound to China to the hip. Literally and figuratively. For Vietnam --- the eternal link with China is a permanent basis. So long as there will be a China, and so long as there will be a Viet Nam.
 
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@Nihonjin1051 LOL infatuation...Vietnam is not a girl. or it is?

do you remember what I wrote about China-Vietnam relationship some times ago?

China is like an angry man, totally upset because the girl (Vietnam) decides on one day to seek divorce going away. she wants to stay independent enjoying the new freedom in the new world. it is normal if the differences are bigger than commonalities then it is time to quit. despite having a new relationship to a beautiful girl (Pakistan), he can´t forget the good old days. sometimes his angriness loses control, resulting seeking ways to make the life of his former viet girl to hell.

China is like a man that needs help.
 
@Nihonjin1051 LOL infatuation...Vietnam is not a girl. or it is?

do you remember what I wrote about China-Vietnam relationship some times ago?

China is like an angry man, totally upset because the girl (Vietnam) decides one day to seek divorce going away. she wants to stay independent enyjoing the new freedom in the new world. despite having a new relationship to a beautiful girl (Pakistan), he can´t forget the good old days. sometimes his angriness loses control, resulting seeking ways to make the life of his former viet girl to hell.

China is like a man that needs help.

Haha, an interesting symbolism, my friend. Pakistan is definitely a strategic ally of China and cooperation between Islamabad and Beijing serves Beijing's interest in securing her western borders and gives Beijing access to Central Asia and Pakistan as a conduit to that vast region. At the same time Pakistan and China nexus helps to contain the growth of India in the region, so there is a strategic necessity there. That is a different issue.

In regards to Vietnam. Vietnam is unique and the relationship with VIetnam and China is FAR DEEPER on various layers as compared to the Sino-Pakistan paradigm. Pakistan , largely in its history, had limited contacts with China. The two are also culturally and racially different. Vietnam, on the other hand, is part of the Confucian Family, and had been part of TianXia for over a thousand years, and even after independence from China, Viet Nam's independence was given recognition by the Son of Heaven (The Emperor of China) through tributary system adoption. So let's remember that.

VIetnam has always been part of China's orbit, for most of Vietnam's 2 thousand year history. So I suppose that is important to maintain that, in context to Chinese designs. And to be honest with you, my friend, Vietnam has more relation and similarity to China than the rest of Southeast Asia.

Culturally, linguistically, and even ethnically (phenotype) speaking --- yes. I think so.

@Nihonjin1051 LOL infatuation...Vietnam is not a girl. or it is?

Vietnam has always been the prize or source of interest of Great Powers.

  1. Chinese
  2. Mongols
  3. French
  4. Americans
  5. Japanese
  6. Russians
;)
 
You know I have been the biggest proponents of integration with China. I do not see Chinese integration as a bad thing because the Chinese people and Chinese society, as a whole, is actually progressive-focused, and at the same time I value their pro-trade, pro-research, pro-family, pro-harmony stance on a whole. In fact that has been the case in China's nearly 5000 years of existence as a nation state. I see a union of China and Japan as a good thing, and an eventuality if we consider the trends in forming supranational pacts.

Yes when you mention Vietnamese being pragmatic, we should also understand that we all , Japanese and Vietnamese, must remain also REALISTIC. Both our countries , Japan and Vietnam, cannot escape or ignore China because simply the fact that China is geographically located in our immediate zones. Vietnam more since your country and your people share a land border with China and the Chinese, so there is literally a physical link there. I should also say a cultural one since Vietnam is, by all intents and purposes and i mean no disrepsect when I say this, but the "New China" of Southeast Asia. And you know this to be true. In fact Vietnamese society and Vietnamese people are very similar to Chinese , go to any Vietnamese Town in the United States, go to any Vietnamse market or restaurant, and its almost , practically, similar to the Chinese version. So back to my point: Vietnam-China and Japan-China will inextricably linked together due to our shared geography, shared history, shared culture, shared future.

It therefore serves us no future to ignore this fact, in fact it exerts more energy to contend with each other in terms of a national polity level. Therefore i think the United States is right by encouraging China's eventual integration of TPP. The TPP will serve as a conduit for Sino-American, Sino-Japanese, Sino-Vietnamese etc --- integration on not just an economical aperture, but also on a security, legislative, political, and social platform. The point is --- the PACIFIC-WIDE Union is the goal.

You see, my friend, there are two contending political ideologies in regards to the Pacific Rim right now: One side is arguing for a bipolar pacific where we have the China on one side and the United States-led side competing against one another for influence and power. Then you have another side that sees bipolarism as inhibitive and conflict-prone; and arguing for a Pan-Pacific Union where China, the United States and all other key players involved cooperating on various parameters. We are seeing, my friend, the paradigm of a China-American Led World Order.

So, the point is --- we will work together. We must work together.

@Viet
Wow, thats why I never think you are real JPese, time to show your true flag, cheap boy :)
 
Wow, thats why I never think you are real JPese, time to show your true flag, cheap boy :)


So you are angry at me because i'm giving an objective analysis in regards to China (or as you would refer to as "invader") ? come on vietnam bro...why are you so spicy to me? :(
 
So you are angry at me because i'm giving an objective analysis in regards to China (or as you would refer to as "invader") ? come on vietnam bro...why are you so spicy to me? :(
All JPese in VN know VN is the most anti-China nation in the world. Im not angry with you, just think you are so cheap even on internet.
 
All JPese in VN know VN is the most anti-China nation in the world. Im not angry with you, just think you are so cheap even on internet.

I don't think all Vietnamese people are "anti-china" i think Most Vietnamese are just patriotic and will not stand to any nation that jeapordizes Vietnamese sovereignty. Be it Chinese, Lao, Khmer, Thai or American interlopers. And i'm just trying to give the member @Viet my view on how China and Vietnam can get through their current impasse. It is an analysis of the situation. Perhaps you can join us in discussion instead of making a hurtful and defaming label of me being "cheap".

You don't have to resort to personal attack just because what i say may not tickle your fancy. No need for that, bro. If you know from my interaction with you, i always try to show you the best respect i can. Even when i don't agree with your very nationalistic sentimental views, i don't say negative words to you, i just resort to " LOOOOOL " , "OOOOKAY, LOOOL".

So please, cool it down. Okay? Please don't be too spicy with me. Maybe we can eat some pho tai pho dac biet. Let's de-pressurize, okay?


Thanks. Chau Chau!
 
I don't think all Vietnamese people are "anti-china" i think Most Vietnamese are just patriotic and will not stand to any nation that jeapordizes Vietnamese sovereignty. Be it Chinese, Lao, Khmer, Thai or American interlopers. And i'm just trying to give the member @Viet my view on how China and Vietnam can get through their current impasse. It is an analysis of the situation. Perhaps you can join us in discussion instead of making a hurtful and defaming label of me being "cheap".

You don't have to resort to personal attack just because what i say may not tickle your fancy. No need for that, bro. If you know from my interaction with you, i always try to show you the best respect i can. Even when i don't agree with your very nationalistic sentimental views, i don't say negative words to you, i just resort to " LOOOOOL " , "OOOOKAY, LOOOL".

So please, cool it down. Okay? Please don't be too spicy with me. Maybe we can eat some pho tai pho dac biet. Let's de-pressurize, okay?


Thanks. Chau Chau!
We know what to do with the invader, if you are real JPese, then try to free yourself from loss in TPP and Okinawa first. Dont use your cheap idea to apply to VNese.
 
We know what to do with the invader, if you are real JPese, then try to free yourself from loss in TPP and Okinawa first. Dont use your cheap idea to apply to VNese.

MMMooooOoOoOkayyyyYYYY.....LOOOOOOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:lol::lol::lol::suicide:



Are you actually being serious or are you laughing and joking as you speak? I really hope you're just kidding with me!
 
MMMooooOoOoOkayyyyYYYY.....LOOOOOOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
:lol::lol::lol::suicide:



Are you actually being serious or are you laughing and joking as you speak? I really hope you're just kidding with me!
No no, Im quite happy after taking a good massage now. I hope you wont drag VN in you so called 'integrating idea' next time
 
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